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Markdown WYSIWYG support plz?


saileshpanchal

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Please add this -- I write most of my serious Evernote postings now in Markable, because I don't have the patience to point&click constantly to format text, or to highlight and choose a monospace font off the dropdown menu instead of using standard markdown syntax. Also there's no sensible way to create links in Evernote. Full markdown support is the single most important improvement I could hope for from Evernote.

This is the way I do it too, using an external editor to do the md formatting and then pasting it into Evernote when I'm done. Would be nice to have it inside the app. The nice thing about markdown is that it doesn't even have to be visible to anyone who doesn't want to use it.

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This nonsense about bags and socks is really childish.

 

Do you honestly think that the same people who are re-writing the editor are also involved in the Market?

 

As it stands at the moment, it looks like they aren't going to support Markdown - it's not really surprising, I wonder how many of the 100m+ users even know what Markdown is.

 

Yes, if you are a bit techie then you are probably very familiar with it, but the average Joe is I am sure blissfully unaware.

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Caveat is that this process is all plain text; no formatting allowed.

Evernote has given no indication it is going to implement plain text anytime soon. Sorry—to you and me and others.

I don't understand how your comment relates to my post at all. The third-party program QuickCursor only deals with plain text because it is designed to open a text editor, let you edit, then send the edits back to the originating application (Evernote in this case). But you can still use it with Evernote - their lack of a plain text option in EN is irrelevant. QuickCursor still copies out the contents of the note and sends it to a text editor just fine.

The point of my caveat was that if you have a note with formatting (say bullets, bolding, etc), and use QuickCursor to open it in an editor like WriteRoom, make changes, and then send it back to EN, the formatting will be removed. So this solution for a full-screen, distraction free writing environment within EN is not useful for editing notes with formatting in them.

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Please add this -- I write most of my serious Evernote postings now in Markable, because I don't have the patience to point&click constantly to format text, or to highlight and choose a monospace font off the dropdown menu instead of using standard markdown syntax. Also there's no sensible way to create links in Evernote. Full markdown support is the single most important improvement I could hope for from Evernote.

This is the way I do it too, using an external editor to do the md formatting and then pasting it into Evernote when I'm done. Would be nice to have it inside the app. The nice thing about markdown is that it doesn't even have to be visible to anyone who doesn't want to use it.

Hi. Welcome to the forums.

I usually write my notes in Markdown, and when I want to see them formatted, I paste them into something, and then back into Evernote as well. It is unwieldy and far from ideal, but it works. It would be great if (like other apps) we could just press a shortcut key like CTRL + CMD + p (Mac) and see the page formatted nicely. Like you said, it would be there for the folks who want it, but hidden from those who are not interested in it.

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In addition to what Jefito & Metrodon said, there are only so many things any one or any company can do & do well. The forum is filled with dozens & dozens of feature requests. EN must make decisions about what they will add & what they will not add (for whatever reason). Then the items they have decided to add must be prioritized & some of those features should sync & work across all the clients. IE, highlighting, reminders, shortcuts, etc. So there are always going to be those who are disappointed that their particular feature request is not granted. It appears that those who want markdown will have to wallow in their disappointment along with those wanting nested notebooks & a Linux client.

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I have never posted in this forum before, but wanted to pop in to voice support for Markdown within Evernote.

 

I realize Evernote does all kinds of fancy rich text editing and HTML-based formatting in the background, but I wonder whether this is more than is necessary. At it's core, what is Evernote? A note-taking app. So why do I care about picking between umpteen different fonts and text sizes within my notes?

 

Even the new "reminders" feature strikes me as strange. It's like Evernote is trying to make itself into a swiss army knife. I don't expect my note-taking app to remind me to pick up groceries. That's what I have a to do list for. And I don't expect to format each note different than the rest. If I need to style a document, that's what a word processing or document publishing apps are for.

 

But I digress. I guess what I'm trying to say is this: Evernote would do well to focus their app on its core competency rather than trying to be all things to all people.

 

If I could, I would switch off different formatting for different notes in Evernote. I want consistency across my notes. And I feel markdown would supply the minimal formatting necessary to make special writing elements like lists, quotes, code, and tables coherent within the unified look and feel.

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The thing is, at least for the way I work, this *does* allow writing Markdown.  When I open the attachment, up pops FoldingText where I can make my changes in a Markdown editor I like, and when I save the document in FoldingText the attachment in Evernote automatically updates.

By this I understand that there's a file association of Markdown files and a Markdown editor? Is that via file extension, or some OS attribute? I'm not particularly Mac-savvy, so that's all good information for the discussion. Unfortunately, that still leaves Markdown in somewhat the same situation as LaTex.
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By this I understand that there's a file association of Markdown files and a Markdown editor? Is that via file extension, or some OS attribute? I'm not particularly Mac-savvy, so that's all good information for the discussion. Unfortunately, that still leaves Markdown in somewhat the same situation as LaTex.

 

 

I believe it's via the OS's usual extension-to-application mappings.  When I open a `.md` file it opens with the same application that's the default when I double-click a `.md` file in the Finder.  Similarly, the `Open With` submenu contains the same list of Markdown-supporting applications as the Finder.

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 At it's core, what is Evernote? A note-taking app. 

 

No, not really. At it's core, according to Evernote itself, it's a database for storing and retrieving information from multiple platforms. The note taking is kind of an extra bonus. I believe they excel at their core competency to "Remember everything." I do agree with you, though that the reminders feature seems to be drifting away from its core function.  

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By this I understand that there's a file association of Markdown files and a Markdown editor? Is that via file extension, or some OS attribute? I'm not particularly Mac-savvy, so that's all good information for the discussion. Unfortunately, that still leaves Markdown in somewhat the same situation as LaTex.

 

 

I believe it's via the OS's usual extension-to-application mappings.  When I open a `.md` file it opens with the same application that's the default when I double-click a `.md` file in the Finder.  Similarly, the `Open With` submenu contains the same list of Markdown-supporting applications as the Finder.

 

OK, so pretty similar to Windows and other OS's. No great surprise there, but good to get the verification. Thanks.

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Funny - I was just thinking about this and wanting the same feature. Glad I found this thread before posting.

Second Gear has two excellent apps for iOS that both now support Markdown - Markdown Mail and Elements. Elements allows you to create notes using the Markdown syntax, save them as Markdown files, and preview them in-app. It's pretty brilliant. It would be great for notes created in Evernote mobile clients or e-mails that are sent with Markdown syntax to be automatically rendered in Evernote. This would be a great way around the lack of rich text support in iOS, rather than trying to build something yourself.

In the meantime, Markdown Mail is a good workaround for people that want to compose notes with formatting. You can use it to write your note, preview it, and then send it as an HTML message to Evernote. You will however, obviously not be able to edit it in the iOS client without losing formatting.

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I would suggest:

 

  1. Add a "render as" combo list (drop down) to the client (i.e. select "render as Github flavored Markdown").
  2. Add a "edit in external editor" button (i.e. "edit in Vim").
  3. Profit by making your hardcore (and loyal) users happy.

 

Alternatively:

 

  1. Wait until some enterprising full-stack developer and designer combo pair up to build your clone promoted via Kickstarter.

 

It certainly won't be me; I'm happy with my day job and I know how much work this would be. That said, how long until some hungry and talented team catches on?

 

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I have to agree with jemostrom above -- I couldn't care less about Evernote's support of Markdown attachments. Markdown is not a display format, it's a writing format. I don't want to attach "Markdown" documents (if I did, they'd be in a display format). I want to be able to write notes using Markdown syntax instead of Evernote's dreadful formatting options.

 

I think Evernote has officially indicated their uninterest in this feature (apparently, producing $30 water bottles is more in line with their increasingly incomprehensible product vision) so I've long since given up and no longer write in Evernote. I use the Byword markdown editor, which allows automatic publishing to Evernote. It's not ideal, but it's usable, unlike Evernote's ridiculous interface. 

 

Given that Evernote doesn't seem to understand the concept of "writing" (beyond something they can use to sell you stupid notebooks, pens, postits, etc), I would rather see this implemented via the API, by a developer who cares about words. 

 

$30 water bottles ... LOL :)

 

Given that Evernote still doesn't support the most basic of styles (H1, H2, H3, Body), the fact that Simplify Formatting and Clear Formatting clear the whole note and not just selected text, and bullets don't work with any reliability, I have given up on Evernote handling basic text let along Markdown. Byword seems like a great tool but the cost is prohibitive since I use multiple environments and it lacks a Windows version for times when I'm in that world. I'm still using Markdown though.

 

My solution bypasses Evernote. I use Dropbox with a Markdown-savvy tool to view a formatted version (to make my visual brain happy) for each platform I use. Markdown and Dropbox give me portability across environments. Not as nice as an Evernote solution could be, and I can't get an overpriced water bottle, but it works everywhere I need it to be and it is available now.  

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Evernote would do well to focus their app on its core competency rather than trying to be all things to all people.... And I feel markdown would supply the minimal formatting necessary to make special writing elements like lists, quotes, code, and tables coherent within the unified look and feel.

 

Digittrance, I think you nailed it.

 

I've found myself opening Evernote less-and-less after the big redesign and find it increasingly more cumbersome to use since they packed it "full of features".  It doesn't do reminders, tasks, etc, anywhere close to as concisely as competing tools, and in the meantime has gotten progressively less able at being a note-taking tool.  I stuck with Evernote a long time, but they seem to be going down the Yahoo route where they're trying to be everything for everyone and in the process just becoming mediocre, which is a bummer.  Hope they correct course...

 

+1 for markdown...  :)

 

 

I disagree with both of you, I think you're engaging in a false equivalency argument that is made too often about software.  I don't think EN is even close to attempting to be all things to all people.  Just the opposite, they seem to routinely refuse to implement fairly standard functionality.  So instead of arguing they need to do less so you can get the feature you want, you should be arguing they do more so you get the feature you want :D.

 

Personally, the reason I simultaneously love and hate EN is precisely because they are so good at some things and so limited at other things, things that a lot of software makes easy.  The result is that like many users I find myself constantly trying to employ overly complex workarounds to achieve something that in my mind should be pretty straightforward.

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+1 for Markdown support.

 

Might I suggest that markdown and its variants can happily replace 90% of what folks do in the average wordprocessor? This means your text is liberated from proprietary formats (although having said that EN is a proprietary format!). The real benefit of Markdown is that is can be converted into just about any format needed easily. As markdown is plain text it would also reduce the file size considerably from RTF.

 

My suggestion for markdown implementation would be similar to many ios apps that show the markdown syntax in grey and immediately render the formatting. The only area that seems to be problematic are links. It would be useful to show them rendered and allow editing via the menu or shortcut key (command+K). Although I'm sure many have better suggestions. IAwriter and Byword on ios have great markdown rendering whilst typing imho.

 

As a side note I don't find EN bloated or overly complex or trying to be all things to all men. There a very few features I do not use apart from some of the formatting as I mainly use plain text and markdown. The great strength of EN for me is that it's a place for everything. Proprietary format files, images, audio, email, web clippings and of course text. If I was using text alone I'd probably go with a wiki, but with EN I essentially need to use very few other apps. I can interlink my info create indexes, use it for GTD and can get everything easily in and easily out. What's not to like? Information no longer comes to me in text only so I need something that caters for that and for my context it beats Devonthink and others. The premium search is awesome! Where others see the subscription and cloud as a problem, for my it provides flexibility and backup. I can as easily get at my info on my iphone or ipad as with my macbook air.

 

Sorry for the digression.

 

Appreciate the post; it just seems that Evernote's efforts on its flagship product are being diluted with their efforts on all of their other products: http://evernote.com/products/

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I'm fairly confident that markdown won't make it into Evernote in the short to medium term. The Evernote team have to look at their user base and figure out which features give them the most 'bang for bucks". Given that last i heard there were 34 million users and that a fairly small group would find markdown useful, it makes it hard to justify adding it across all the platforms.

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+1 multimarkdown support - especially now that I've discovered http://www.postach.io as a blogging platform that integrates with EN and supports markdown.

I think it has got to be implemented well, though. Personally, I like how VoodooPad and nvALT handle it -- notes in plain text on one side and html version on the other. Press ctrl + cmd + p and it displays the html. Press it again and it closes. Simple, right?

What about tabs, though? I am not sure how that will work, because Evernote doesn't recognize tabs as a plain text note would. I think there are lots of other nice things that plain text programs do. If Evernote could incorporate those WITH the markup, then this would work beautifully.

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I don't think EN is even close to attempting to be all things to all people.  Just the opposite, they seem to routinely refuse to implement fairly standard functionality.  So instead of arguing they need to do less so you can get the feature you want, you should be arguing they do more so you get the feature you want :D.

 

 

Personally, the reason I simultaneously love and hate EN is precisely because they are so good at some things and so limited at other things, things that a lot of software makes easy.  The result is that like many users I find myself constantly trying to employ overly complex workarounds to achieve something that in my mind should be pretty straightforward.

 

 

I think I agree with you, in the sense that Evernote is not trying to do "too much." They're just doing the wrong things. They spend lots of effort on "improvements" that are either pathetically broken (reminders), duplicative of much more advanced services (reminders again) or trivial attempts to replicate features for casual users who won't ever pay (Food, Hello). Meanwhile, they ignore core improvements to the note-taking functionality, which is what serious users like me are paying for. 

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I think I agree with you, in the sense that Evernote is not trying to do "too much." They're just doing the wrong things. They spend lots of effort on "improvements" that are either pathetically broken (reminders), duplicative of much more advanced services (reminders again) or trivial attempts to replicate features for casual users who won't ever pay (Food, Hello). Meanwhile, they ignore core improvements to the note-taking functionality, which is what serious users like me are paying for. 

 

 

Could not agree more.  I did see a comment from one of the EN employees that the new Windows beta client is the "basis for a lot of new functionality going forward".  I can no longer get my hopes up after seeing so many requests ignored for so long, because if anything the new client only seems to show a huge amount of time spent on a redesign that no one asked for while offering next to 0 new useful features, but it did give me the faintest glimmer of hope that maybe some of these other things are in the pike.

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I'm fairly confident that markdown won't make it into Evernote in the short to medium term. The Evernote team have to look at their user base and figure out which features give them the most 'bang for bucks". Given that last i heard there were 34 million users and that a fairly small group would find markdown useful, it makes it hard to justify adding it across all the platforms.

Yep. I use Markdown and like it a lot, and would like to see it too. However, I have to admit that it is probably not widespread, and we have to think of features that will be used by hundreds of thousands, or millions of people. Any less than that, and it is a waste of resources.

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I think there is a mix up here between two things:

  • The functionality of using markdown (or plain text file - if we get one we get the other)
  • The format used to store the notes

I don't see how Markdown and plain text are equivalent. Sure, Markup is done using plain text (so is HTML), but that's not what it represents. You don't get Markdown automatically if you have plain text (ask my text editor). It has to be interpreted. You can store Markdown and HTML in a note already. Is that what's wanted? I don't think so, but what you (and maybe GM) are asking for isn't actually all that clear to me. Not that it matters -- it needs to be clear to Evernote, though.

 

(2) is something else and probably only of interest to developers of programs that uses the API. But I opened an enml file and took a quick look (no I didn't read the docs :) ) and from what I can see it's an XML file ... which means that it just a matter of defining what you want to store and create a definition of how it should look like. To me it looks like Evernote stores one note per enml file with one content node per file. The content seem to be a note node with some attributes and then HTML code in the text node. So storing plain text here shouldn't be a problem (displaying it is another thing).

ENML Format: XHTML subset, with augmentation. See http://dev.evernote.com/doc/articles/enml.php.

More than one note can be stored per file (easy enough to do, at least in the Windows client, and probably the Mac. Select some notes and export them -- they'll come out as one file.

 

So I'm pretty sure that it isn't a technical issue that has prevented us from seeing markdown support in Evernote, but a design decision - which might change over time.

I believe it's a practical decision, based on technical reasons. See, e.g., post #5 in this topic: http://discussion.evernote.com/topic/33759-markdown-wysiwyg-support-plz/?p=40681, post #14 http://discussion.evernote.com/topic/33759-markdown-wysiwyg-support-plz/?p=64718 and so on. They can't provide a full editing experience with Markdown, so it's unlikely to happen. That could change, I do understand.

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I think I agree with you, in the sense that Evernote is not trying to do "too much." They're just doing the wrong things. They spend lots of effort on "improvements" that are either pathetically broken (reminders), duplicative of much more advanced services (reminders again) or trivial attempts to replicate features for casual users who won't ever pay (Food, Hello). Meanwhile, they ignore core improvements to the note-taking functionality, which is what serious users like me are paying for.

 

Could not agree more.  I did see a comment from one of the EN employees that the new Windows beta client is the "basis for a lot of new functionality going forward".  I can no longer get my hopes up after seeing so many requests ignored for so long, because if anything the new client only seems to show a huge amount of time spent on a redesign that no one asked for while offering next to 0 new useful features, but it did give me the faintest glimmer of hope that maybe some of these other things are in the pike.

I agree that there is a lot of stuff I want to see done in the app. However, I also think they are moving forward with features that users have requested and need. The disjunction between joined and owned notebooks made sharing pretty useless until they remedied that in Fall 2012. In Winter 2013 they added Business, which I am sure has made a huge difference for some users, and will mean a new income stream. In Spring 2013 they added 2FA, Reminders, and Highlighters (coming shortly to Windows), which were long-requested items. I know there is a lot more they have done, but these are some of the big ones that I think have really improved the app. Think back to this time last year, and it is pretty clear that we have advanced leaps and bounds.

Again, I want to stress that there is a lot more I want to see as well. I regularly post here on the forums and bug the developers about the bugs, so they know what they are. I won't list everything here in this thread, because I don't want to take it off topic.

As far as markdown goes, as a heavy user of markdown (almost all of my notes), it would make a huge difference for me if I could have markdown support in the app. However, let's face it -- markdown isn't "mainstream." Sure, a lot of people use it, but ask your parents if they know what it is. Ask any student in school if they know what it is. Chances are, they have no idea. That's because it is still (in my opinion) a little bit of a niche feature.

Of course, I'd prefer markdown support over any number of other Evernote things, but that's because I have different priorities than the developers do. It's not that they are doing the "wrong" things. They just aren't doing all the things we want. Maybe we have to convince them that it would be worth the effort. I'm not sure how to do that, though. Perhaps, if they saw some specifics about use cases (not just +1 markdown, but actual explanations of how it would be used and the difference it would make), then that would help convince the teams that it is worth the effort.

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I agree that there is a lot of stuff I want to see done in the app. However, I also think they are moving forward with features that users have requested and need. The disjunction between joined and owned notebooks made sharing pretty useless until they remedied that in Fall 2012. In Winter 2013 they added Business, which I am sure has made a huge difference for some users, and will mean a new income stream. In Spring 2013 they added 2FA, Reminders, and Highlighters (coming shortly to Windows), which were long-requested items. I know there is a lot more they have done, but these are some of the big ones that I think have really improved the app. Think back to this time last year, and it is pretty clear that we have advanced leaps and bounds.

Again, I want to stress that there is a lot more I want to see as well. I regularly post here on the forums and bug the developers about the bugs, so they know what they are. I won't list everything here in this thread, because I don't want to take it off topic.

As far as markdown goes, as a heavy user of markdown (almost all of my notes), it would make a huge difference for me if I could have markdown support in the app. However, let's face it -- markdown isn't "mainstream." Sure, a lot of people use it, but ask your parents if they know what it is. Ask any student in school if they know what it is. Chances are, they have no idea. That's because it is still (in my opinion) a little bit of a niche feature.

Of course, I'd prefer markdown support over any number of other Evernote things, but that's because I have different priorities than the developers do. It's not that they are doing the "wrong" things. They just aren't doing all the things we want. Maybe we have to convince them that it would be worth the effort. I'm not sure how to do that, though. Perhaps, if they saw some specifics about use cases (not just +1 markdown, but actual explanations of how it would be used and the difference it would make), then that would help convince the teams that it is worth the effort.

 

 

My comments were about things over all.   Mark down is one small feature, and it's absolutely a geek feature that a very small subset of users will use, so I can understand them not making that a priority (though there is also nothing wrong with occasionally adding features for your power users).  Instead let's use the latest 5.0 beta as an example.  EN makes a huge deal out of it in their videos, says it's a complete re-imagining of the software or similar marketing speak.  As a power user, did you find ONE single new useful feature in it that excited you?  I didn't.  All I found was a new design that makes it unpleasant to use, my personal and business notebooks mixed together, so now it looks like we're going to have to drop the already half featured business product if they implement that, and a bunch of insignificant design changes like moving shortcuts to the side where users now have to scroll to get to them.

 

Let's just say that when a company brings out what is supposed to be a major new release, I'd hope to find maybe ONE really cool new feature that makes me enjoy using it more?  Or some of the features users have been asking for forever?  Instead they are now taking away features to help me "focus on what's most important to me" (more market speak).

 

Don't get me wrong, EN is an amazing product.  But right now I have no excitement or hope that they are bringing our cool new features.  Just the opposite, I'm actually worrying they are going to take away much needed features.

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Evernote has a user base of 40+ million and growing. Markdown is a nerd friendly way of writing (I write this as a bit of a nerd myself), implementing a new editor across multiple platforms to satisfy a tiny percentage of the user base strikes me as being so unlikely as to assume that it's never ever going to happen.

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I think there is a mix up here between two things:

  •  
  • The functionality of using markdown (or plain text file - if we get one we get the other)
  • The format used to store the notes

I don't see how Markdown and plain text are equivalent. Sure, Markup is done using plain text (so is HTML), but that's not what it represents. You don't get Markdown automatically if you have plain text (ask my text editor). It has to be interpreted. You can store Markdown and HTML in a note already. Is that what's wanted? I don't think so, but what you (and maybe GM) are asking for isn't actually all that clear to me. Not that it matters -- it needs to be clear to Evernote, though.

 

(2) is something else and probably only of interest to developers of programs that uses the API. But I opened an enml file and took a quick look (no I didn't read the docs :) ) and from what I can see it's an XML file ... which means that it just a matter of defining what you want to store and create a definition of how it should look like. To me it looks like Evernote stores one note per enml file with one content node per file. The content seem to be a note node with some attributes and then HTML code in the text node. So storing plain text here shouldn't be a problem (displaying it is another thing).

ENML Format: XHTML subset, with augmentation. See http://dev.evernote.com/doc/articles/enml.php.

More than one note can be stored per file (easy enough to do, at least in the Windows client, and probably the Mac. Select some notes and export them -- they'll come out as one file.

 

So I'm pretty sure that it isn't a technical issue that has prevented us from seeing markdown support in Evernote, but a design decision - which might change over time.

I believe it's a practical decision, based on technical reasons. See, e.g., post #5 in this topic: http://discussion.evernote.com/topic/33759-markdown-wysiwyg-support-plz/?p=40681, post #14 http://discussion.evernote.com/topic/33759-markdown-wysiwyg-support-plz/?p=64718 and so on. They can't provide a full editing experience with Markdown, so it's unlikely to happen. That could change, I do understand.

 

 

I am asking for Evernote to supply a "preview window" of some kind (activated in other programs using Control + Command + P) that would take the content of my note and display it "marked up" as it would look in .html (convert # to <h1>, ## to <h2>, etc.). This would require no changes to the notes themselves, and if you didn't use any markup in your notes, it would just appear wrong in the preview (naturally). 

 

The plain text thing is something else entirely (in my mind), and we can leave that off the table -- as I mentioned earlier in the thread, I don't see that happening. Basically, to echo what jemostrom said, I want to be able to display Markdown. The format the note is in doesn't have to change.

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I agree that there is a lot of stuff I want to see done in the app. However, I also think they are moving forward with features that users have requested and need. The disjunction between joined and owned notebooks made sharing pretty useless until they remedied that in Fall 2012. In Winter 2013 they added Business, which I am sure has made a huge difference for some users, and will mean a new income stream. In Spring 2013 they added 2FA, Reminders, and Highlighters (coming shortly to Windows), which were long-requested items. I know there is a lot more they have done, but these are some of the big ones that I think have really improved the app. Think back to this time last year, and it is pretty clear that we have advanced leaps and bounds.

Again, I want to stress that there is a lot more I want to see as well. I regularly post here on the forums and bug the developers about the bugs, so they know what they are. I won't list everything here in this thread, because I don't want to take it off topic.

As far as markdown goes, as a heavy user of markdown (almost all of my notes), it would make a huge difference for me if I could have markdown support in the app. However, let's face it -- markdown isn't "mainstream." Sure, a lot of people use it, but ask your parents if they know what it is. Ask any student in school if they know what it is. Chances are, they have no idea. That's because it is still (in my opinion) a little bit of a niche feature.

Of course, I'd prefer markdown support over any number of other Evernote things, but that's because I have different priorities than the developers do. It's not that they are doing the "wrong" things. They just aren't doing all the things we want. Maybe we have to convince them that it would be worth the effort. I'm not sure how to do that, though. Perhaps, if they saw some specifics about use cases (not just +1 markdown, but actual explanations of how it would be used and the difference it would make), then that would help convince the teams that it is worth the effort.

 

My comments were about things over all.   Mark down is one small feature, and it's absolutely a geek feature that a very small subset of users will use, so I can understand them not making that a priority (though there is also nothing wrong with occasionally adding features for your power users).  Instead let's use the latest 5.0 beta as an example.  EN makes a huge deal out of it in their videos, says it's a complete re-imagining of the software or similar marketing speak.  As a power user, did you find ONE single new useful feature in it that excited you?  I didn't.  All I found was a new design that makes it unpleasant to use, my personal and business notebooks mixed together, so now it looks like we're going to have to drop the already half featured business product if they implement that, and a bunch of insignificant design changes like moving shortcuts to the side where users now have to scroll to get to them.

 

Let's just say that when a company brings out what is supposed to be a major new release, I'd hope to find maybe ONE really cool new feature that makes me enjoy using it more?  Instead they are now taking away features to help me "focus on what's most important to me" (more market speak).

 

Don't get me wrong, EN is an amazing product.  But right now I have no excitement or hope that they are bringing our cool new features.  Just the opposite, I'm actually worrying they are going to take away much needed features.

I see. Well, I think you'll want to take those comments to the V5 thread, because this one is about markdown :)

Remember, these apps are coming together in terms of functionality. If you are looking for the shape of things to come for Windows, look no further than the most recent beta for the Mac. At least, that would be my guess.

Are the business and personal notes split up enough for you in the Mac version? Not as much as I would like (I dislike having tags from other people mixed into my tags), but they are OK. I can live with them. I think if you push for that instead of the current Windows implementation (I am a little behind on the betas, so I can't speak with specifics just now), then you can make a compelling case for changes.

There won't likely be markdown in the next Windows update, and I kind of doubt it is on the roadmap for Mac. After ETC we might get some sense of what new stuff is in the offing. My advice would be to make the most of what you have and try to find a way to work with the features that are disruptive for your use case.

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+1 for Multimarkdown

 

This topic started in 2008 and five years later, people are still requesting it! C'mon Evernote :) 

Just because a feature has been requested does not mean it will be implemented. A lot of users have other feature requests & sometimes my feature request may be mutually exclusive of your feature request. Plus, EN must balance resources as well as priorities. And some feature requests they may simply decide to never implement, for whatever reason.

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I see. Well, I think you'll want to take those comments to the V5 thread, because this one is about markdown :)

 

There won't likely be markdown in the next Windows update, and I kind of doubt it is on the roadmap for Mac. After ETC we might get some sense of what new stuff is in the offing. My advice would be to make the most of what you have and try to find a way to work with the features that are disruptive for your use case.

 

 

Right after you take your previous post that I was responding to, to the other thread :rolleyes:

 

 

 

Are the business and personal notes split up enough for you in the Mac version? Not as much as I would like (I dislike having tags from other people mixed into my tags), but they are OK. I can live with them. I think if you push for that instead of the current Windows implementation (I am a little behind on the betas, so I can't speak with specifics just now), then you can make a compelling case for changes.

 

Spoken like a true evangelist :P.  Why in the world would I want to push for the Windows client to take a step backward and become like the Mac client?  How about just not breaking it!  I simply want them to have a freaking clue about the needs of business users AND for that matter personal users, neither of which seem particularly keen on having their personal notebooks and business notebooks completely mixed together.  Didn't you even acknowledge this in the thread on the issue?  Did your desire to defend overcome your previous clear thinking :P:D.

 

Anyhow, to be clear, I am all for markdown, which is the subject of this thread, I just said I understand them not looking upon it as a priority.  But one would think they would look upon proper formatting, whatever method is used to achieve it, as priority.

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I see. Well, I think you'll want to take those comments to the V5 thread, because this one is about markdown :)

 

There won't likely be markdown in the next Windows update, and I kind of doubt it is on the roadmap for Mac. After ETC we might get some sense of what new stuff is in the offing. My advice would be to make the most of what you have and try to find a way to work with the features that are disruptive for your use case.

 

Right after you take your previous post that I was responding to, to the other thread :rolleyes:

Start a thread about the issues you raise and I'll be happy to discuss all of the stuff you brought up :) Let's leave this thread for markdown.

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+1 for Markdown support.

Markdown is great for entering text (you keep going without having to take your hands of the keyboard) but for reviewing I still prefer formatted text.

What I'd like to see is 2 fold: a toggle mode to put text in Markdown (for continuous typing) or in final formatting mode (for reading or final review) and secondly a setting that shows a selection of the text in Markdown (section being something 10 lines prior and post where I am typing) while the rest is in final formatting mode (for editing text).

Thanks

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My advice would be to make the most of what you have and try to find a way to work with the features that are disruptive for your use case.

 

That's what I've been doing, obviously. But the more time I spend working around Evernote's deficiencies, or using other tools to make up for them, the more I wonder why I'm paying for Evernote at all. If you are right that this trend is going to continue, I doubt I'll be a paid customer for much longer. 

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I see. Well, I think you'll want to take those comments to the V5 thread, because this one is about markdown :)

 

There won't likely be markdown in the next Windows update, and I kind of doubt it is on the roadmap for Mac. After ETC we might get some sense of what new stuff is in the offing. My advice would be to make the most of what you have and try to find a way to work with the features that are disruptive for your use case.

 

Right after you take your previous post that I was responding to, to the other thread :rolleyes:

 

Start a thread about the issues you raise and I'll be happy to discuss all of the stuff you brought up :) Let's leave this thread for markdown.

 

 

Yes, would you do that please, and stop taking this thread off the topic of markdown please?  Thanks a lot.

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I think this is the only way that Markdown is going to be included in Evernote in at least the short to mid-term. Given that Mac v5 was a pretty big overhaul and that markdown support wasn't included in the editor, I can't see it happening for quite a while.

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My advice would be to make the most of what you have and try to find a way to work with the features that are disruptive for your use case.

 

That's what I've been doing, obviously.

 

I bolded the relevant part ;).  As do most of us ;), so it's gets tiring being giving advice like that.

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I've been using Markdown for notes too. For notes that I'm likely to want to edit, I keep them in Dropbox and use Elements, or Nocs on my iPhone. I only keep a static form on Evernote, because of the problems mentioned here, and in many other threads.

It's a bit odd that a hi-tech gadget like the iPhone takes word processing back to the 1980s. Soon we'll be re-living the heady days of the first WYSIWYG software!

Now that Steve Jobs has stepped down, maybe the app store will not be quite as restrictive & perhaps iOS devices will eventually be able to play flash.

Ok, maybe not.

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"Blah, blah, blah. Markdown is not mainstream. Nobody really uses it. Why bother?"

Day One. Mac App Store app of the year, 2012. Supports Markdown.

Sure, it lacks some of Evernote's features, but this is your competition.

I rather doubt EN is shuddering in their boots. But good for those who would like to use it.

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My advice would be to make the most of what you have and try to find a way to work with the features that are disruptive for your use case.

 

That's what I've been doing, obviously. But the more time I spend working around Evernote's deficiencies, or using other tools to make up for them, the more I wonder why I'm paying for Evernote at all. If you are right that this trend is going to continue, I doubt I'll be a paid customer for much longer.

I was replying to ZZZ with that advice. Although I think it applies for all of us, it was not directed specifically at you. In fact, we both seem to have dealt with the lack of Markdown support with similar workarounds.

I am not terribly good at prognostication, and I don't think Evernote has given us enough information to make very educated guesses as to how they feel about Markdown, but I'll take a stab at it and say that Markdown support is unlikely to come if they see it affecting a relatively small percentage of the user base (I am afraid I also think it is not going to be as big as highlighters and reminders), because they have said in the past that they are looking to focus on features that will impact lots of users.

If by "trend" you mean the tendency to support features for the general user over that for power users, then I don't see that changing anytime soon. Personally, I think there is significant overlap between the two kinds of users, and if Markdown were implemented well, it could benefit both. I would encourage Evernote to stop dividing up the user base this way (assuming that they do).

How could such an implementation work? For a long time now I have been advocating for Evernote plug-ins or extensions (like we have for browsers) so that we don't have to use totally different apps just to use features like Markdown. Unfortunately, for Markdown support to work smoothly under the current system, some third party would have to develop an entirely independent app that works similar to the main client, but also has Markdown. I kind of doubt that is on the horizon.

I could imagine someone making an app that renders your notes in Markdown, of course, but to me that wouldn't be a huge step up from the current workflow of copy/pasting into already existing apps. I could be wrong, though. Maybe some developer will figure out an effortless way to make this happen. At any rate, the trend is not towards specialized features like Markdown (in my opinion). I am not an Evernote employee. I am just speaking as a fellow user on the outside looking in.

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I, like many others, find that writing in a syntax like Markdown is both powerful and convenient. It leverages the power of common HTML elements like links, images, and text formatting without the friction of extensive markup. Because it begins as plain text, it is extremely portable and easy to write.

Markdown compiles as valid HTML, and I would love to be able to paste this HTML into an Evernote note and have Evernote render this HTML as if it were created in the native Evernote WYSIWYG. Right now, it just attaches a webpage, which I have to open in Safari, which makes me sad because I like staying in Evernote. Being that Evernote notes are already stored as HTML, it would seem logical that one would be able to drop raw HTML into a note and have it represented as if it had originated in the Evernote WYSIWYG.

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+1 for Markdown support.

 

Might I suggest that markdown and its variants can happily replace 90% of what folks do in the average wordprocessor? This means your text is liberated from proprietary formats (although having said that EN is a proprietary format!). The real benefit of Markdown is that is can be converted into just about any format needed easily. As markdown is plain text it would also reduce the file size considerably from RTF.

 

My suggestion for markdown implementation would be similar to many ios apps that show the markdown syntax in grey and immediately render the formatting. The only area that seems to be problematic are links. It would be useful to show them rendered and allow editing via the menu or shortcut key (command+K). Although I'm sure many have better suggestions. IAwriter and Byword on ios have great markdown rendering whilst typing imho.

 

As a side note I don't find EN bloated or overly complex or trying to be all things to all men. There a very few features I do not use apart from some of the formatting as I mainly use plain text and markdown. The great strength of EN for me is that it's a place for everything. Proprietary format files, images, audio, email, web clippings and of course text. If I was using text alone I'd probably go with a wiki, but with EN I essentially need to use very few other apps. I can interlink my info create indexes, use it for GTD and can get everything easily in and easily out. What's not to like? Information no longer comes to me in text only so I need something that caters for that and for my context it beats Devonthink and others. The premium search is awesome! Where others see the subscription and cloud as a problem, for my it provides flexibility and backup. I can as easily get at my info on my iphone or ipad as with my macbook air.

 

Sorry for the digression.

Lots of good points here. I use Evernote on Windows, Mac, iPhone, and iPad. I use Evernote as my repository for things collected, and I use it to store/develop first drafts of articles. The text tools are inconsistent across the environments and there are bugs. The one glaring need is for paragraph styles in all environments. They are supported in the mobile apps but not the desktop apps. It seems like Markdown can fit right in with styles. The existing Evernote mobile apps support headings, so it seems like HTML heading 1 <H1> and Markdown heading 1 <#> could be handled similarly for those of us who want to work in Markdown then eventually deploy outside of Evernote. With Markdown support, Evernote would be even more amazingly useful! 

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I also like full-screen, distraction free writing apps for focusing when writing longer pieces. I currently use WriteRoom for this on my mac, and I use QuickCursor to open it up right from Evernote. So, for instance, I create my note, click in the body area for the note, and then hit the shortcut I've defined (Shift+Cmd+E). WriteRoom fires up, I type my note, the Cmd+W to close it and everything I wrote goes right back into the EN note.

Caveat is that this process is all plain text; no formatting allowed.

The nice thing is, it is the same process from any other apps that edit text, so I can always bring up a consistent full-screen window for writing from any app, not just EN.

I prefer this over JMicheal's method just because I've set up writeroom with a nice background and font face that I find pleasant to look at while writing. It is a little more flexible in appearance than EN.

I also have ByWord, which I mostly use for mutli-markdown when writing blog posts, but I have sometimes used it for editing EN notes as well.

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was just thinking this same exact thing as I'm in the process of building a massive lifestreaming application. As I have various notes in evernote I'd love to import via the api. I don't think any of the notes will look right by default and trying to structure them in a meaning full way would be difficult. However, I'd be willing to spend the time to go back and transition my notes to markdown, that way when I aggregate that content back to my site they would render properly.

So with that said, Evernote care to respond?

also why isn't there a 'user satisfaction' or 'user voice' plugin for the evernote site. that way the community could vote and push on which features WE want. :)

side-note: I'm a non-paying user, these types of feature though would be the things that would make me convert :)

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+1 for markdown, it would make life so much easier for me if I can use it. Using markdown means I dont have to be annoyed how stuff gets made pretty.

 

I understand that EN does not make its roadmap available but a single response in 5 years? I am a bit disappointed in that.

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Evernote would do well to focus their app on its core competency rather than trying to be all things to all people.... And I feel markdown would supply the minimal formatting necessary to make special writing elements like lists, quotes, code, and tables coherent within the unified look and feel.

 

Digittrance, I think you nailed it.

 

I've found myself opening Evernote less-and-less after the big redesign and find it increasingly more cumbersome to use since they packed it "full of features".  It doesn't do reminders, tasks, etc, anywhere close to as concisely as competing tools, and in the meantime has gotten progressively less able at being a note-taking tool.  I stuck with Evernote a long time, but they seem to be going down the Yahoo route where they're trying to be everything for everyone and in the process just becoming mediocre, which is a bummer.  Hope they correct course...

 

+1 for markdown...  :)

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Funny how this old topic pops up again and again. I would pay to know if/where Markup is on the EN roadmap...

Somewhere in the same vicinity as the support for LaTex and for an Esperanto version, I'd guess.

 

I would hope that Markdown was a little higher on the priority list than LaTex. Seems to me that Markdown has a broader user base due to it's simplicity and spectrum of application. +1 for markdown integration in evernote!!

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As much as I adore Evernote, I'm starting to think about looking for alternatives because of Evernote's lack of Markdown support. My life and most of my work live in Markdown, whether it's in drafts I write in Byword, Journal entries and daily logs in Day One or productivity tools like FoldingText. Evernote is where I keep notes on active and archived projects, reference information and clipped web-pages but I'm finding it increasingly frustrating that there's no good bridge for getting things in Markdown into Evernote easily and cleanly.

My entire workflow would change if Evernote added Markdown support and it would instantly become the most used tool I use instead of being confined to specific areas that I don't need Markdown.

With that said, I totally understand why Evernote wouldn't add Markdown support. The translation to and from ENML would probably be a pain to manage, it may be to specific to power users — particularly those on the Apple side — and might scare or confuse everyone else. Plus they probably want avoid making Evernote more needlessly complex.

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> I don't see how Markdown and plain text are equivalent. Sure, Markup is done using plain text (so is HTML), but that's not what it represents. You don't get Markdown automatically if you have plain text (ask my text editor). It has to be interpreted. You can store Markdown and HTML in a note already. Is that what's wanted? I don't think so

 

This is mixing two things again, storing markdown is the same as storing text which is the same as storing the current HTML content. Like I said above this shouldn't be a problem (you can do it now). The other thing is how, as I said above, to displaying it. Here you have to differ between three different markups:

  • Plain text - already possible
  • HTML - already possible
  • Markdown

It's the last one where I'm a bit different from many others who ask for Markdown support. I have no need for built-in rendering of markdown I'm fine with a plain text display of markdown notes. I just want an efficient way of working with plain text files in Evernote (so in reality I don't need any special markdown support at all). From my experience with other programs (for example VoodooPad, Devonthink), the most efficient way of working with an external editor is to use the ODB Editor protocol (on the Mac).

 

> ENML Format: XHTML subset, with augmentation. See http://dev.evernote.com/doc/articles/enml.php.

> More than one note can be stored per file (easy enough to do, at least in the Windows client, and probably the Mac. Select some notes and export them -- they'll come out as one file.

 

 

Yes, it looks like then the separate notes are stored as XML notes "within" the multinote file ... interesting.

 

 

> I believe it's a practical decision, based on technical reasons. See, e.g., post #5 in this topic: http://discussion.evernote.com/topic/33759-markdown-wysiwyg-support-plz/?p=40681, post #14 http://discussion.evernote.com/topic/33759-markdown-wysiwyg-support-plz/?p=64718 and so on. They can't provide a full editing experience with Markdown, so it's unlikely to happen. That could change, I do understand.

 

 

That I understand and I'm OK with that (others might not like it), as I said above, I just want to use Evernote as a "storage database" for text. Of course, this can be done by any text editor by implementing support for Evernotes API - which is unlikely to happen. However, on the Mac many text editors support the ODB Editor protocol which would mean that if Evernote implemented support for it, these editors would all get the ability to work efficiently with text files (= click a button in Evernote to edit with external editor, when I save in my text editor Evernote sees the changes and updates the note).

 

As for iOS, the text editor would have to implement support for the Evernote API.

 

I'm pretty sure that we will never see support for the ODB Editor protocol for reasons given in a previous post. Some iOS editor might implement support for using Evernote as the storage backend (there are a couple of note takers but I haven't seen a text editor). I haven't seen a Mac text editor that uses the Evernote API (does one exist?).

 

In short, I'll probably never see what I'm looking for ... but I can dream :)

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In reply to the assumptions that markdown isn't used by a lot of folks, I'm a "business guy", and I love markdown. A lot of people find it easier to write blogs or technical materials using markdown than with HTML, so what I really, REALLY was hoping was that I could write my blogs in evernote then transfer them to my blog... but alas, no. I would have to completely re-write everything. I think markdown is for *exactly* evernote's user base. People who don't write code but know how to do _this_.

my 2 cents

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Markdown is a great way to format notes. It is simple, efficient and is a great timesaver.

 

Markdown is used a bunch in the computer engineering world (GitHub & StackOverflow use markdown).

 

And I will note that if I create a simple note from Evernote, pasted it into the VI editor from my Mac or Windows boxes, the result ends up looking very, very close to GitHub-flavored Markdown. Bold and Italic doesn't render correctly, but bulleted lists and numbered lists work great and Task List items (e.g. [ ] in GFM):

testbolditalic[ ]todo[ ]todo2   * Bullet   * Bullet2  1. number list  2. number list2

What does this mean, it means that Evernote is already part way there.

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I think Markdown is the very best to write quickliy.

 

Evernote has a concept, where Markdown fits perfectly.

 

Just a few weeks ago I did not know about Evernote, and now, I can't think of a morning, I won't take a look on my phone first.

 

A few (useful) futures would be great:

 

As said before:

 

- Markdown

 

Write write write.. Don't have to think about clicking on each word you want to have boldface/italic/etc.

 

Don't have to mark every single heading to set it boldface, maybe underlined, greater size, a.s.o.

 

- ToDo-Lists

 

I found a way to use Evernote as my ToDo-List already.. But.. I can explain..

 

1. set a notebook called ToDo

2. move this notebook to a stack called Important (to not have 'alphabetical problems' i called it ###__IMPORTANT__###)

3. added a new notebook to this stack called Seperate/Timed ToDos (to not have hundreds of notes in THE todo-notebook)

4. added note to ToDo called ...yeah not very good... ToDo (Here I have one List)

5. splitted this list into Today/Then/Special Date/One Day In The Very Future/Tasks Done

 

When I have a thing to do on a special date:

 

1. add a note to Seperate/Timed ToDos called e.g. Birthdaypresent for Rob

2. add an entry Birthdaypresent for Rob to my Special Date section in the ToDo-List

3. link the note I made in (1) to the entry I made in (2)

 

... I think you understand what I mean...

 

And this is (in my opinion) one of the easiest ways to 'construct' a ToDo-List...

 

Gentlemen - Theres a lot to do there ;)

 

- Favorites-Section (like in mac app?)

 

Don't know if I am blind, but I did not found a favorite section neither on Android-App and on Win-App.

 

...Thin this is enough atm.

 

Hope I wrote this in the right section here in the Forum!

 

Except of a few things, Evernote rocks! ;)

 

Use it for Private notes, for ToDo-List (maah.. in a very complicated way..), for organizing websites for a acapella-musicgroup, a faculty at university, for work, for journeys ....

 

Keep up the good work and implement a little more ;)

 

Cheers!

wohfab

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I'm not sure whether I'm for or against, but I just read a recent Coding Horror post, and *he's* certainly in favor of Markdown, in general : http://www.codinghor...f-markdown.html.

Yep. Markdown is cool. Unfortunately, even basic elements get parsed "wrong" in one app and "right" in another, so it is in need of standards. I suppose that would be an argument against employing it. W3C may not have made Evernote possible with their web standards (the basis for Evernote's code), but they (probably) made a lot of things easier.

Ultimately, I think we'd all like to get things like CSS support and Markdown support, but I also think this is stuff ideally suited for third-party integrations (some already exist), because the big numbers are in users who can just download the app and get started without having to "learn" a single thing.

and to the point about support and standards... Just make it pluggable so users can extend it or select a markdown "flavor". I'd extend it myself if you opened it up for syntaxes like sublime text.

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It's funny Markdown is seen as a geek feature but what do I know being a geek? :-) ...

 

If you explain Markdown to someone (and it takes 5 minutes) they ought to be able to get it - and it's a hell of a lot simpler than HTML.

 

FWIW I found it very easy last night to automate in Editorial on iPad sending as an email into Evernote, complete with Notebook Name and Title. Now THAT might be geeky. :-)

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@psteinweber Just curious: Do you really have no workarounds at all? Thinking of e.g. Byword on Mac and Editorial on iPad.

 

Martin, At some point it becomes easier to just use the workarounds instead of Evernote. That's a shame. I use Evernote on an iPhone, iPad, Mac, and Windows computer today. I also have to have a text editor workaround on each device. That's a shame. It feel like Evernote has gone out of its way to enhance/fix about everything but its text editor. For example, the new reminders and presentation features are nice, but it would be great to get a little love in the text editor so we can quit looking at workarounds. I love Evernote but the text part of it is painful in places. I'm never going to use Evernote for Presentations, for example, because it's too painful to put the text together. I have to manually format headings, body text, etc. And worse, I have to manually apply the same formats over and over and over and over. Add in a few text handling bugs and it's pretty annoying. 

 

Adding simple styles seems reasonable and Markdown is just one option. I want to use Evernote for collecting and working on article ideas, then when it's time to move a note from Evernote (due to needing some capabilities beyond what Evernote is built for), I want to get the text out of Evernote quickly so I can keep using the text without a bunch of reformatting. 

 

I'm as big of Evernote fan as there is -- I'm a premium member as an act of support (not because I need the extra capacity) -- but with all the workarounds I have in place I'm starting to think my premium $$$ would be better spent on better workaround tools. That's a shame since the text suggestions are basic features available in all of the workaround tools I'm using. 

 

Just sharing my perspective on why things like Markdown are being requested. 

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At a guess, I'd say no, at least in the short term. All notes that go through the API need to be formatted as ENML. If they were to support it internally (i.e. on the other side of the API), that would mean a change to their ENML specification, something that would affect all clients and the server code as well. To support it externally (client-side) would mean there'd need to be translation back-and-forth between Markdown'd text and ENML. I'd wonder about the fidelity of those translations. Also, how well does markdown work in the rich-text editing world? It's an intriguing idea, particularly in the context of their clients that don't support rich editing and plain text could be turned into text that contains formatting code; maybe that would be something that a third-party application could make some hay with?

None of this means that that I think that it couldn't be done -- I'm just wondering about the feasibility of doing it.

~Jeff

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I think Markdown is the very best to write quickliy.

 

Evernote has a concept, where Markdown fits perfectly.

 

Just a few weeks ago I did not know about Evernote, and now, I can't think of a morning, I won't take a look on my phone first.

 

A few (useful) futures would be great:

 

As said before:

 

- Markdown

 

Write write write.. Don't have to think about clicking on each word you want to have boldface/italic/etc.

 

Don't have to mark every single heading to set it boldface, maybe underlined, greater size, a.s.o.

 

- ToDo-Lists

 

I found a way to use Evernote as my ToDo-List already.. But.. I can explain..

 

1. set a notebook called ToDo

2. move this notebook to a stack called Important (to not have 'alphabetical problems' i called it ###__IMPORTANT__###)

3. added a new notebook to this stack called Seperate/Timed ToDos (to not have hundreds of notes in THE todo-notebook)

4. added note to ToDo called ...yeah not very good... ToDo (Here I have one List)

5. splitted this list into Today/Then/Special Date/One Day In The Very Future/Tasks Done

 

When I have a thing to do on a special date:

 

1. add a note to Seperate/Timed ToDos called e.g. Birthdaypresent for Rob

2. add an entry Birthdaypresent for Rob to my Special Date section in the ToDo-List

3. link the note I made in (1) to the entry I made in (2)

 

... I think you understand what I mean...

 

And this is (in my opinion) one of the easiest ways to 'construct' a ToDo-List...

 

Gentlemen - Theres a lot to do there ;)

 

- Favorites-Section (like in mac app?)

 

Don't know if I am blind, but I did not found a favorite section neither on Android-App and on Win-App.

 

...Thin this is enough atm.

 

Hope I wrote this in the right section here in the Forum!

 

Except of a few things, Evernote rocks! ;)

 

Use it for Private notes, for ToDo-List (maah.. in a very complicated way..), for organizing websites for a acapella-musicgroup, a faculty at university, for work, for journeys ....

 

Keep up the good work and implement a little more ;)

 

Cheers!

wohfab

 

+1 for the suggestion

 

+2 for the excellent explanation / use case

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Please folks, don't mix two discussions here. The markdown feature is too important as we should mix it with a merchandising thread… although we should start it at some other  place… will be fun  ;)

 

Back to topic. 

 

As I wrote earlier in this discussion, I don't believe the EN guys will ever implement this markdown feature. I also checked the public beta of 5.6.0 of the new Mac version. And since there is no feedback from the EN folks here, we had to move on.

 

As Mike Korner wrote, in the meantime we also did established a different workflow. But since I can't trust Dropbox, we installed a Git on our server and created a special repository for some stuff. If you think Git is too techie, please know even our assistants are working with that, using a tool like Gitbox for checking in and out. So we are creating and maintaining our files in all formats we need - we're not using just Markdown, but also AsciiDoc for our documentation. The files were created with the writing tools of our choice, every employee has its own favorite (BBEdit, Ulysses, Textedit etc). With Git we do have not only the perfect synchronization, but also the best version comparison (which is another weakness of EN, see this thread). Later, when a version of the file is finished, it will be exported and embedded as a final version into Evernote. The target format depends on the later usage of the file. Unfortunately we can not use EN for sending out PDFs to our customers because of this issue) - so, most notes are in RTF and HTML format.

 

Ok, I just realized that I also mix discussions here (adding the versioning and mailing issue). But please understand this only as an additional description to explain what and why we're doing this and that.

 

You may realized our main use of EN is now only to store files. Changes in EN notes are very rare. I just stick to EN because of this blog post of Phil Libin. After he promised to increase the quality, I decided to give him another year (maybe a little more) to work on the tool.

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It's funny Markdown is seen as a geek feature but what do I know being a geek? :-) ...

 

If you explain Markdown to someone (and it takes 5 minutes) they ought to be able to get it - and it's a hell of a lot simpler than HTML.

 

FWIW I found it very easy last night to automate in Editorial on iPad sending as an email into Evernote, complete with Notebook Name and Title. Now THAT might be geeky. :-)

 

There are many levels of geekiness out there! I have ranked some of the apps I use on a nerdiness scale (http://www.christopher-mayo.com/?p=51). I think the problem here is that you even want to use plain text at all -- this is where the fact that you have cultivated your geekiness / nerdiness becomes apparent.

 

In my opinion, Evernote is no Angry Birds, and if you even have Evernote on your devices, you probably have a little bit of geek or nerd in you. It is cultivating it to the extent that you desire markdown that really increases your geek/nerd cred.

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One of the nice things about plain text - which is about half of the case for Markdown - is it's readily easy to generate.

 

Now, I haven't ever generated Markdown from a program. But I feel I just might. And one of the nice things about Editorial is that it could do just that. (For example nice footnote management.) And it could do it within the app itself. So this might be my first stab at it.

 

I was just thinking about the Markdown "star for list item" thing: If someone complains about it as introducing strange markup I'd ask "would you rather it were a dot or some other fake bullet character?" It seems to me we use markup in lots of places (I saw a teleprompter with the speaker's name in brackets this morning, for instance) so the barrier to entry is low.

 

But I digress: The currency here is getting it into Evernote, not whether Markdown is a great idea. But it being close to natural is a part of it.

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"Blah, blah, blah. Markdown is not mainstream. Nobody really uses it. Why bother?"

I don't think that that's what's coming from Evernote. It's more a matter of what they consider high priority, I'd guess.

Day One. Mac App Store app of the year, 2012. Supports Markdown.

Question is, is Markdown support what made it the Mac App Store App of the Year? Or some other feature set?

Sure, it lacks some of Evernote's features, but this is your competition.

Problem is, no Day One for Android. No Day One for Windows. So, competition of a sort, but not on all fronts.

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The subthread about writing tools and their relationship to Evernote is interesting. For me, when writing (usually blog posts) Evernote might be an eventual DESTINATION. More likely I'll use M(ultim)arkdown to write and I probable won't store the resulting HTML in Evernote: There's just too much work (i.e. any) :-) in getting the results into Evernote.

 

So Evernote isn't central to my writing apart, perhaps, from research. But I'd like it to be the place I store my work-in-progress Markdown. So "round tripping" is an important part of this.

 

And the reasons for preferring Markdown to authoring direct in Evernote are manifold but usually centre around 1) ease of use, 2) tooling on iOS and OSX (and distantly Linux).

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I'm struggling with making the full-fledged payed-user switch to using EN, due entirely to the clunky editor.

I don't blame EN for making a clunky GUI editor. Its hard. Fonts switch when I hit return, links break or won't break when I want them too. I can't figure out how to add a new column or row to a table. And these don't seem like easy things to fix, to me.

I would really prefer some wiki markup language. Any flavor, I don't care which. I will learn it.

I also need some basic text formatters, for rendering snippets of C, java, and latex so they look pretty. I often work to make some overly complicated grep pattern or something, and think "hey, I'd like to throw this into my external brain, tag it, and recall it later" but then I'm struggling with it displaying in Helvetica extra small, and now somehow the period turned into a link to something, and (omg) it seems easier to just write this code snippet on my whiteboard and then take a picture of it. Yikes!

I realize rich text allows lots of fancy looking things to be pasted into EN and "look correct." I don't expect a way to take arbitrary things that are pasted and convert it into some wiki markup language. I just want the option to type in a nice monospaced font and, with a wink and a nod, have EN display it properly when I'm viewing it outside of edit mode. Well, a preview button would be nice too.

I searched for this topic, and didn't find a thread that gave it the justice it deserved. I found a lot of complaints about the editor, about lack of support for richtext on the iphone app, about default font problems, issues with tabs. I wonder how many of these complains would disappear with a sensible enough wiki language, so people could avoid using the slightly flawed wysiwyg editor.

The other features of EN, however, blow me away. Its an otherwise wonderful product.

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+1 for Markdown

There are some editors that use it (ByWord, iaWriter, MMD Composer, etc.) They prove that markdown may be a user friendly way to improve typing performance (e.g. with formatting as you type). For example: using * for bullets (provided that there is some auto formatting) is much more straightforward than clicking on a button or Shift-Cmd U ...

A.

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I'm aware: we demanding this are probably not the average Evernote user. But we are the ones caring. Don't let the geeky early adopters run away to the competitors. You know they are the ones that made you what you are today.

 

Not really are what that comment about "the ones caring" is supposed to mean. And guess what...all 65+ million users are the ones who made Evernote what it is today...as well as the Evernote developers.

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Yes, it's possible to take an initial file in some other formatting system and convert it into HTML. Maintaining a round-trip conversion to go back and forth would be extremely difficult, since full nested HTML is much more rich than simple markup.

This is why you only tend to see markup in systems that use markup as their low-level internal representation. It's not a generic editing format for fully expressed HTML.

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Funny how this old topic pops up again and again. I would pay to know if/where Markup is on the EN roadmap...

Somewhere in the same vicinity as the support for LaTex and for an Esperanto version, I'd guess.
I would hope that Markdown was a little higher on the priority list than LaTex. Seems to me that Markdown has a broader user base due to it's simplicity and spectrum of application. +1 for markdown integration in evernote!!
Um, that was a joke -- same order of magnitude, I'd guess.
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@KenF I like the fact Byword is in both places and supports MultiMarkDown. Editorial, on the other hand, has Python and Automation. Having bought both I'll probably use both - and they weren't expensive enough to only buy one of them. (And I still use Byword on the Mac.)

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