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GrumpyMonkey

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GrumpyMonkey last won the day on October 17

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4,205 Your Knowledge Knows No Bounds

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  1. Hi. I don't know that the post can be made editable by anyone else. At least, not by me. Sorry.
  2. Hi. Evernote keeps a copy of your notes on your computer’s hard drive, so while it is true that ultimately the server version is the ”official” one, it is not the only one. Dropbox, iCloud, etc. work a similar way. If there is a problem, Evernote also records note histories (I assume this remains in v10), so you can revert to earlier versions of a note. Exporting as .html is one option, .enex is another. At least, those options used to exist, and will probably be added again. Competitors make some pretty slick import options (for the legacy app), so I’ve found it almost effortless to move everything out of Evernote. Markdown is wonderful, but something quite different than what Evernote is doing. The comparioson only works well if you primarily use text. The more you use other formats, the more useful Evernote is. If you are only using text, Evernote probably seems like it has a lot of unnecessary features!
  3. Hmm. Must be user error somewhere along the way. Weird. Perhaps renaming will help. Thanks for the advice.
  4. Thanks. I did completely get rid of version 10, as far as I can tell (after scouring my drive, searches for hidden files and so forth turned up nothing, so it should have been gone). Did I miss something? Maybe. That would be user error on my part. However, my conclusion to shift the bulk of my work elsewhere seems justified, given the circumstances, and Evernote's official stance that the legacy app is only available for a limited time, and they will probably not address any bugs (recommendations will be to upgrade).
  5. Good point. Thanks for stressing this. I think they are likely to have some sort of export, because they are talking about different formats, but when will that come? And, is only being able to select 50 notes at a time a feature or a "missing to be added later" element? I don't know, and I would recommend not waiting to find out. As always, it's good practice to keep daily backups (Time Machine on Mac) and to keep an exported version of your notes on hand (.enex and/or .html). But, as you said, the exports may not be possible for long, so tonight might be a good night to get it done. By the way, Apple Notes (infamously) doesn't even offer a way out of their application. If you are on Mac, I'd recommend something with better portability as an alternative place to put your notes.
  6. Quoting myself a couple of times to clarify what is happening. I "upgraded," found the experience of the current version 10 incompatible with my workflow, downgraded, and have now encountered an irritating bug in the "new" legacy version (7.4.1). Although the new version is disappointing (for me), I had been pleased to see that they kept a legacy version around in order to help us make the transition, but that was before I discovered the legacy app was going to impact my workflow as well. It's nothing critical, but given the circumstances, not really worth enduring, especially when other apps that accomplish the same task are just a click away for me. This will be the second day in a row (since "upgrading") of me shifting the bulk of my daily work to another app (insert name of Evernote competitor here). I won't say I'm leaving, because that would be silly. I've been around for 12 years now, and it's something I've always found more or less useful (depending on the state of the service, which fluctuates over time). I don't really have much patience for a legacy app that is already losing functionality, though, or a new app that is missing a lot of important features, not to mention many that have been abandoned completely. It's difficult to see how the path Evernote is on right now will produce a better experience (at least for me), so I have little incentive to keep trudging along with the legacy app. The developers who have poured so much effort into the app can take some comfort in the fact that I'm probably just an edge case and not representative of the experience the vast majority of users are having. Let's hope that the app improves and that this re-invigorates the brand, even if they may have to slough off a few of us edge cases to get there.
  7. I'm not sure if this is user error or some cosmic event interfering, but printing a website page to save as a PDF in Evernote on the Mac (the way I have generally saved PDFs to Evernote for years now) stopped working when I downgraded to the legacy version (7.14.1 from the Evernote website). It goes through the process and looks OK, but when I go to view it in Evernote, even after forcing a sync (something we can no longer do in the new version), nothing appears. I can still accomplish this task on a different Mac computer that never got upgraded / downgraded (version 7.14 before the legacy release). In other words, the legacy version is now broken in new ways since the release of 10. I assume this is a bug. I assume it will be fixed at some point. But, my concern is that the legacy app will increasingly become incompatible with me and my workflow as time goes on, forcing me onto 10, which is entirely incompatible with my workflow. This plan (?) seems like a terrible one for releasing a new version (however nice the new stuff is), and a terrible idea if you want to retain your existing customers, especially the ones who love the product and pay for it. My warning to fellow users would be to try to avoid the downgrading scenario, if possible, because you may encounter unpleasant problems. I could revert to an even earlier version of the app if I scrounge around on the Internet looking for it, but I think I won't waste the time (I've got more to say on this in another thread).
  8. Thanks so much for this wonderful contribution to the community! It's nice to hear what the CEO thinks about the business. It's also good to know that it is inspiring and hopeful for other users. One of the nice things about using Evernote is that there is a massive user base, so they generally tend to get lots of input from folks about the app. The downside, though, is that I seem to have a very different workflow from them. Perhaps I am simply an edge case. I prefer to think that the problem is more that there are casual and beginning users who will not encounter a lot of the issues that someone who uses the app all day every day will encounter, kind of like the difference between driving a car a few times a month and driving one every day--that missing cup holder, the roof pillar that slightly obstructs your view, the lack of cruise control, or the lack of AI assistance (traffic jam automated driving) become serious irritations / deal breakers. It's not that it is poorly designed or that they didn't put enough effort into it. Rather, it's that they failed to adequately account for and address the needs of the users who are going to be spending the most amount of time with the product. Personally, I think that innovating for these years (to some degree) will have a dramatic and quite beneficial effect down the line. For example, ordinary users may not feel the need for better encryption options, but no one is going to feel put out if their data is more secure, especially if it is effortless. Competitors have noticed this (Apple gives seamless encryption at the individual note level with slight effort and DEVONthink encrypts the entire database all of the time with 0 effort). I need the encryption, though, and for one reason or another (2013 should have been a turning point for the entire tech sector, but some companies continue to design for a pre-2013 world), EN's competitors have placed an emphasis on security and confidentiality that aligns with mine. That commitment to certain design principles may not be easy to quantify, but it results in some really impressive feats of engineering that are deeply appreciated. Of course, they are restricted to the Appleverse, and that at least partly explains their capabilities, but that's one of the reasons few people try to have a single unified code base / experience across multiple operating systems--they design for the environments in which users find themselves. Concretely speaking, there is a lot to like in what the CEO says, and I can't fault him for the opinions he has expressed, but in most of them I can see why my needs aren't being addressed. That's OK. It is, after all, Evernote's product to do with what they please. But, in its current state (even with some of the missing features returned), it is difficult for me to see a way forward at the moment. I'll have to rethink a lot of my workflow. I suspect many users are in a similar predicament, even if we aren't among those huge numbers that were surveyed.
  9. Talking about leaving is fine. I think talking about alternatives is fine as well, to a point. I've mentioned both things in other threads--indeed, tonight I am having to work with competitor because we just lost local notebooks. That's quite a blow. The confidential stuff has to go somewhere, and apparently "remembering everything important" at Evernote doesn't account for stuff I am ethically and sometimes legally obligated to keep encrypted and/or out of the cloud (other folks' servers). Encrypted notebooks, please... I was responding specifically to calling out one of the Evernote staff for a "soulless" response, getting into the weeds about how to use other alternative apps (not so much in this thread, but in others), and the attempts to bring legal action or instigate a mass migration away from Evernote. I don't think the *Evernote* forums are a place for doing these things. I don't remember calling anything negative, per se. Rather, I am trying to focus the thread on the original topic and to encourage everyone to maintain a certain level of respect for one another and the developers. As you said, most folks are doing fine. We all slip once in a while, but as much as possible, I'd like to keep the thread helpful (for us and the developers) and on topic.
  10. The customer support staff (Jeffrey) are people too, and I don’t think we should be demonizing them for doing their job. The same is true for the developers. This is their livelihood, and I’m sure they are doing their best to develop a quality product, so threatening legal action or trying to organize a mass cancelation of subscriptions (their income) is quite unfair. I think we ought to voice our opinions (I have in many places in this forum), even (especially?) if they are at odds with Evernote’s, but we should try our best to do it in a mutually respectful manner. This is an app we all care about, right? We want to see it succeed and be better. I agree that there are problems eith the current release (enumerated elsewhere), but I think arguing the merits of our position is a better strategy than threats to leave or using the *Evernote* forums to promote alternatives. Let’s try and keep it positive, and give Evernote something they can work with
  11. Hi. Thanks for posting your opinion. I agree that a visible sync button allowing us to force a sync would be welcome, and for many of us it is something we use on a daily basis. Evernote claims the sync is “automatic” now (it was before, as well), and so it has been removed with (apparently) no plans to add it at a later date. “Where did the sync button go? Evernote has a completely new sync architecture and now syncs automatically across all of your devices.” Hopefully, they will reconsider their position on this (they have tried this before with the same reasoning), especially after they hear from users about what is / is not important to us. I like some of the things they are doing (I’ve commented elsewhere on this), but the removal of important features in the name of “streamlining” is unwelcome and undermines all of the hard work they have done. Too bad
  12. That’s helpful. Thanks! I will probably be able to get by with the app, but I’d trade any of the nice improvements that make them “excited” for the stuff that got lost in the “streamlining.” I guess I’m not as enthusiastic than they are about it, because (like many users) I’ve been enjoying the app for years. If I wanted a new “experience” I would have used a different app. A “better” experience wouldn’t involve giving up things that worked really well for me, or things I need to get stuff done. No local notebooks may be a deal breaker. There was a complaint about that back in the day from one of the previous ceo’s, as I recall, so local notebooks have probably been a headache for a while on the development side. But, there is a reason people use them, and failing to address that need isn’t a solution, in my opinion. Hence, the encrypted notebook request. No sync button is pretty irritating. Evernote has always designed their apps as if sync “just works,” but in the real world, it doesn’t work like that with any app by any company. Even Dropbox, which is basically all about sync, has issues. There are work arounds to figure it out, like checking the app on another device, but why get rid of it? We’ve been over this ground again, and again, and again. Presentation mode has been on its way out for a while. Irritating, but OK. Context was pretty cool, but there seems to have been a lack of enthusiasm for a while, and they were peeling off partners (Nikkei, for example), so this is no surprise. I liked it, but it wasn’t a critical feature for me. I don’t see fonts on that list. I think these are a critical feature for me, so without those, I’ll have trouble continuing with the app. I assume the ability to select 50+ notes will come back. Without that, I can’t see a way forward. I’m sure there are more good and bad things I’ll encounter as we go along. I suppose this sounds like an ultimatum, but from my perspective, I can’t really imagine even getting started with an app in this category (productivity, notes, personal information manager), much less paying for one, that doesn’t have font control or the ability to select content. This seems rather basic for 2020.
  13. I see. Thanks for clearing up my confusion about the links. Hopefully, they will add in the feature soon. Of course, agreeing to disagree is probably where we will end up, but I think one difference with this release is that we can easily go back to the legacy version. I am using both right now, and for my workflow, a lot of stuff can still be done with the new version, so I am OK most of the time. And, if I need a particular feature, it is technically still available. However, if features remain missing, at some point the legacy app will presumably lose support, and then I will be done with it. Hopefully, while we have the legacy app, the developers will work the missing features back into the app. One cautionary tale, though, would be the web version, which was rolled out in a similar fashion (legacy and new version), took ages to progress, and even now still doesn't have critical functionality such as the ability to use it on mobile (last I checked). As a result, I think I might use it once or twice a year. Let's hope Evernote doesn't repeat that process here. I wonder if they think of the new web version as a model or a mistake.
  14. Hi. The internal note links (creation and use) work fine for me. I am on Mac, though. Is this a problem you are seeing in Windows? As for the loss of features, I'm not terribly pleased about it either, but if we hold Evernote to that standard (paying us / reducing costs for every feature they remove), we'll probably want to call Apple and inquire about those phone chargers (they won't bundle them with the phones for "amazing reasons," because it was the "right thing to do"--it also enabled them to fit more phones on the pallets and save a huge amount of money). As a paying customer, I don't need rebates or reduced fees. I'd just like to see them get to work restoring the missing features. I'm using the old and new version of the app (on Mac). I don't think I've got any major complaints about the user interface (besides the missing stuff). They both have their pros and cons, but overall they get the job done well (for me).
  15. I think the design team for the Mac has made a beautiful app with some interesting features that I am seeing for the first time. For example, there is a new feature link in the sidebar (sorry, working with Japanese version, so not sure what the precise English wording is) that brings up helpful mini videos showing how things work. I imagine this will be helpful in the days to come. The feedback button at the bottom is also convenient, though... if Evernote was listening to the feedback (at least, my feedback), they wouldn't have gone in this direction, or made a public release of a half-baked app. PROBLEMS I say half-baked because, as of this moment, I cannot view my notes at all (must be some indexing going on in the background--I have several thousand and lots of gigabytes). Literally. It is basically a blank screen where my notes should be. For a brief time, while I could view the content of just one note and see a list of the others in the middle pane, the shortcuts were empty, and I could only select fifty notes at time. Given these limitations, even if I could see my notes, I guess it wouldn't do me much good. I think it is fair to say without exaggeration that I went from 100% to 0% productivity after installing the app. I doubt this is the experience they wanted me to have. My guess is that they had in mind someone with fewer notes, less data, and no need to select more than a handful of notes at a time (to create note links, export, etc.). And, it is slow (at least, at the moment). It may be a wonderful experience for these users. FEEDBACK The thing is, for at least a decade now, I've been asking Evernote (especially with major releases) to be very careful about suddenly (without notice) removing features, and to release something with as few bugs as possible. It seems obvious, but I think it bears repeating. Again, we seem to be circling back to the philosophy of throwing something out there and working on it as we go along. That doesn't fit my productivity model. I suppose it is a useful way to generate and test new features (something I have also said is not high on my list of priorities). What is the team planning to leave abandoned? What is the team planning to add back into the app? It'd be nice to know. In my opinion, if we are talking about existing features, it seems fair to expect a roadmap for them to be implemented, or some warning that they are now obsolete. FEEDBACK vs FUTURE DIRECTION It's the app we have, though, not necessarily the app we want. I'm a premium user, and despite the bugs (for example, a long-standing iOS problem losing focus on the last note opened if you navigate by note links somewhere and then close the app), and the lack of interest in the improvements I've suggested (for example, encrypted notebooks), I've been satisfied. I'll probably just re-install the legacy version for a while. I am afraid that if this is the shape of things to come, though, it is difficult to see a way forward with my workflow. I need to be able to select more than 50 notes. That's really a deal-breaker, I'm afraid. Surely, that has occurred to the designers, so it'd be nice to know if / when this is going to be possible to use again. I don't remember anyone complaining about wanting to be able to select fewer notes, have fewer (no?) options in the toolbar, etc., so I don't know why time was spent removing features. I do hope that the design team's priorities will shift from the new features (that new link I mentioned, for example) to the "old" stuff that I actually need to get stuff done. Rather than tell me how those fancy new features are supposed to work, I'd prefer to have an app that actually does work. RECOMMENDATION Thanks to the other users on the list, I was well aware of the potential problems, I made extra backups, and I have another computer on hand. I'm OK. But, I think the fact that I had to be prepared this way says a lot about the state of what has been released as a "public" version, and I went through this experience in order to see what we are in for this year. Again, I commend the design team on creating something really nice looking, but I strongly recommend they consider productivity, especially for "power" and paying "premium" users. If this was an app I barely used or cared about, it might not matter, but I thought the point of this app was to make it part of my workflow. I know you are all certainly busy, but I suggest thinking about this "return to productivity" in terms of hours or days rather than weeks or months. * Why this thread? Well, it's from 2018, and it reflects the positivity that some users feel, the frustration that others feel, and the general trend by long-time users to avoid the problems in Evernote's releases. Unfortunately, Evernote has not fixed their problem with half-baked releases (there have been interface overhauls, code overhauls, etc. before as well). It is worth noting (or even "Evernoting") that many other apps, including some of their competitors, do not roll out releases like this, especially with major feature deprecations, omissions, or major bugs. In other words, releases don't have to be done this way, and releasing things half-baked undermines the hard work and innovation designers are trying to put into the app. *UDATE - Well, the good news is that I can see my notes now. That certainly helps productivity. Apparently, the app needed to be closed and opened again. I'll stick with it if / until I run into something insurmountable. For the moment, though, I can enjoy this experience again. There are some things to like in here (now that I can see my notes). The layout of the style options is fine, though there must be a way to change the font somewhere, right? Or, am I restricted to a single font--it's unclear if this is a feature (nothing), a missing feature (to be added later), or just my failure to locate something obvious. The Mac shortcut doesn't work either. On the plus side, pasting in an internal note link and then writing something on the next line does not carry over the green color (a bug in the previous version), so this is a welcome improvement. A new bug (surely not a feature) is that scrolling quickly blanks out the list of notes. That's not helpful. Anyhow, the app works for me now. That's a start. @other users: be ready for some teething issues such as the ones I experienced above, but the new app is definitely worth a try. @ developers: keep up the good work, but please be more careful with (overly) sensitive folks like myself when rolling it out, and please take a look at the comments below. - Things I'd like to see changed/added/returned: (1) more sort options for the list in the middle pane--are we going to lose all of them and be restricted to a paltry three? I can display the size of notes, but cannot sort them ascending or descending according to size; (2) the ability to resize the panes better, because when the window is smaller, I can apparently not increase the size of the middle pane beyond a certain point; (3) encrypted notebooks (I had to ask); (4) local notebooks (is this coming back or are we abandoning any attempt at all to make this workplace / sensitive information friendly?); (5) the nagging--I keep getting a popup of new features again, and again, and again; (6) default notebooks for note creation--is that not a thing we can do anymore?; (7) the ability to force a sync--this is really irritating not knowing if stuff is synced or not (many releases of new versions require us to request that this be added in, so can you please just leave it there, because it is needed); (8) the ability to select all notes; (9) the ability to export all notes; (10) a way to clear the searches (one app in ios just puts this as a "clear all history" option in the settings--you may not need it, but I do, because I need to display my screen to others). - Things I'd like to see you keep: (1) the ability to resize the window to any size--finally, I can make it smaller than the old minimums (a quarter or so of my macbook's screen); (2) The ability to shrink that left sidebar--looking good
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