So long and thanks for all the fish.

[arguvant 28]

User since 2009, and paid user probably since 2010. Told hundreds of people about Evernote over the years. At least dozens of past paid subscribers are due to my word of mouth promotion.

But now. I'm sick of V10. Sick of AI nonsense. Sick of slowness.

I wasted 3(?) years hoping V10 would improve, and while it's gotten slightly less bad, Evernote is still annoying on a daily basis. I avoid using it on Android because it's so slow, whereas I used to use the pre-v10 app all the time while I was on the go. I didn't bother sticking to legacy, because I knew they would eventually break it, which seems to be the case now.

I still miss the pre-v10 days. Legacy wasn't always perfect but it was no nonsense. I felt empowered and enjoyed curating my notes. V10 makes me feel like a child being coddled and broke my note-taking habit.

Last draw was the email this morning saying the Linux client is going away. So now I'm exporting my 15k notes and loading them into one of the alternatives.

Generally I don't announce my departure from a subscription service, but this is the longest on-going subscription I've had with any company/product in my life. I've even had it longer than I've been with my lovely wife! So felt like I should at least explain why I'm moving on.

Hopefully Evernote/Bending spoons one day figure out what their product vision is.

[PinkElephant 8,241]

If you need a specific client, and doesn’t get it from service A, move to service B. It’s natural and doesn’t require posting here.

The Linux client was not removed, it was never developed beyond a private beta, on invitation only and for a limited number of users. That a beta is stopped is no big thing, that some are disappointed a Linux client will not be launched might be.

On we go, life is not lived looking back.

[arguvant 28]

Yup, thanks PinkElephant. Your unhelpful replies are legendary and always have been. I certainly won't miss you inserting yourself in every Evernote discussion thread.

[PinkElephant 8,241]

When you start posting your opinion here, you invite answers. You seem to have the rare expectation that anybody must agree with your brilliant insight into the workings of the world. I gave you the chance to think again about this expectation. You nearly made it.

How did you say: Thanks for the fish … 🎣

[MvdH 434]

On 10/14/2023 at 12:35 AM, arguvant said:

User since 2009, and paid user probably since 2010. Told hundreds of people about Evernote over the years. At least dozens of past paid subscribers are due to my word of mouth promotion.

But now. I'm sick of V10. Sick of AI nonsense. Sick of slowness.

I wasted 3(?) years hoping V10 would improve, and while it's gotten slightly less bad, Evernote is still annoying on a daily basis. I avoid using it on Android because it's so slow, whereas I used to use the pre-v10 app all the time while I was on the go. I didn't bother sticking to legacy, because I knew they would eventually break it, which seems to be the case now.

I still miss the pre-v10 days. Legacy wasn't always perfect but it was no nonsense. I felt empowered and enjoyed curating my notes. V10 makes me feel like a child being coddled and broke my note-taking habit.

Last draw was the email this morning saying the Linux client is going away. So now I'm exporting my 15k notes and loading them into one of the alternatives.

Generally I don't announce my departure from a subscription service, but this is the longest on-going subscription I've had with any company/product in my life. I've even had it longer than I've been with my lovely wife! So felt like I should at least explain why I'm moving on.

Hopefully Evernote/Bending spoons one day figure out what their product vision is.

@Federico Simionato 

I agree Evernote v10 is less productive, effective and less efficiënt than Legacy. For me it got to a bearable level and quality, if no more data gets damages/lost.

It does however bring a more modern framework, which I think is good and very important, so it will stay sustainable for the future. The features added are much less important to me than some missing features and stability, though they might become useful/nice for me in the future.

I hope missing features will be added like sorting on tags, like keeping reminder/URL/backlinks working even after merging (which is very possible and not that difficult, I say this having been a software architect/CTO/COO all my life).

I also desire more performance, both in desktop and Android.

For me, I'll stick araoung a while more. Other products do not have the features I need. Notion might get close, as soon as they deliver offline notes, I'll take a look there again.

Price of Evernote is fine for me, also after past price increases. I'd pay 50% more if my problems are solved with Evernote.

[Razmataz 220]

I am looking at the market, price is important to me, as I have retired (but still have all the notes). I’d like to stay with EN. There are two major issues: 

1) V10 is still a pain to use for me. I understand the importance of the "foundation" but from my perspective it is inferior to legacy I usage. 

2) EN is priced now roughly at the double of competing offerings. I look at the price list as published. 

I can probably deal with 1), if I view it as a different, less full functioned offering (to legacy).

It is just that I struggle to justify the 2x price. 

I'll try to stick with EN as long as I can afford it. 

[PinkElephant 8,241]

Some people look at it the other way: Since tasks were introduced, they can stop using yet another app, and have the comfort of having tasks and content in the same place, interacting nicely .

So it always depends on the viewpoint and circumstances. If on a tight budget, moving to Free can be a viable option - even when the lack of features you got used to can be painful.

[gboyd 16]

A lot of people moan about V10 = Bending Spoons. This was done long long long before they saved EN from the ash pile. Move on people, Legacy, Linux are dead and yes there’s a price increase. Look around I think everything else has gone up. 

[mackid1993 894]

1 hour ago, gboyd said:

A lot of people moan about V10 = Bending Spoons. This was done long long long before they saved EN from the ash pile. Move on people, Legacy, Linux are dead and yes there’s a price increase. Look around I think everything else has gone up. 

Bending Spoons saved Evernote. The old EN would have probably ended up bankrupt.

[s2sailor 2,278]

I think the jury is still out and it is too soon to tell.  It does appear they are trying hard to address fundamental issues but there have been some missteps along the way and the price increase that was introduced, IMO, much too soon, is driving some away.  Also, some folks are still reporting data loss.  I’m sticking around for now but will be interested to see where we are in another year.

[mackid1993 894]

33 minutes ago, s2sailor said:

I think the jury is still out and it is too soon to tell.  It does appear they are trying hard to address fundamental issues but there have been some missteps along the way and the price increase that was introduced, IMO, much too soon, is driving some away.  Also, some folks are still reporting data loss.  I’m sticking around for now but will be interested to see where we are in another year.

The price increase was way too premature. You can tell they know that because they seem to constantly be offering 40% off. They really need to cut the discount and adjust the price a little. It really should be $99/personal $149/professional. That is basically the price in Europe. I don't know why it's cheaper in EUR than in USD.

[Boot17 1,482]

On 10/17/2023 at 6:51 PM, mackid1993 said:

Bending Spoons saved Evernote. The old EN would have probably ended up bankrupt.

Can you explain why you think that? -- because I don't think that's necessarily the case. Like what specifically have they done that the old team wasn't doing? Just raise the prices so much?

I think Bending Spoons is on nearly the same trajectory the old team already set. Because they are a new player in the Evernote business, I do think they can get away with a quicker pace of changes than the old team (like raising the price so much and deprecate the grandfathered plans). They are also a fresh set of eyes and fresh set of legs and so I think Evernote has some new life breathed into it, but I don't think old EN would have ended up bankrupt as I think they would have essentially done similar things albeit maybe they wouldn't have increased prices so much so soon.

Edit: unless you mean "legacy" by "old EN" because then I would agree with that assessment. However, there was a period of time in between the Legacy apps and Bending Spoons where "old EN" was still driving the development. It was a very painful time period for many users, but the "old EN" did it and started to get things turned around and it was was set the stage for Bending Spoons to run with it now.

[MvdH 434]

On 10/18/2023 at 5:44 AM, Boot17 said:

Can you explain why you think that? -- because I don't think that's necessarily the case. Like what specifically have they done that the old team wasn't doing? Just raise the prices so much?

Well, my holistic answer would be "the energy" of Bending Spoons is better. They give me the impression of being more engaged, more serieus, more result oriented, more ambitious moving forward. People who know me a bit, know I want above all (for my GTD/TSW methods, which promoted Evernote as the go-to-tool, which you now cannot do. See my post of today in 

The above seems contradictory to me liking their focus on new futuristic/competitive features. I think however their different focus is needed for a strong and growing Evernote.

It seems they also dare to make more mistakes. It does hurt my trust that data got damaged or lost multiple times for me, on the other hand, being too cautious holds you back on an innovative level. They are clearly learning the product, the dangers, the risks. This is good.

If they deliver my missed features, and would also introduce Microsoft Loop like functionality, which is basically the same as Notions synced-sections, then I'll voluntarily double my subscription fees, as a figure of speech, or stick around with a smile when they raise/double my price again.

I trust they will do things like Notion-synced-sections and add the missing GTD/TSW features, because it is the logical thing to do and not that expensive and there is an important community using Evernote this why. Why important? People that organize their work this way in Evernote most of the times think in value and have money and are willing to pay for that value.

Oh, finally and important to me, the new Evernote/BS communicates a lot more that the old, via the likes of @Federico Simionato

Summarizing: I felt the old Evernote was to conservative. Too careful. Too slow. Too silent. I experienced them zombie-like, compared to the above "energy" I feel. I think the old Evernote would sleepwalk into a canyon eventually.

[Boot17 1,482]

I too am also just as optimistic -- if not more -- with Bending Spoons as I am with the old team (as I said above "They are also a fresh set of eyes and fresh set of legs and so I think Evernote has some new life breathed into it"), but I guess I mostly think that throwing shade on the old team is not fair or justified -- I think they are what "saved" Evernote and help set the stage for which Bending Spoons is now acting on. (See below link -- "I think prior to v10 Evernote was mostly dead in the water with all of it's distinct code bases and distinct functionality across platforms and they had a hard time moving forward and staying viable. Sure they could have hunkered down and just maintained status quo and many would have been happy, but the business would have gone under and then we'd have nothing.)

In the last few years and under the "old" management, Evernote did its biggest major overhaul and update of the client apps in Evernote history. Then they added Tasks, Home, Calendar integration, Backlinks, Checklists and more. The multi-sync edit and infrastructure upgrade was already in beta before the acquisition by Bending Spoons. Evernote had just gotten their feet under them cleaning up all the technical debt left over from Version 10 and were really starting to roll. Updates once or twice a month with bug fixes and new minor, and sometimes, major releases... It goes one. That is a huge amount of work and effort to maintain -- all the while juggling the old code base and clients and making sure new changes could work with Legacy still functioning. Then Bending Spoons acquired them.

The old team is what set this new release cadence and set the stage.

I think Bending Spoons has done great to run with that and continue that forward -- even though I'm personally not a big fan of the AI Note Clean Up, or AI Search, price increases (keeps it viable though), or removal of the grandfathered plans (even though I'm no longer on one anyway), or Linux Client removal (even though I understand the possible reasoning).

Related: 

 

[MvdH 434]

1 hour ago, Boot17 said:

but I guess I mostly think that throwing shade on the old team is not fair or justified -- I think they are what "saved" Evernote and help set the stage for which Bending Spoons is now acting on.

Correct. Let me correct the impression I might have left behind: The old team got the Evernote foundations ready for the next phase, and kept us warm and functional al those years. Kudos to them. 95% (if not more) of the value I experience comes from them! Kudos again! 🙌👊👍

[WilliamL 656]

Interesting thread….im not sure what fish have to do with it tho lol? Do people get fish if they leave Evernote? If so what kind?

[s2sailor 2,278]

7 hours ago, MvdH said:

It seems they also dare to make more mistakes. It does hurt my trust that data got damaged or lost multiple times for me, on the other hand, being too cautious holds you back on an innovative level. They are clearly learning the product, the dangers, the risks. This is good.

I don’t know if they dare to make mistakes or are just making more mistakes.  I think the old team would have caught some of the recent problems before releasing updates.  I’ve been attributing it to them learning the code and getting their feet under them, but every release there appears to be something they missed.  Today I updated my iPad to 10.56.3 and now the task widget doesn’t work and appears blank.  It is no big deal and they will get it fixed but it does seem to me like they could do a better job testing new releases.

I agree there is more apparent energy and that is good, but expected.  They just bought Evernote and are highly motivated to make it a viable product for them. Let’s see if they can maintain it.

[gazumped 11,737]

1 hour ago, WilliamL said:

Interesting thread….im not sure what fish have to do with it tho lol? Do people get fish if they leave Evernote? If so what kind?

A literary allusion...

[eric99 996]

8 hours ago, MvdH said:

Well, my holistic answer would be "the energy" of Bending Spoons is better. They give me the impression of being more engaged, more serieus, more result oriented, more ambitious moving forward. People who know me a bit, know I want above all (for my GTD/TSW methods, which promoted Evernote as the go-to-tool, which you now cannot do. See my post of today in 

The above seems contradictory to me liking their focus on new futuristic/competitive features. I think however their different focus is needed for a strong and growing Evernote.

It seems they also dare to make more mistakes. It does hurt my trust that data got damaged or lost multiple times for me, on the other hand, being too cautious holds you back on an innovative level. They are clearly learning the product, the dangers, the risks. This is good.

If they deliver my missed features, and would also introduce Microsoft Loop like functionality, which is basically the same as Notions synced-sections, then I'll voluntarily double my subscription fees, as a figure of speech, or stick around with a smile when they raise/double my price again.

I trust they will do things like Notion-synced-sections and add the missing GTD/TSW features, because it is the logical thing to do and not that expensive and there is an important community using Evernote this why. Why important? People that organize their work this way in Evernote most of the times think in value and have money and are willing to pay for that value.

Oh, finally and important to me, the new Evernote/BS communicates a lot more that the old, via the likes of @Federico Simionato

Summarizing: I felt the old Evernote was to conservative. Too careful. Too slow. Too silent. I experienced them zombie-like, compared to the above "energy" I feel. I think the old Evernote would sleepwalk into a canyon eventually.

Yes, the new team has the agility of a small indie team backed by BendingSpoon's resources. This makes it a big winner!

[JoshYoung 6]

On 10/13/2023 at 6:04 PM, arguvant said:

Yup, thanks PinkElephant. Your unhelpful replies are legendary and always have been. I certainly won't miss you inserting yourself in every Evernote discussion thread.

He has 20,000 forum posts. He lives and breathes this app. I've been looking at this forum for 10 minutes and he's commented on every single post I've opened. Don't really understand how someone gets that into an app, unless they're actually working there (and even then). I bet you'd get less snarky responses if you insulted their mother.

[PinkElephant 8,241]

The correct pronomen is „his“, not „their“. If you tried an insult, please watch your grammar.

Snarky enough … ?

[WilliamL 656]

54 minutes ago, JoshYoung said:

He has 20,000 forum posts. He lives and breathes this app. I've been looking at this forum for 10 minutes and he's commented on every single post I've opened. Don't really understand how someone gets that into an app, unless they're actually working there (and even then). I bet you'd get less snarky responses if you insulted their mother.

What’s the issue? Seriously - that is your problem with that? Does it cause issues for anyone? Start wars? Nope! I think with all that’s going on in this trashy world we seem committed to entirely ruining in every conceivable way - someone spending time on a forum is the least of the issue. Seriously, go switch new news in and see somethings that actually deserve criticism and your snark. 

[arguvant 28]

6 hours ago, WilliamL said:

What’s the issue? Seriously - that is your problem with that? Does it cause issues for anyone? Start wars? Nope! I think with all that’s going on in this trashy world we seem committed to entirely ruining in every conceivable way - someone spending time on a forum is the least of the issue. Seriously, go switch new news in and see somethings that actually deserve criticism and your snark. 

Because obsession and uncritical support of anything, whether it's religion, country, idealism, or an app succumbing to enshittification, is why the world is in such bad shape.

[WilliamL 656]

11 minutes ago, arguvant said:

Because obsession and uncritical support of anything, whether it's religion, country, idealism, or an app succumbing to enshittification, is why the world is in such bad shape.

What lol? The world is in such bad shape because of power, greed, coercion, bombs, the list goes on. The world is NOT in bad shape cause someone posts in a notes forum. Come on, be serious and realise how absurd the position you’re trying to argue here is. 

[PinkElephant 8,241]

I wouldn’t call it absurd. It’s self defeating. To use a quotation, it’s enshittification (nice one, really 😂).