Enteecee

Hey, guys, look: everything's running smoothly!

When I try to log in on a brand new iPhone Mini, with the mobile version current (because I had to for mobile), I get the expected prompt to log in. But the "continue" button does nothing - I'm just jabbing glass. I can't even scroll down- the app is simply frozen totally on startup. Erased, re-stalled, and restarted phone and nothing's changed.

Because of all the people pissed about v10 and still relying on Legacy? Because new users might not choose Evernote now because it lacks features they want that are still available in Legacy? Because it's an opportunity to reassure new and old users that they value us and understand our requirements so we should stick around? Because it could easily be great marketing if spun as an example of solid support for their user base, an indication of their continuity and reliability as a company in a time when there've been several articles about very real reasons to doubt it. Your points about not panicking and Legacy being a bridge are very well taken, but your seeming commitment to the idea that this hasn't been very poorly handled by EN is contradicted by hundreds of comments here, as well as the basic outline of events. I don't see how it's arguable that Evernote was ham-handed here at very best.

Agreed, though there are ways for certain products to offer free versions that cost essentially nothing. I don't think Evernote is one of those. I always thought that people value free stuff in line with what they pay for it, and since I started my own business I've seen it proven time and time again. There's an assumption that a free product needn't be very good, and a natural understanding that the user has little right to demand anything from it. But user buy-in jumps dramatically the first dollar they have to spend.

I don't care about the branding except in what it expresses, which is a real thing; an approach they took based on a particular outlook, both of which I think are really misguided. My point isn't about branding, it's that v10 is clearly not the primary Evernote experience yet and shouldn't have been treated as such so soon. "Legacy" should have retained that position as they phased both features and users onto the new platform. Both versions are available now anyway, so nothing would have been different except user perception and the disaffection and even anger they've stirred up would have been entirely avoided.

Indeed it is. And it STILL could have been done better. As I said in another thread, there never should have been a "Legacy" version. FreshBooks had a similar problem - working with an almost 20 year old database system that they needed to get off of. They launched the new version too early, as well, in my opinion, but they moved users over intelligently. They looked at who used what, and offered customers who used the only the features they had running the exciting opportunity to switch! As features were added back, they extended that offer to users of those features. Then they officially launched and rebranded the old as "Classic". Everyone was offered the opportunity to switch over without changing their plan. No one was forced to migrate. Three years later I'm still on Classic waiting for a few important items. It was so much better than this experience with Evernote, and yet I wonder how many potential new customers they're losing while marketing the new version as "prime" if those customers expect the features that still haven't arrived. At this point, certainly no more than those who wouldn't have signed up to Classic, which is more robust but looks like it was designed in 2005... because it was. Thanks for elucidating at least one good take on how Evernote got to this point with this release. Hopefully, they'll get back to having a current version that's usable for me, but in the meantime they're really tarnishing what was still a pretty dang good name.

I wonder if that's a small percentage of users overall, or a small percentage of the subscribers who actually make them money. Because the two are often very different groups. If EN's trying to appeal to people who could just as well be served by any of the many simpler competing products - some of which come pre-installed on devices - that's fine. But not if that comes at the expense of users who pay, and will continue to pay as long as it's good, and will tell others about their favorite tools. Never at the expense of those customers. Most of the casuals will never upgrade, and if you try to charge them, they'll move on to the next simple free product. The only point in getting their attention at all is to glean from that pool the users who will pay your bills. To do that, you've got to have something real to offer. I've also observed that many apps and services now create a full-fledged version of the product, then artificially dumb down to a free version that's minimally usable, hoping to entice paying customers. That's a bad strategy in my view, because then no one comes to like or depend on the dumb version enough to consider paying for it.

Thanks to @gazumped helping me, I can help you! https://help.evernote.com/hc/en-us/articles/360052560314?fbclid=IwAR2TNqp-eGRH3Ds8Vfu-CiKPjYolJzZ_keR9eWQaDahJ2GN-7hwn595zI8w&__s=bsetfdgzirbvqtopurph

Exactly. This fits in very well with: Me, too, and I'm just disgusted. It all speaks to a fundamental shift in software away from relative transparency and honesty in selling a product to people who might find it useful towards gulling the as many people as possible into a cycle of perpetual payment for whatever the company feels like providing at any given time. There's no more sense of any contract to deliver on. There are hundreds (thousands?) of posts all over these forums from people who dislike the new version, ranging from "Meh, not very good" to "You've trashed decades of work and the attendant trust in you". Given that, Evernote should provide users two things. First, a provisional timeline for feature parity, ideally enumerating exactly which features they plan to restore. Second, as you point out, a commitment to support Legacy for a certain period, and statement that such support will be extended if specific benchmarks aren't met by the new product by that date. If they genuinely think "there's little risk in introducing a new bug that would potentially block you from using the legacy version" that shouldn't be a difficult commitment to make. I'd be much more forgiving of a deadline slipping for X feature implementation than I am of "You'll get some things when we get around to them, if we get around to it, which we'll let you know when we do. Have fun guessing which features we even plan on bringing back." Legacy should never have been "Legacy". It should have remained the standard, while adventurous users should have been offered the exciting opportunity to help Evernote blaze the trail forward until they've got something worthy of replacing the current standard.

I usually find it trite when people say that a new release is really a Beta, but if EN's outright saying they plan to return most features, then how could they deny that's the case here? Any idea why they wouldn't just wait until they had something at least close to feature-complete? EN isn't the first core piece of the productivity suite I rely on that's done this. "All-New FreshBooks" did the same thing something like three years ago and is still missing features that keep me stuck on "FreshBooks Classic". When Apple gutted iWork the reason was obvious: to rebuild from the ground up for full compatibility with iOS versions, which also took an appallingly long time. I can't understand why others do this, though.

Totally hot garbage. Also hot garbage is that I'm out of "likes" for the day, apparently, so I can't add support to your complaint that way. Just via this message, and by offering you at least a temporary way out by rolling back to "Legacy". Apparently EN anticipated that many users would be unhappy with the mess they made: https://help.evernote.com/hc/en-us/articles/360052560314?fbclid=IwAR2TNqp-eGRH3Ds8Vfu-CiKPjYolJzZ_keR9eWQaDahJ2GN-7hwn595zI8w&__s=bsetfdgzirbvqtopurph

Man. I didn't even notice that.

I don't know where it keeps its data, but I've been looking at MS OneNote. Devonthink looks like it might work, too. Man, I hate this.

https://help.evernote.com/hc/en-us/articles/360052560314?fbclid=IwAR2TNqp-eGRH3Ds8Vfu-CiKPjYolJzZ_keR9eWQaDahJ2GN-7hwn595zI8w&__s=bsetfdgzirbvqtopurph There ya go. I'll also add that the little "HTML CONTENT" fence has me red-faced with anger, introducing a ridiculous new step to make editable. To really make sure you smell the stink of that UI, they hide even the ability to do so. Mouse-overs hide functionality and reduce discoverability. Their only benefit is a cleaner look, which we don't even get in this case because of the HTML CONTENT bounding box. Inanity.

Thanks very much for the legacy link, @DTLow. I am right there with you, @Coleberhorst. It feels like Evernote has been on an overall downward trajectory for most of its life now. They repeatedly deprecate important things, break workflows, and anger their users for no good reason; then gradually add things back and plug the holes, only to do it all over again. There was a time when EN was just amazing, so far ahead of anything else. For me, it was the killer app that made having a first-gen iPad really worthwhile. But I can't remember the last time I was excited for an update, but it was definitely more than 6 years ago. the first time they broke my organizational system I was enraged. Now I meet each update with a shrug at best, occasionally frustration, and in this case resigned anger. I'm not sure who they're trying to serve. I'm not sure they are, either.