Audio Notes

[Jddown 1]

Over the past month, I've started using the Audio feature to record notes and journal entries, since I've found the transcription tool to be fairly solid.  However, over the past couple of weeks, the audio notes have become unreliable from a tech standpoint.  Here are glitches I've encountered recently:

- If I'm recording a note and the display turns off, the recording will sometimes stop.  If it turns off and I notice it right away, I'll see the red microphone icon lit up on the lock screen and I can go back in and see that it's still recording.  But, after an indeterminate period of time, the recording will stop.  What's worse is that the recording will just disappear.  Evernote will show the entry in my notes, by default labeled Audio, but my recording isn't there.

- This morning, I was recording and paying attention to the screen to ensure that the display stayed on (I went into my iOS settings to change the AutoLock setting from 1 minute to 5 minutes to help prevent this issue).  However, when I saw something that I wanted to take a photo of, I stopped the recording and opened my camera app.  When I went back to Evernote, the audio file wasn't there.  

I really want this to work, but I'm frustrated by these bugs.  If you're walking and recording for 10 minutes and then find that Evernote stopped at some point and didn't save what you did, the whole point of "Never Forgetting" is undercut.  I realize that I could just pull in a file I recorded with Voice Notes, but I'd like to keep all of this under one roof.

Jeff 

[Ty_B 0]

Haha. I JUST submitted a bug report saying the same thing and share your frustration. I've had half a dozen important recordings lost over the last couple of weeks and I'm ready to pull my hair out.

Whether manually locking the screen or if the Lock Screen came on due to the time configured in Settings -> Display & Brightness having lapsed, Evernote used to keep recording. Now, once the Lock Screen is enabled (manually or via time having lapsed) a little yellow mic icon shows up in the upper-right corner of the Lock Screen for about 5 seconds and then the recording stops and when you go back in, nothing is in the note. Everything is lost.

Just to test it, I started an audio recording, went to Settings to go check on the Lock Screen time out setting ... it showed the yellow mic in the upper-right corner indicating that it was still recording ... while scrolling down the Settings page before clicking on Display & Brightness, the mic disappeared. Going back to Evernote showed that the recording was totally gone.

This is a big deal and a critical bug, in my mind. Recorded moments can't be recreated.

[Ty_B 0]

Even merely initiating a recording ... and switching to another app (like Settings, for example) ... you'll get a lilttle yellow microphone indicating the background audio recording ... and then it disappears. You return to Evernote and not only has the audio recording stopped, but anything that was recorded is gone.

Not being able to rely on audio recordings being captured essentially makes the feature useless. I hope they'll prioritize fixing it.

[gazumped 12,054]

While I sympathise with the idea of keeping things under one roof,  Evernote is a classic example of a jack of all trades - master of none.  I'm on Windows and Android and I've always used third party audio recorders because they have fewer limitations and more controls - and I can leave them running while making notes or doing other things in Evernote.  Given what's going on under the hood while you continue to record / change apps / take pictures,.  the phone is going to make some hardware choices as to what processes remain active - I don't think Evernote is going to fix this easily or soon...

[s2sailor 2,426]

As much as I would like this to work as well, on the iPhone, functionality is too inconsistent to rely on.  I've been using a 3rd party recording app for a while now.

[PinkElephant 8,772]

8 hours ago, Ty_B said:

… Not being able to rely on audio recordings being captured essentially makes the feature useless. I hope they'll prioritize fixing it.

There is no bug, even if you probably won’t believe me.

On mobile OS all apps run in a sandbox by default. Which means each app is allocated a chunk of available RAM memory, and it i only allowed inside of it. It’s allocated system resources like the microphone are allowed while the app is in active use.

When you switch to another app, EN becomes an inactive app, locked into the sandbox, and after a short time disconnected from resources.

For me it looks like exactly this behavior.

[southernforge 75]

Can confirm, this feature is broken when to start recording an audio note, and lock the phone even for just 10 seconds Recording has stopped in the note is no longer there. 

It is gone as if it had never been: the note does not even exist in the trash.

This is a serious problem.

#don'taddfeaturesyoudontsupport

[gazumped 12,054]

Just now, southernforge said:

and lock the phone even for just 10 seconds

And how doe the phone normally deal with ongoing processes when it's locked?

[s2sailor 2,426]

55 minutes ago, PinkElephant said:

When you switch to another app, EN becomes an inactive app, locked into the sandbox, and after a short time disconnected from resources.

It disconnects even when NOT switching to another app.  Sure seems like a bug to me.  It was stable at one time.  Currently, it is not ... at least for me.  

[southernforge 75]

5 minutes ago, gazumped said:

And how doe the phone normally deal with ongoing processes when it's locked?

Non-destructively.

[PinkElephant 8,772]

31 minutes ago, s2sailor said:

It disconnects even when NOT switching to another app.  Sure seems like a bug to me.  It was stable at one time.  Currently, it is not ... at least for me.  

Can’t tell, since I don’t use EN audio since long.

I remember trying and finding out it synced all the time even while the recording was ongoing.

At that point I got JustPressRecord, and never had an urge to rethink. JPR saves on device, and that’s all it needs for a stable, high quality recording. Plus it came with transcription and iCloud sync even back then. All I needed, and it still does.

But I wouldn’t be surprised if Audio is the next item on a long and growing list of features that were touched, somewhat improved but (further) broken on the way.

Release quality really sucks !

[Ty_B 0]

@PinkElephant I am 100% certain this worked fine in the past (as recently as May 2024). I've recorded many meetings where the screen was locked and everything saved just fine. No data loss.

Please don't make claims of there being no bug, as it could lead EN moderators to discount the reality and seriousness of this issue.

The fact that you went and downloaded JustPressRecord, a third party app, to accomplish what you described is evidence in and of itself that the functionality CAN exist. Apple's native Voice Memos app functions appropriately, as well. I'm sure that something can be done to set the app to a state where the OS doesn't consider it an inactive background app if a recording is in progress so that it doesn't time out. Mapping apps have that functionality. Music apps have that functionality. Voice Memos has that functionality. Evernote USED TO and MUST have that functionality for this feature to be usable in a practical way.

It is a definite bug ... and a big deal.

[PinkElephant 8,772]

Just to avoid an erroneous impression: I use JPR for years now. It’s simply because I try to think in process chains and single points of failure (SPF).

Producing an audio recording by pushing it to a cloud storage is a very long process chain, with several SPFs. Compared to this a recording straight into local memory reduces the process length and the SPFs drastically.

That it worked for you before is no proof of a sound concept. It may be incidental - as the current failure may be incidental.

But even if it is a bug, and if it gets fixed, the general vulnerability of the process design remains. And the truth that what CAN go wrong WILL go wrong, one day.

So why expose your valuable recordings to such a chance, every time you use it ?

Beside this, audio recording is by no means a core function that MUST be done in EN to work. I prove any time that this assumption is wrong, both in how an audio recording is done technically and in how to get it joined with a note holding related information. 

What is obvious is that it is by far better NOT to use the SAME app for accessing information during a meeting, and taking an audio at the same time. By relying on another app for the audio I can freely use my EN app to retrieve or grab relevant information without interfering with the audio recording. 

[southernforge 75]

On 2024. 8. 28. at 오후 2시 17분, s2sailor said:

As much as I would like this to work as well, on the iPhone, functionality is too inconsistent to rely on.  I've been using a 3rd party recording app for a while now.

What app do you use?  I'm looking for an app that records well... until I stop it.  Thanks.

[s2sailor 2,426]

2 hours ago, southernforge said:

What app do you use

Just Press Record

[southernforge 75]

Thank you.  I'll try it today.

[Thorz 119]

I am sorry to read that some of you are having issues with the audio recordings. I understand that this comment is not going to help solving the situation, but will post it anyway.

This thread grabbed my attention because I have used EN in the past to record audio on iPhone. It is not my main audio recorder but it has done the work when needed .

Recording of audio is also an integral part of the added audio-transcription function, a feature that looks very appealing. I used to do this using 3rd-party apps, but it looks like EN transcriptions are really good in English, Spanish and Norwegian which are the 3 languages I have tested with.

i have just tested EN recordings on an iPhone 15 Pro Max letting the iPhone go into lock screen and at my end the recording process didn’t stop at any point. I tested recording for 8 minutes, both switching to other apps and locking the iPhone. I am on the last EN for iOS (10.104.1) and the latest iOS (17.6.1).

Have you tried the usual troubleshooting steps of closing all the apps from the iOS switcher, erasing the EN app and installing it again, restarting the iPhone and lastly forcing the iPhone into a hard-reboot? I know these are basic things but at times they use to work.

It could be interesting to know in what devices are you having trouble. I found similar issues with audio recording in other apps in the past when I was using some of my older iPhones that were more RAM limited (like the iPhone 6 Plus for example).

I hope you guys find a solution that works at your end.

Edited September 10 by Thorz
Typos

[PinkElephant 8,772]

Audio transcription is no integral part of EN audio recording. You can transcribe recordings done with other apps as well. The audio clip needs to be in certain audio file formats to work, but being recorded with EN is NO precondition.

The downside of server based recording vs. true on device recordings have been discussed at length. 

[Thorz 119]

I understand what you say, I meant it is integral in the practical way. I am sure the most used workflow of audio transcription the devs had in mind was direct input of audio via Evernote’s own capture subsystem. The support of attaching an externally captured audio file into a note is an additional function, luckily we have options for doing this. I also capture important audio, like a conference, using external apps

[PinkElephant 8,772]

I never understood why recording audio with the same device and app that I use to hold my information for the meeting makes any sense. There are often questions that make me retrieve additional information.

When I decide to use another device for the audio to avoid conflicting uses that may kill my ongoing recording, I can use a different app as well.

[Thorz 119]

On 9/10/2024 at 1:48 PM, PinkElephant said:

I never understood why recording audio with the same device and app that I use to hold my information for the meeting makes any sense.

I guess it's for the same reason why millions use their phones for filming and taking pictures, but a more specialized group still prefers/needs to use an external device like a good camera.

In my particular case, I prefer to use other apps when capturing audio from critical meetings or a course. They offer features that are important for me on those occasions that EN doesn't, for example, syncing of audio with notes. If I just needed to record good-quality audio with zero interruptions regularly, I definitely see the appeal of using an external device.

[PinkElephant 8,772]

I am not talking about a dedicated device here.

We have enough devices able to perform high quality audio recording within reach: Phones, tablets, notebooks.

What is more important is to be aware of some technical restrictions of the OS and apps: Mobile OS locks apps into sandboxes, allowing only defined interaction and limiting the background activities allowed. On any mobile device opening one app can kill another in the background, simply because the OS runs short on memory, and decides it needs to kill a running app to allow another to start. 

With EN on mobile you have a memory heavy app, and for recording you are locked to the note in which the recording takes place. So you can't use EN to retrieve information at the same time as the ongoing recording. And you run the risk that EN in the background will be killed by the OS when you open another app.

Both speaks to use another, lightweight app to do the recording, and use EN for the meeting stuff.

Notebooks are a different story: The OS is build for multitasking, and apps are usually not sandboxed. But the microphone arrays are very user focussed, not good as a mobile device in the middle of the table to grab general sound.

So I think below using a conference speaker as a recording device, the best setup is a phone with a lightweight audio recording app to run the recording, and a notebook or tablet for general meeting use. The audio app won't break the bank, they come for a small one time payment.