TheMagicWombat

1. Sort of no choice. Once you place your data into Evernote, it is locked into that or ANOTHER proprietary format. 2. Not really. As long as I have it in multiple formats, I can keep moving it as needed.

I've basically resigned myself to the fact that, like others have posted, the only way to safeguard my work and have it stored in a still-functioning format is to copy it over to another program that will live import the data. If one company dies, you still have your database running with the other. I am using Notion for that. (Also, when I use database, I am referring to a type of software/stored information records--not a specific brand. As much as the True Believers here hate it, Evernote is just a database program, and the records inside are technically the database.) I do agree that OS tags would be a lot better, but... We don't have those and the odds of getting them are right up there with nested folders.

Don't you know the difference between oxygen and electrons? Electrons are what are used to transmit digital messages--like this one. Oxygen gets used in verbal communication. Also, as oxygen, unlike electrons, is always being recycled and is not bound by the Second Law of Thermodynamics (except on incredibly long time scales--orders of magnitude times the age of the universe), unless you are in a very limited situation where oxygen is not plentiful--such as an ICU in New Orleans, or the Space Station, it is impossible to "waste" oxygen. Run around and sing at the top of your lungs the Barney song--those oxygen molecules you turn into carbon-dioxide get happily recycled by plants and will be there tomorrow for you to use again. Sing along with me! I love you, you love me We're a happy family With a great big hug And a kiss from me to you Won't you say you love me too? I love you, you love me We're best friends like friends should be With a great big hug And a kiss from me to you Won't you say you love me too?

That is tolerable. All that means is in the future as OS versions change will be forced to eventually migrate. I just HATE software with built in expiration dates. The day I found out the hard way that Quicken had one in ALL versions of their software, I switched over to MoneyDance. UGH! That means that if the Evernote servers go down, and you have until your next power cycle to use Legacy, and not any longer.

Ya. I eventually found you had to toggle on those fields. They are set to off by default by the export routine. And, I agree. Legacy is what to use if you still want to use Evernote and have any concerns about being locked out of your own data.

1. Does anyone know with a high degree of certainty, does Legacy first talk to the Evernote Servers before it starts actually running? (I.e. If the server is down, will it still run?) 2. Does anyone know if Legacy has a built in expiration date? (Like the various versions of Quicken do.) 3. Does anyone know if Evernote could--if they wanted to--disable the copy of Legacy sitting on an end user machine? Thanks!

I just tested 5 notes with 5 different tags added. (1 per) I don't see those tags anywhere. Are they hidden somewhere in the HTML code invisible? I went so far as to open the HTML file in a text editor, and the tag was not buried in there. I opened the master HTML file in a text editor as well, and no tags. Are you sure they are included, and if so, where are they hidden? ----Edit Never mind. By default, the export is set to strip them. You must set it to on and THEN export.... So the tags and other info gets written into the text of the HTML file itself. Leaving them... pretty useless unless you do a search for that tag as a text string inside of documents themselves....I suppose you could search for hat exact string of the tag, and then re-tag them in bulk whatever software you were using, but live transfer to other software seems more prudent. I remember when transferring form one database software program to another one was easy--set up your import tables and pulled in your data. *sigh*

If you are going to comment, please make it factual. What you said ABOUT Evernote was 100% wrong. Here, you must have missed all of this: What you have said is the equivalent of "Word doesn't FORCE you to do anything--you CHOOSE to save your documents!" IF you use Evernote, you are forced to work within the confines they have coded in. I think we can ALL file that in the Notebook labelled "Duh!" So we are back to what I said--Evernote has forced you to use Tags instead of nested folders, and the tags get stripped during the export process. As for the majority of what you say to establish structure in your records, most of THOSE also get stripped out during the HTML export process. Except, of course, for Notebook Stacks--your suggestion to somehow use those merits special attention. Did you ever find out what happens when you export stacked notebooks? I don't think you have. Here is what you get: 1. You can either export them one at time--thus breaking the super-limited nesting you had (i.e. you might as well have not had them stacked) OR 2. You can export the ENTIRE stack at once--in which case they ALL get merged together into one big happy HTML file, OR 1 big happy set of 100% unsorted HTML records. Yep--If you have a notebook "stack" of 5 Notebooks with 50 records per notebook, and you export the entire stack, you wind up with ONE grouping of ALL 250 records mixed together like a good bowl of oatmeal! I just exported a "stack" of notebooks. Total of 1,288 records spread across 8 different notebooks. Do you know what I wound up with? A single HTML file containing all 1,288 records mixed together. Then I exported the same "stack" as individual HTML files. Do you know what I got? 1,288 HTML files ALL sitting in the same directory. Please. Do NOT lecture me on Evernote features you have never tested that I have. Now, please, justify your prior post in light of those FACTS about Evernote. If you can, I will apologize for asking if you were arguing just for the same of arguing.

You need to stop lying. I have NEVER said Evernote is doomed. That might be what you are reading, but that is on you. What I have actually said is IF Evernote fails, I want to be ready. Also, *I* would NEVER have my subject and verb NOT in agreement. (At least not on something so basic. Get into areas where the subject sounds plural or singular when it is not, and I might slip. But "Evernote" immediately followed by "are"? Never.)

Because I work with attitudes and trends, the vast majority of what I have is off the web. I could save all the bookmarks--and god know I do have them as bookmarks already because I have a feeder program to find the stories and it saves them as bookmarks. From there, I clip them into Evernote and then sort as needed. But, ya. I am where you are--the only way to protect against data loss is have your database sitting in two different database software programs at the same time. Legacy provides *some* assurance--but can Evernote disable Legacy just by throwing a switch? Does Legacy first poll the Evernote servers to get verification of an active account before it will run? Those are scary thoughts.

Are you just trying to argue for the sake of arguing? What you have said is the equivalent of "Word doesn't FORCE you to do anything--you CHOOSE to save your documents!" IF you use Evernote, you are forced to work within the confines they have coded in. I think we can ALL file that in the Notebook labelled "Duh!" So we are back to what I said--Evernote has forced you to use Tags instead of nested folders, and the tags get stripped during the export process. As for the majority of what you say to establish structure in your records, most of THOSE also get stripped out during the HTML export process. Except, of course, for Notebook Stacks--your suggestion to somehow use those merits special attention. Did you ever find out what happens when you export stacked notebooks? I don't think you have. Here is what you get: 1. You can either export them one at time--thus breaking the super-limited nesting you had (i.e. you might as well have not had them stacked) OR 2. You can export the ENTIRE stack at once--in which case they ALL get merged together into one big happy HTML file, OR 1 big happy set of 100% unsorted HTML records. Yep--If you have a notebook "stack" of 5 Notebooks with 50 records per notebook, and you export the entire stack, you wind up with ONE grouping of ALL 250 records mixed together like a good bowl of oatmeal! I just exported a "stack" of notebooks. Total of 1,288 records spread across 8 different notebooks. Do you know what I wound up with? A single HTML file containing all 1,288 records mixed together. Then I exported the same "stack" as individual HTML files. Do you know what I got? 1,288 HTML files ALL sitting in the same directory. Please. Do NOT lecture me on Evernote features you have never tested that I have.

Tell that to Ruby Tuesday employees. Millions of customers one day. Locked doors the next. Or, remember leviathan Montgomery Wards? Selling like mad at Christmas, and the entire chain closed and being liquidated the day after. Falcon Transport Company--723 trucks, 585 drivers, many of whom were en route to a delivery destination when the company closed and left the phones unattended. Sure, the Federal WARN Act offers employees some protection regarding advance notice of a company closing, but does Evernote have 100 employees to trigger the advanced warning? Irrelevant, because there is no requirement to warn customers. A company could close shop and just pay off the employees to cover the statutory damages to them. You may wish to Google the way Sams Club closes stores--no warnings given. Believe it or not, businesses do NOT broadcast "We are maybe going to be in bankruptcy soon" because creditors become "Cash in advance" while customers (the ones that don't immediately flee) start paying late, hoping you go under before they HAVE to pay the bill. Oh, and employees? They are busy sending out their resumes DURING work hours. Most businesses try to NOT broadcast financial concerns in the hopes that they weather the storm and make it through. With a publicly traded company, there is some transparency. With Evernote, or any other software/service company that is privately held, it would be stupid of them to broadcast problems up until the point that checks started bouncing. And, do you REALLY think that at a company where they are floundering, they are going to devote what few resources they have left to: 1. Making arrangements for your data to be protected by handing you off to the competitor that drove them under? 2. Try and maximize what little value is left in the company so that MAYBE they get 1 more paycheck? You can call me pessimistic if you like, but in 99 out of 100 times, when a company is in financial trouble, their customers are the absolute LAST thing they care about. When Evernote posts their financials, this debate *might be* settled. But we all know that Evernote has never provided their financials. Is Evernote going to go belly up tomorrow? Probably not. But do you know what else probably won't happen tomorrow? My death. But I still have a will, living will, durable power of attorney for finical matters, and living will for health care directives in place. Tell me, is that overly pessimistic of me? You would probably say no, it is not. But yet you call me overly pessimistic when I want to assure that *MY* data I have compiled over the decades, remains safe and usable? No. It is not overly pessimistic. It is acknowledging the possible risk of data loss if I do nothing, verses the time/effort expenditure I must make to minimize those risks. It took me 10 minutes to pull everything into Notion. I can afford those 10 minutes, just like I could afford the 2-3 hours it took to prepare my end-of-life documents. We all die. And all companies eventually go bankrupt. (See: Sears, Montgomery Wards, Toys-R-Us. And right now the Federal Bankruptcy courts are facing record numbers of companies going under because of COVID.) Do tell, do you think the fact that corporate and private America are tightening their belts are: 1. Good for Evernote subscriptions? 2. Irrelevant to Evernote subscriptions? 3. Bad for Evernote subscriptions? Oh, and then factor in that there are a slew up new companies that want Evernote's customers and are peeling away Evernote's user database. Pessimistic? YMMV, but for my own piece of mind, I have already implemented steps so that even if Evernote goes belly up tonight, I am working with my data tomorrow without a care. Oh, and my data is also mirrored to a separate HD on a networked computer. Was it pessimistic of me to set that up as well?

Because Evernote does not permit nested folders, you are give ONE and ONLY ONE "category" for a record. Evernote forces you to actually classify the qualities of a record via tags, and use those tags as your only effective way to sort out data. And more importantly, the only effective and efficient way to take the raw records and begin to compile them into useful groupings of information. The HTML format strips away those tags. In effect, you are left with hundreds--or tens of thousands--of records stored in a random order. Imagine a file cabinet full of pieces of paper, not sorted into any kind of order other than random. That is what Evernote exports to when it exports into an HTML format file. *IF* we had nested folders, then it would be possible to at least store the HTML files into an easily searched directory order without doing a manual review of ALL records every time we wanted to find materials on a particular subject. Yeah, I know, we will NEVER get nested folders. Evernote insists that we use tags instead to sort our data records. But then, during export to HTML file, those tags are stripped away. What we are left with is a box of 100% unsorted and unclassified documents. Might as well be a few hundred Chrome bookmarks in one folder in no particular order.

Except that solution basically leaves you with: 1. A proprietary format file or 2. Pretty... useless... HTML files. If I want to back up a regular database, I am hoping for more than 1,500 un-related documents stored as 1,500 text files on my PC. The only solution I can find is to have a second database program that can pull the database records directly from Evernote. The few I looked over all used the method of linking directly to your Evernote account, and did not use the .ENEX file. Not saying none will--just saying the few I looked at did not import from a .ENEX file. Oh well. I think my solution is to migrate what I *NEED* to a new program and keep both databases current so if one company goes belly up, I still have all my data in the other. Sort of like mirroring all your data files to a second PC so when the first one dies, you mourn its loss for 6 seconds and then get back to work. Inefficient, but at least it is effective.

Or, in the alternative, you could realize that every time mount one of your strawman attacks (graphics overhead is why records take so long to move, loading screen times are the measure of software speed, you either use Evernote or you will need your own NAS data storage architecture attached to your computer) you simply prove you have no real facts to bring to the discussion. You don't like Notion. You don't like the fact Evernote is losing customers to Notion. And to the other software platforms out there that are starting to push Evernote aside while they consume its dinner. Why? Why does that so deeply frighten you? You are like a Windows phone user who is upset that sales of Windows Phones are in the toilet, and is shouting at people that Windows is far superior to IOS or Android. No one is stopping you from using Evernote. You can wallpaper your walls with the word "Evernote". You can do a handfasting with a mannequin with the Evernote Elephant as its face. No one is stopping you from using Evernote, or even suggesting you are wrong for using it. As for us, we *know* Evernote has either failed us, or is in the process of failing us. All your protestations to the contrary are not going to convince anyone to use a product that, frankly, just doesn't cut it. This thread is about the final stage of using Evernote--safely retrieving your data and moving on. I know that somehow bothers you, but I just can't figure out why. If you worked for Evernote, I would get it--losing customers means a threat to your livelihood. But you don't work for Evernote. Why do you go into a panic rage whenever someone else decides that Evernote is no longer the software they want to use? And, please, don't answer that question. Just... think about it.

Nailed it! I don't care about bells and whistles AT ALL compared to knowing my data will remain MY data.

Legacy. .ENEX Format. 940 records for 318 meg. 22 seconds to crunch and store. For anything HUGE, you would go make a sandwich and eat it during the process. HTML. Exporting as a single HTML file: 4 seconds plus a couple of seconds to complete the storing. HUGE disadvantage though--it IS a single HTML file that you would have to manually split up. If all you wanted to do was searches for keywords, this would be viable, however. HTML Individual HTML pages: 14 seconds. HUGE disadvantage though--as it IS multiple files you would need to use something like the Windows "find text in documents" feature to find an individual record... And that is about as useful as flying to the moon by flapping your arms.

55K HTML files is as useful as 55K Chrome bookmarks. Yes, you could theoretically go back in and re-sort, re-tag, and re-associate all 55K webpages, but that is not a solution for most of us. Collecting the raw data is the first step, but you still go through and do a lot of your own work at making the raw data get assembled into something logical and useful. Be totally serious, if Evernote declared Bankruptcy tomorrow, and the server shut down, what would you do with your 55K records? Yes, you can look at them and verify they are there. But use them? Do Boolean searches? Now, having said that, if there any good indexing programs out there that can read, store, index, and sort a database of HTML files, then that could be a solution. (Frankly, I don't know of any.) Sadly, the only solution I see for our personal storehouses of information is having 2 different programs that each use the same library of records. One is for working--one is for backing up and using if the first one goes down. To that end, Notion will import 12 different formats, including live linking to the Evernote server and pulling in the records directly from there. (And, it works pretty good--except it WILL puke out when it hits an Evernote record with an empty table. That record will need to be moved elsewhere, or the empty table removed from the record, before it will import further.) I know Notion has a learning curve, but some of the demos I have seen on drag-and-drop for scheduling events and projects are pretty impressive. I know Evernote is perfect for some people. But for me, it has become little more than my own personal Google of previously copied data.

My data is not safe (at least to me) until I have a complete useable backup sitting on my HD that does not require Evernote to open it. And, Notion appears to be pulling in my Evernote data directly thus skipping to 1 Notebook at a time limit for exporting. (Although it it taking its sweet time on the notebook with 900+ records...) The HTML files was: 1. Choose the 904 record notebook. 2. Export as individual HTML files 3. 904 Sub-dirs were created with 1 picture in each. A few appear to have a file named "Evernote." (no extension) in them... ... and upon further review, 904 directories DOWN the list shows the HTML pages. OK, so the HTML export exported the pages AND also created a directory FOR each page where ... graphics and ... some other data was stored in a few of them. Yeah. HTML export is not going to be a viable backup solution. I will look into Notion and others... TY!

OK, I just actually looked at what Evernote does when it exports your data into HTML format, and needless to say, I was SHOCKED. Evernote's EXPORT feature does NOT export your data--it exports your pictures. And that is pretty much it. All text--gone. All links--gone. All tags--well, I didn't really expect those to export so that wasn't a surprise. Basically, in a Notebook of 900 entries, what was exported was 900 folders with 1 picture in each one. NO HTML page--no HTML anything. This scares the HELL out of me. My data is NOT safe. And yes, I could theoretically export it into the proprietary .ENEX format, but what the hell is that? How do I use that? Will other programs read that and pull it in properly? My data way too important to risk losing due to Evernote going belly-up. Is there any way to actually store ALL my data locally in a non-proprietary (i.e. useful) format? Or... Another program that will pull my current Evernote data into and then I can backup from?

Hey! Come on! Don't you like it when software companies eliminate features that were found in your software because they weren't found in other software??? Comin up next Evernote for the Raspberry Pi -- And the nerfing of all current versions to be 100% in sync with its ... features!

That is NOT fair! The current version of Evernote gets curb-stomped by a cardboard box next to your desk full of random papers!

God, this turkey just gets worse and worse... What is their purpose in NOT exporting the Notebook and Note-Id?

Ugh--no wonder people are missing it. It used to be a direct menu option. Now, is there any way to download your entire database at one time, or are you limited to each export only pulls 1 notebook?

You may wish to actually try doing it in 10. If you highlight a notebook, it assumes you are exporting the first note. If you highlight ALL the notes you want to export, you hit the 50 cap. I'm not the first to comment on this. If you can find a way to export a full notebook with say... 155 notes, please post it as it would save a lot of other people grief.