BillAmes 0 Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 I noticed when I (free user) sent myself an email that I had to be a pay member to do that. No problem with that but if you wish to show free users that the limited amount of storage is holding them back then allowing them to send emails will fill it up quicker. You may wish to think about that. I am a senior, 76, a retired senior software quality assurance engineer and enjoy helping make software better. Link to comment
Level 5* gazumped 11,656 Posted July 30, 2019 Level 5* Share Posted July 30, 2019 5 hours ago, BillAmes said: if you wish to show free users that the limited amount of storage is holding them back then allowing them to send emails will fill it up quicker. Hi. Thanks for the suggestion. We're a (mainly) user-supported Forum here, though Evernote staffers do read the content as and when they can. With 250M current users, the majority being non-payers, I'm sure Evernote would love to encourage more upgrades. But the extra revenue probably wouldn't cover the additional bandwidth and server costs of 100M more emails being processed... Link to comment
BillAmes 0 Posted July 31, 2019 Author Share Posted July 31, 2019 Do you have access to their business plan and their cost numbers of operating the "free" side? If I had access to this information I could focus my ideas so they would not be cost prohibited. With 250M users, most not paying their way it would seem the business needs a way to make the "pay way" the chosen highway. Link to comment
Level 5* gazumped 11,656 Posted July 31, 2019 Level 5* Share Posted July 31, 2019 Hi again - I'm just a user, so no more inside information than most. Evernote do welcome suggestions, so regardless of practicality please keep 'em comin'... I was just adding my opinion to your previous comment as we're all inclined to do around here - it's (usually) friendly comment, and always intended to be helpful. I think you're already on the same page as the -relatively- new Evernote CEO Ian Small, who said recently (on a completely different topic)... Link to comment
BillAmes 0 Posted July 31, 2019 Author Share Posted July 31, 2019 An interesting link. I have been involved in software development since the days of the first PCs. I was strictly involved with testing, SQA, and providing guidance to the developers. I worked on Managing Your Money and Tax Cut. Most recently, up until my retirement, qualifying a Time of Flight Mass Spectrometer. I also had to teach myself how to do a website and automated test using Wintask. I really appreciate how hard it is to do a consumer based product. In my brief time with Evernote I have seen many areas for improvement, in the product, in the process it supports and the business model. So far I do not know nearly enough to know if it is just first impressions or something in process. I must admit that I had not heard about the product until I saw a reference to it in a webpage where it was suggested to be used as recording notes. I do enjoy talking and will respond to all comments. I will also discuss my ideas (and look for ideas) on how to use the product. If it is to be successful it must support a process (I have not yet discovered how well it supports a process that I need.) I also look for tips on how to make use of this tool (I only use it on my PC) as phones are too small for my old eyes. I am usually sitting within three PC screens so when my cat takes over one I can switch to the other. My hobbies are photography, science, ham radio, anime and writing. I enjoy talking but I am sure management would prefer topics to be limited to their product. Is there a message feature here? I have not looked. As you can see I enjoy talking. Link to comment
Level 5* DTLow 5,736 Posted July 31, 2019 Level 5* Share Posted July 31, 2019 8 hours ago, BillAmes said: if you wish to show free users that the limited amount of storage is holding them back then allowing them to send emails will fill it up quicker. Evernote doesn't have a storage limit. There's a monthly upload limit but I'm not sure emails count. Currently allows 5 emails total for basic accounts A better incentive would be for this limit to be 5 emails monthly Link to comment
BillAmes 0 Posted July 31, 2019 Author Share Posted July 31, 2019 I think I was thinking about the monthly upload limit, not storage. And free does not allow emails so not applicable, I believe. I would like to see a display of how much of my limit I have used without the need to look for it. I am doing my best to see how useful the product is for free. Link to comment
Level 5* DTLow 5,736 Posted July 31, 2019 Level 5* Share Posted July 31, 2019 On 7/30/2019 at 8:06 PM, BillAmes said: I am doing my best to see how useful the product is for free. The free basic account allows the use of the Evernote services; the editor, data storage etc and a sample 5 emails The freemium theory is that in allowing use of the service users will realize how valuable it is and will switch to a paid account - the longer the use, the more valuable it becomes Each account tier has limits. More details at https://evernote.com/compare-plans and https://help.evernote.com/hc/en-us/articles/209005247-Evernote-system-limits Link to comment
BillAmes 0 Posted July 31, 2019 Author Share Posted July 31, 2019 I sent an email and did not see it anywhere where my notebooks are displayed. I am looking to see how useful it is but number one concern is not to reach a limit on uploads. If I put an image in a note I do not know how much room it takes. I am not motivated to experiment as it could make the tool useless for a month, hard to evaluate it that way. I am assuming that anything I put here is not counted against my limit. Free or paid the value should not change. If I were to be motivated to pay for it I would have to look for alternate ways, I do not like to spend. If this site cost the same as Hulu it has to be providing usefulness on par. Link to comment
Level 5* jefito 5,589 Posted July 31, 2019 Level 5* Share Posted July 31, 2019 11 hours ago, BillAmes said: I am doing my best to see how useful the product is for free. I use a premium version for my personal use, but I use a free version for work (software development). In the work account, I manage my tasks, do research, capture screen shots, debug and log info. I don't use the email feature, though I use the web clipper a fair amount. I have never even come close to hitting my upload limits. Truth-in-advertising, though: In my personal account, I maintain a good-sized notebook of computer and software development articles and literature (~1450 notes collected over the course of several jobs in 10 years of Evernote usage), which I share to my work account. Even so, that wouldn't have driven me over my upload limits either. The free account works fine for me, but it might not for you. On that note, I really don't know what you're asking for. Jeez, free is free, isn't it? Flip side: I gladly pay for my personal account. There's nothing else out there that I've seen that does what Evernote does; it just works for me. Quote If I put an image in a note I do not know how much room it takes. I am not motivated to experiment as it could make the tool useless for a month, hard to evaluate it that way. Feel free to ask questions, but it takes time to figure out what some other person wants out of a program. If you're not motivated enough to do some experimentation on your own, why should we fellow users be motivated to spend that time on your case? Quote Free or paid the value should not change. If I were to be motivated to pay for it I would have to look for alternate ways, I do not like to spend. If this site cost the same as Hulu it has to be providing usefulness on par. The paid version offers functionality that the free version does not. That's a value proposition right there, despite your belief that value should not change. Whether the price of a premium Evernote is worth it is a decision only you can make. The Hulu comparison is a false one, because Hulu and Evernote are in entirely different product categories. Link to comment
Level 5* DTLow 5,736 Posted July 31, 2019 Level 5* Share Posted July 31, 2019 47 minutes ago, BillAmes said: If I put an image in a note I do not know how much room it takes. I am not motivated to experiment as it could make the tool useless for a month, hard to evaluate it that way. The attached is a screenshot from my Mac showing notes in top list view Note the size column It's a direct relationship If you add a 5MB image into a note, the size will increase by 5MB >> If this site cost the same as Hulu it has to be providing usefulness on par. Hulu is totally useless at storing/organizing documents 🙂 Link to comment
Level 5* gazumped 11,656 Posted July 31, 2019 Level 5* Share Posted July 31, 2019 7 hours ago, BillAmes said: If I put an image in a note I do not know how much room it takes. I am not motivated to experiment as it could make the tool useless for a month, hard to evaluate it that way. If you inadvertently jam up the system with a large upload and have to hold operations for a period, there's no bar to opening one or more additional free account(s) - as long as you have unique email addresses to go with each one. I'm lucky (in one way*) in that I have two Gmail addresses and a few web-page related conventional email addresses. I have one main 'production' account and a couple of test accounts to play around in. Premium users (should you eventually decide to upgrade) get to swop easily between different accounts on a desktop. On Usage - there's a toolbar button here that will give you a snapshot ...and List view shows you the size of all notes (the actual columns you see are up to you - right click the headings for choices) (don't judge me for my titles - in some cases I'm asking for a friend... ) I'm not too far short of your age, and use a desktop account to help ameliorate memory lapses, a tablet on which to find and read user manuals ("pinch to expand" helps!) and a phone for (Duh) phone calls and taking pictures of objects that are inconvenient to scan into notes like book covers and box fronts. Your setup and use of Evernote will depend on your needs, but I'd suggest you start by converting all your daily paper inputs (the worthwhile ones, anyway) like receipts / leaflets / user guides etc into notes, and adding future events as reminders. Actually using Evernote is the best introduction into how it works and what bits of it are best suited to your needs. * the problem is that checking several mailboxes for new mail each day is a pain - I cheat by redirecting all my mail to one incoming address, which in itself can be confusing sometimes... Link to comment
BillAmes 0 Posted July 31, 2019 Author Share Posted July 31, 2019 I was just very disappointed to be told that I had exceeded a limit on posting for the day. I napped through the wait, a senior privileged I assure you. It would have been much better if management had thought it helpful to inform me about this limit. A mention above is made of a List View where I can see my usage but I see no place to select a List View. I did look at help videos on YT for Evernote. Not much for a newbie+freebie. So, how many bites at the apple do I get with respect to posts? I also note I am not seeing my profile image, perhaps that is only for paid people? As far as storing paper inputs I use dropbox for that. What I would use EN for is to manage my time on various projects. Evaluation continues... Link to comment
Level 5* jefito 5,589 Posted July 31, 2019 Level 5* Share Posted July 31, 2019 29 minutes ago, BillAmes said: I was just very disappointed to be told that I had exceeded a limit on posting for the day. I napped through the wait, a senior privileged I assure you. It would have been much better if management had thought it helpful to inform me about this limit. A mention above is made of a List View where I can see my usage but I see no place to select a List View. I did look at help videos on YT for Evernote. Not much for a newbie+freebie. https://evernote.com/compare-plans 29 minutes ago, BillAmes said: So, how many bites at the apple do I get with respect to posts? I also note I am not seeing my profile image, perhaps that is only for paid people? The forum is for everyone. Brand new users get some moderation, I think with some limits to prevent spammers, but you should be able to bite the apple down to the seeds. Rules on forum membership here: Link to comment
Level 5 PinkElephant 8,088 Posted July 31, 2019 Level 5 Share Posted July 31, 2019 @BillAmes Hello to the forum, always nice to have some more Engineering guys around. Just do not apply engineers logic on what the marketing dptmt believes to be good customer nudging. The Basic account is not meant to be comfortable for any user with serious intentions. In the end, only the paying passengers keep the boat afloat. So it is meant to cut into the flesh here and then, just to remind that there is more comfortable attire available for a small donation. But there are more uses to Basic accounts: - Entry-level try out is one of them, like you use it - Another is to accommodate users who just enter because they got a shared notebook from somebody else. They probably do not need the Premium features to use the share. I am sharing a notebook containing my tax stuff with my accountant every year. He gets it, downloads it, digests it, and tells me when I can remove the share again. Very easy for both of us, and I do not get „1 month Evernote“ invoiced from him, because he can do his job on Basic. - A final use is probably out of scope for marketing, but I like it anyhow: You can build your database and then decide that enough is enough. Because there is no storage and no download limit, you can downgrade to a Basic account, and still use all the stuff you have (though without the full search feature, which hurts). There is no locking in if you leave for good, and as long as you keep your account, your data will be there. If you upgrade again, the features will be back even on the old stuff, and on everything you have entered while on Basic. One advise: When you download and modify a note, it will sync in total and count against your upload limit. So better avoid this with large notes. You can create another note with the new text plus a link to the original note. This will just upload a handful of bytes instead of the full content. And another one: Your upload is treated on the server all the same, whether on Basic or Premium. So there is all the nice stuff waiting for you when you upgrade. As an example: You damaged some important notes by accident. One strategy can be now to upgrade for just one month. You get Premium, go to the note history (versioning) that is now available, set the damaged notes back, maybe create copies with the content, and fall back to Basic again. Saving your notes in this situation will not cost you more than 2 trips to your local Starbucks, maybe less. Cool, isn’t it ?! Link to comment
BillAmes 0 Posted July 31, 2019 Author Share Posted July 31, 2019 I can not delete the notebook I named ToBeDeleted. A delete option is not present in the options list. I am also waiting for help on how to view usage for my notebooks as part of some View option. I am not seeing my profile image, I did set and save it. I am off replying to a different post now. Thank everyone for help. Link to comment
BillAmes 0 Posted July 31, 2019 Author Share Posted July 31, 2019 3 minutes ago, PinkElephant said: Just do not apply engineers logic on what the marketing dptmt believes to be good customer nudging. I have had a lot of interaction with the developers. It takes time to build a good relationship when all i do is bring them problems (they caused by commission or omission or just being evil) but they are generally redeemable. Some are actually my friends. When I approach any software I bring the full power of a diligent and easy to annoy the skills of a senior Software Quality Assurance engineer (me.) The only thing worse than poorly conceived, designed and implemented software are the associated help that is usually done not by an experienced user that can understand that a product must support a process, it is not just a framework on which to hang features. So far, I have not made any decision on this product. I am now retired and live on a budget, what is a cup of coffee to some is not a consideration on my menu. I will say that my services are always for hire, if a product is in need it will not fix itself. So far I am evaluating the product as an aid to tracking progress from multiple PCs for my creative writing efforts. A screenplay, story, visual novel, science articles. And more. I see below an image from a different reply i made, do I have to see them? Link to comment
BillAmes 0 Posted July 31, 2019 Author Share Posted July 31, 2019 I have a new question but I could not find my way to this forum to ask a new question. So I will continue here. I suppose the first question should be, where is a direct link to these forums? Next question, I have created some notebooks and what to create a custom note and then copy and paste it into each note book, how do i do that? The copy and paste part. Link to comment
Level 5* DTLow 5,736 Posted August 1, 2019 Level 5* Share Posted August 1, 2019 27 minutes ago, BillAmes said: where is a direct link to these forums? I have the forum bookmarked in my browser There's a link at the bottom of the www.evernote.com home page Link to comment
Level 5* CalS 5,280 Posted August 1, 2019 Level 5* Share Posted August 1, 2019 44 minutes ago, BillAmes said: Next question, I have created some notebooks and what to create a custom note and then copy and paste it into each note book, how do i do that? The copy and paste part. Right click on the note and click Copy Note. As an old QA engineer I assume you know the risks of redundant data? Link to comment
Level 5* DTLow 5,736 Posted August 1, 2019 Level 5* Share Posted August 1, 2019 1 hour ago, BillAmes said: I have created some notebooks and what to create a custom note and then copy and paste it into each note book An alternative is to assign multiple tags to a single note Did you have a specific requirement for notebooks? (sync'd/local, private/shared, offline) Link to comment
BillAmes 0 Posted August 1, 2019 Author Share Posted August 1, 2019 14 minutes ago, CalS said: Right click on the note and click Copy Note. I right clicked on the Note name in various places where it is displayed and do not see a Copy Note selection option. 11 minutes ago, DTLow said: Did you have a specific requirement for notebooks? I am developing a process as I go, I see potential, just some bumps in the road that are being addressed here. Link to comment
Level 5* DTLow 5,736 Posted August 1, 2019 Level 5* Share Posted August 1, 2019 13 minutes ago, BillAmes said: I right clicked on the Note name in various places Was one of the places the Note List panel? It would be easier to troubleshoot if you post a screenshot Link to comment
BillAmes 0 Posted August 1, 2019 Author Share Posted August 1, 2019 The note is named Log Link to comment
Level 5* DTLow 5,736 Posted August 1, 2019 Level 5* Share Posted August 1, 2019 10 hours ago, BillAmes said: The note is named Log You're posting in the Evernote/Windows forum, but I suspect you're using Evernote/Web To duplicate a note, click on the overflow menu at the top right corner of the note >>I can not delete the notebook I named ToBeDeleted. A delete option is not present in the options list. Click on the notebook, then the overflow menu Link to comment
Level 5 PinkElephant 8,088 Posted August 1, 2019 Level 5 Share Posted August 1, 2019 6 hours ago, BillAmes said: Next question, I have created some notebooks and what to create a custom note and then copy and paste it into each note book, how do i do that? The copy and paste part. You can create a note that has everything you want. Then you save it as a „template“. Whenever you create a new blank note, you can choose to use a template (right on top of the new note, directly under the header). Pick your template, and the new note takes is created as a copy. Because the template exists just once, you can modify it at will. Just create a note, adapt it, and save it as a new template. If I correctly remember, there is a limit of 20 individual templates per account, plus the standard templates that come with EN. So do some housekeeping. Link to comment
BillAmes 0 Posted August 1, 2019 Author Share Posted August 1, 2019 Seems I would have to pay $$$ to do it by template, I just want to copy and paste thank you. Link to comment
Level 5 PinkElephant 8,088 Posted August 1, 2019 Level 5 Share Posted August 1, 2019 As I have mentioned above, the Basic account is not for serious work. I always forget about what is Basic and what is Premium, otherwise I would not have suggested templates. Makes me feel again that I get some Bang for my Bucks ... Link to comment
Level 5* jefito 5,589 Posted August 1, 2019 Level 5* Share Posted August 1, 2019 56 minutes ago, BillAmes said: Seems I would have to pay $$$ to do it by template, I just want to copy and paste thank you. You do not need to use the Evernote template system. Keeping your own template notes is easy, and you get behaviors that are better anyway, like the fact that tags are retained when you do your own templates, but are not -- at least last I knew -- with the Evernote template system. There is no copy/paste operation for notes, but you can duplicate it. Link to comment
Level 5* gazumped 11,656 Posted August 1, 2019 Level 5* Share Posted August 1, 2019 Before Templates I used to use an ENEX file. In Evernote Windows, create your "template" layout (or find a note you created already) Export that single note to an ENEX file saved on your desktop (or a special 'template' folder) Double-click the desktop ENEX file to create a new copy of the original file in Evernote Edit the template as required Double-click the desktop ENEX file again for another copy. Link to comment
BillAmes 0 Posted August 1, 2019 Author Share Posted August 1, 2019 I evaluate software very carefully. I am a dedicated dropbox user but have seen things that are really not representative of a good product. However I know enough about the world of software to know areas that have limits that a developer just avoids at all cost. So I accept that it is not a perfect world. I also evaluate the business behind a product and how it treats its customers. This includes how well they support the help a new user might need, documentation, how well thought out a product appears, a lot of little things. I am a dedicated user of Corel PaintShop Pro and the associated video program. It suffers from many of the problems of a poorly documented software product. I do provide feedback. My initial impression of the marketing department for Evernote leaves a lot to be desired. It seems they lack common sense on how to sell the new "free" user on going to the pay for play plan. I have no problem with limited functionality for the free side, but they make no real effort to make the initial user experience totally painless. Users who have experience with software will bring expectations and when those expectations are not met because of the free vs pay routes that are not explained up front it just makes the experience negative. A software product needs to support a process, if your going to have free vs pay you still need to support a viable process in the free mode. One might say, well, if the free is good enough we can not make money. And I would say, make the pay way so good it will be obvious after a few months that the free user will willingly upgrade. The decisions by management on what is in the free vs pay route seem to me to be arbitrary, to be selections made by the bean counters in finance, not by expert users who know how the free path should be used to entice those users, not by blindsiding them with intentionally breaking the process the free path should provide. Link to comment
Level 5* DTLow 5,736 Posted August 1, 2019 Level 5* Share Posted August 1, 2019 1 hour ago, BillAmes said: Users who have experience with software will bring expectations and when those expectations are not met because of the free vs pay routes that are not explained up front it just makes the experience negative. I thought Evernote was very clear on the plans with documentation like https://evernote.com/compare-plans and https://help.evernote.com/hc/en-us/articles/209005247-Evernote-system-limits Link to comment
Level 5* jefito 5,589 Posted August 1, 2019 Level 5* Share Posted August 1, 2019 Personally, I don't care whether anyone uses Evernote basic or a paid version, or their personal views on how Evernote chooses to run their company. Pontificate all you want, and you'll get yawns from me at best, except maybe if the potification includes factual errors. Ask actual questions about how Evernote can be used, and I'm a lot more likely to respond and try to help. Concrete suggestions made here seem to have gone ignored in favor of more pontification, so I'm out. Good luck with that. Link to comment
BillAmes 0 Posted August 1, 2019 Author Share Posted August 1, 2019 Not a problem. I use all the feedback I receive and devise the best workarounds I can, given the products limitations. These forums are where the signs indicate that this is where management wishes to receive product feedback and they are my target audience. I enjoy discussing all aspects of a product and it can be difficult at times to find someone with the necessary passion. At my age I have learned to never give up on a product and I enjoy providing feedback. It is not always welcome but it is always good advice based on what I know of a company and their product. As I learn more I will help more, that is who I am, that is my profession. There is no charge for this level of interaction, if more detailed feedback is desired one my ask about the paid level of support. Thank you for your help, it has been appreciated. Link to comment
BillAmes 0 Posted August 1, 2019 Author Share Posted August 1, 2019 2 hours ago, DTLow said: I thought Evernote was very clear on the plans with documentation like https://evernote.com/compare-plans and https://help.evernote.com/hc/en-us/articles/209005247-Evernote-system-limits The information in these links has little meaning to those trying to learn the product. Once I have figured out enough I could evaluate the available help and how easy it is to access this help. Eventually, if I like the product well enough I might do a write up on it (the free "it") and try to get them interested. What I am seeing so far is a usable tool (if you know how to use it) but so far the jury is out on the "useful" attribute. Quick question I see that "Evernote User; not an employee" is your identification, how do I identify those responsible for this place? Link to comment
Level 5* DTLow 5,736 Posted August 1, 2019 Level 5* Share Posted August 1, 2019 1 hour ago, BillAmes said: Quick question I see that "Evernote User; not an employee" is your identification, how do I identify those responsible for this place? Employees are identified in the sidebar with Link to comment
Level 5 PinkElephant 8,088 Posted August 1, 2019 Level 5 Share Posted August 1, 2019 Non-employees as well, and protected species are identifiable by their avatar 🐘 Link to comment
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