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Don Dz

ANSWERED Deletion of extra space before table, sticking?

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I thought tables always insisted on adding an annoying extra space before the table, it is the case at least with new notes, but recently I created some expanded tables with multiple merged cells, links, and colors (in a couple of older notes), and found that in both of these cases, it is allowing me to remove the extra space without automatically adding it back. (I am using 6:17 GA, if it matters)

Anyone notice noticed this?  Until EN programmers remove the extra space behavior,  I am hoping to discover how to exploit this "bug" that allows me to make it permanently go away.

Since I cannot recreate this behavior from scratch, I copied and pasted the relevant part of one of the "buggy" notes into a new note, which retained the lack of extra space at the top, so I removed personal data from the table to share it here.Image.thumb.png.5541478657a1a6d695cc526ed086d91c.png

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I think you're talking about the extra line-break/spacing that EN adds above a table, and as distinct from the just larger spacing EN applies to a line of text that is placed directly above a table, (as per your image), and as compared to the regular reduced line-spacing EN applies between two lines of text.

I too don't like this additional line-break added above a table. Someone once gave me a good techy explanation for it, but I can't remember. Also, how large/small/number of columns-rows/formatting etc of the Table has no impact on this line-break behaviour. 

In any case I have found 2-Workarounds to remove the additional line-break are:

  1. Add your Table 1st... Then place cursor directly above table, and enter your text
  2. If Text added 1st, followed by a Table, (EN inserts additional line) > Select/Highlight Text, and Drag to the line directly above the Table

To check, sync and exit the Note, then come back in to see if it was saved

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1 hour ago, RavBoy said:

In any case I have found 2-Workarounds to remove the additional line-break are:

  1. Add your Table 1st... Then place cursor directly above table, and enter your text
  2. If Text added 1st, followed by a Table, (EN inserts additional line) > Select/Highlight Text, and Drag to the line directly above the Table

To check, sync and exit the Note, then come back in to see if it was saved

Wow, thanks, this is exactly the kind of information I was looking for!

The second workaround works well, the first sometimes fails, probably because of the bug that makes a brand new note not be able to accept a table.  I also found that sometimes if text is removed before the last line before a table, it also fails.  So the 2nd trick seems more reliable.

Now I need to figure out other situations, like the space immediately between two tables, etc., maybe the dragging trick might work for that.

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12 hours ago, Don Dz said:

I thought tables always insisted on adding an annoying extra space before the table

I think Weekly is on the extra line.  I have never been able to delete that line,.  No matter what you do there will be a blank line and a line for the table UI above the table.  You can use the blank line for text per your example, can do anything with the UI line(s).

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Hrrmm, just what I need -- to spend a long time hacking Evernote to get my note looking just exactly perfect via some specific sequence which may be repeatable but will likely need to change in the next release. Good luck, great detective work and all that, but no thanks. I'll just stick to the basics and spend my dwindling brain cells elsewhere. Content is king, presentation only secondary.

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1 minute ago, jefito said:

Hrrmm, just what I need -- to spend a long time hacking Evernote to get my note looking just exactly perfect via some specific sequence which may be repeatable but will likely need to change in the next release. Good luck, great detective work and all that, but no thanks. I'll just stick to the basics and spend my dwindling brain cells elsewhere. Content is king, presentation only secondary.

Sayeth the Snippet king!  :P   Joke.

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Just now, CalS said:

Sayeth the Snippet king!  :P   Joke.

:) Snippet view works well for me because:

  • Reminders list
  • 7 +-  2 Rule (try to narrow search results to a small subset, easier than working harder getting exact match for one note)
  • Quick overview of note content and meta stuff

But overall, the approach is not to work so hard for diminished returns. In this case, if I need presentation-ready stuff, I'll just use Word.

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10 minutes ago, jefito said:

Content is king, presentation only secondary.

Let's see, would this count as heresy or just blasphemy in the contemporary business/marketing/political world? :D Remember, any content however flawed can succeed as long as the presentation is right. I live in the U.S. We have a president....

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1 minute ago, jefito said:

But overall, the approach is not to work so hard for diminished returns.

Agreed, 100%. 

Tables have become special as the current incarnation didn't pay as much attention as it might have to overall note formatting. 

  1. the fixed UI as opposed to floating
  2. the indentation of the note body in all notes
  3. the extra line between/above tables
  4. the drop down arrow that hides text in a cell

I, as you, say "Whatever, I can make it work".  But am stumped as to why a company that continues to make minor visual tweaks to its UI let's this stuff be.  And I can't use PhraseExpress to fix it.  :(

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3 hours ago, CalS said:

I think Weekly is on the extra line.  I have never been able to delete that line,.  No matter what you do there will be a blank line and a line for the table UI above the table.  You can use the blank line for text per your example, can do anything with the UI line(s).

Have you tried the solutions shared by RavBoy?  I find they do indeed allow for the removal of the extra space to remain.  Per my picture example, the result is not a snug fit (at least not in Windows), but the extra space is reduced by a full line, by half basically. 

The result looks even better in iOS and Android.

I am satisfied with both the result, and how easy it is to implement it, even if no one else is. 

Evernote sometimes takes years (literally) to fix some problems, so I welcome any partial solutions now.

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2 hours ago, jefito said:

But overall, the approach is not to work so hard for diminished returns. In this case, if I need presentation-ready stuff, I'll just use Word.

Funny you mention Word, I have found pasting from Word can sometimes make my notes go quite crazy, get stuck, become uneditable, unexpected behaviors, etc. 

I only use it if I am confident I will not try to edit the result again, especially when cleaning up web data.

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2 hours ago, Don Dz said:

 

Have you tried the solutions shared by RavBoy?  I find they do indeed allow for the removal of the extra space to remain.  Per my picture example, the result is not a snug fit (at least not in Windows), but the extra space is reduced by a full line, by half basically. 

The result looks even better in iOS and Android.

I am satisfied with both the result, and how easy it is to implement it, even if no one else is. 

Evernote sometimes takes years (literally) to fix some problems, so I welcome any partial solutions now.

We may be talking about different things, I can't delete the top line in a note with the table first.  Can use it, can't delete it.

ScreenClip.png.746182dbc2556318cb635bde460e06c4.png

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3 hours ago, Don Dz said:

Funny you mention Word, I have found pasting from Word can sometimes make my notes go quite crazy, get stuck, become uneditable, unexpected behaviors, etc. 

Um, meaning that I would use the Word document as an attachment...

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57 minutes ago, CalS said:

We may be talking about different things, I can't delete the top line in a note with the table first.  Can use it, can't delete it.

True, creating the table first doesn't remove the first extra space, but it can remove the second under some circumstances.

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27 minutes ago, jefito said:

Um, meaning that I would use the Word document as an attachment...

Got it, though in that case there would be no editable content to view within Evernote.  Which is what I usually use tables for.

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11 hours ago, jefito said:

spend a long time hacking Evernote to get my note looking just exactly perfect

Hey Jefito, only takes a second to drag-n-drop the text (or even to cut-n-paste it)...she's not perfect but removing the line-break uses less real estate, less scrolling, and views better on Android... so I'm happy to spend the short 1-sec time to do it 😉 No doubt this is a legacy from my OCD keeping neat notes at school thingy.

11 hours ago, jefito said:

which may be repeatable but will likely need to change in the next release

so far this small workaround has worked over past 5 updates... or past year approx, but yeah hopefully EN can fix it one day, small thing though

11 hours ago, jefito said:

great detective work

Appreciate the compliment 😃 from the Master 😉

11 hours ago, jefito said:

spend my dwindling brain cells elsewhere

Please don't! I/we need you xoxoxoxo

11 hours ago, jefito said:

Content is king, presentation only secondary.

1st, I learned it's not what you know; it's who you know... then I realised it's actually both!  But full disclosure I use to be Country manager for a Business intelligence App on top of SAP...me biased slightly towards presentation... crikey I find myself align to Trump...yikes

10 hours ago, CalS said:
  • the indentation of the note body in all notes
  • the extra line between/above tables
  • the drop down arrow that hides text in a cell

Be really great if EN fixed these things...especially 1st and last points

8 hours ago, Don Dz said:

I have found pasting from Word can sometimes make my notes go quite crazy, get stuck, become uneditable

I just move the whole MS Word Doc to EN (I don't have much need these days to paste sections of a Word Doc), then delete it from my PC... then just open and edit the Doc from EN.  If I don't delete the original on the PC, that Doc wont get edited, when editing the doc attached in EN, so get a mismatch of doc versions.

Small issues flow from this approach though e.g. Word Doc Attachment in EN date/time of edit/update is NOT shown!... it just always just shows the date/time you 1st attached the Doc to EN.  And the Ms Word Doc you attach should have been created using a latest version of MS-Word, else you may experience issues if editing it from other devices/platforms other than EN-for-Windows. But at least you get all the goodies of MS Word (navigation pane/formatting etc) and all held in EN...

these again are just my own experiences thus far.  And I too recall having similar issues with copy/paste Sections-of-a-MS-Word doc to EN.

5 hours ago, CalS said:

We may be talking about different things, I can't delete the top line in a note with the table first.

Do NOT Delete the top line!  Just place cursor on that top-line position and type.  doesn't matter if table is on first line of a new notes body, an existing note, or whatever.  There has been the rare occasion where neither of my 2 workarounds work... in which case what I do is, still remove the line break, copy the whole line of text+table, then re-paste into a position a few lines above or below on the same note, and that has worked... in any case I have ALWAYS been able to remove that line-break, and have it retained through various EN updates etc

Love you guys....

P.S. Even had to remove spaces from the text lines and quote boxes....hahahah

 

 

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14 hours ago, RavBoy said:

Do NOT Delete the top line!

But I would like to be able to delete the top line and start the note with the table.  Not the biggest issue in the world, but if I had my druthers.  

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