Jump to content
There is a known issue that is preventing users from logging into the discussion forums. We're in the process of fixing this issue as quickly as possible, and will notify you once the issue has been resolved. Thank you for your patience! Read more... ×
  • 1
Nick Nassiri

Evernote for Windows 6.13 Beta 1

Idea

Hello Evernoters,

Today we're announcing the availability of version 6.13 Beta 1. You can download it here or check for updates (make sure you've opted in to get Beta updates from Options.) 

We are aware of and working on issues that still exist. I encourage early adopters to give this a try and share your feedback!

Thanks,
Nick and the Windows Team at Evernote

-----------------

Release Notes for Version 6.13

Note: Version 6.13 is supported in Windows 7 and higher.

Improved (cumulative changes since version 6.12):

  • We inform the user if we're unable to continue recording audio (e.g., out of disk space)
  • Users are prevented from making content changes when the Evernote client database is locked by another process (e.g., antivirus scanner)
  • Evernote client asks once and remembers when you don't want to see a "note move" notification.
  • More easily manage and navigate your notebooks from the Notebooks View. You can access this by selecting 'Notebooks' from the left panel.
  • Messaging to alert the user when they're approaching their notebook limit

Fixed (cumulative changes since version 6.12):

  • We gracefully handle when some video cards incorrectly report their capabilities
  • Some users were intermittently unable to add a new note. We patched that.
  • Numbered lists keep their numbering sequence intact consistently
  • Drag & Drop of files and documents from Evernote to other apps
  • Keyboard shortcut for renaming Notebook Stacks now consistently works
  • Note statistics remain on screen when expected
  • Misc. product bug fixes and improvements.
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post

78 replies to this idea

Recommended Posts

  • 2

Bug report.  Drag and drop from the main EN window to a note in it's own window seems not to work anymore. 

Geez.  Somebody need to take a breath, sit down with the editor, and just fix it once and for all.  It's been months that things are sliding in and out of working.  

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
  • 2
2 hours ago, Ethan Mings said:

Either take the advice of people in the forum or simply close it.  It's not fair to ask to ask for advice, then go off in a new direction and disregard the advice.

Exactly. Either post betas and say "hey, here is new stuff. But no one from Evernote will be following the feedback" and let us fend for ourselves with peer support, or use the feedback to implement bug fixes, but stop ignoring the pleas for stability and fixes while adding new unrequested features. Maybe disband the Emoji team and put them on bug fixes?

 

This is why I stopped participating in the iOS beta. Evernote effectively shut down the feedback forum for that which got rid of peer to peer support as well.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
  • 1
39 minutes ago, dconnet said:

It will. It's turned off by default right now due to some serious performance issues. I'm in the process of cleaning this up now... (We decided it was better to turn it off temporarily rather than wait for my changes.)

Figured it was something like that. Thankful that where I work, we tend to not run constant live betas like you folks do.

The thing that would be nice would be to make a note of stuff like that in the release notes, whoever's in charge of those.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
12 minutes ago, s2sailor said:

Did I miss the 6.12 public release?

Yeah, my thought exactly...

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0

@Nick Nassiri - I know you say known existing bugs are 'in progress', but any details on work chat?  Should I just source an alternative system instead?  
(details here: http://www.evernote.com/l/AJD5jlwwy3pLP7W5y3gIJotcXcZCF67QEgE/ )

And a friendly reminder about invisible tags... it ends up being quite frustrating trying to be productive.
http://www.evernote.com/l/AJDRYO7yD5pNGqe8lTVHvR9A-JyKoYf4NZA/

 

Thanks for the fix on the numbered list ordering!

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
3 hours ago, ej8899 said:

@Nick Nassiri - I know you say known existing bugs are 'in progress', but any details on work chat?  Should I just source an alternative system instead?  
(details here: http://www.evernote.com/l/AJD5jlwwy3pLP7W5y3gIJotcXcZCF67QEgE/ )

And a friendly reminder about invisible tags... it ends up being quite frustrating trying to be productive.
http://www.evernote.com/l/AJDRYO7yD5pNGqe8lTVHvR9A-JyKoYf4NZA/

 

Thanks for the fix on the numbered list ordering!

 

We tried to squeeze a fix for the Work Chat issue into this version, but we still have a few more kinks to work out. Until this is resolved, please drag and drop the notebooks you need to share directly into the thread that previously worked. If you need to share a single note the workaround is a few more steps: 

  1. Select: View > Shortcuts  > Show in Left Panel
  2. Add the notes you need to share to your shortcuts
  3. Drag and drop the notes from the Shortcut section into the working Work Chat thread

The tag issue is still in our backlog. Thanks again for that report. 
 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
30 minutes ago, Nick Nassiri said:

We didn't release 6.12 publically

Thanks, though I was pretty sure I knew the answer so my post was somewhat rhetorical, but that does beg the question, why?  Just curious.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
1 hour ago, Nick Nassiri said:

We didn't release 6.12 publically.

 

If a tree falls in the forest....  😉

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0

BTW, for all you emoji lovers out there, I just discovered a new Windows hotkey (well, two): Win+. or Win+; (that's Windows key + period or semicolon) bring up a sweet emoji picker. Open up a note, press Win+., and you can click an emoji and it's entered right into your note!! Works in the last 6.12 beta, and I'll just bet that it works in the 6.13 beta, which I'll install presently...

No. No need to thank me... 😏

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
4 hours ago, jefito said:

BTW, for all you emoji lovers out there, I just discovered a new Windows hotkey (well, two): Win+. or Win+; (that's Windows key + period or semicolon) bring up a sweet emoji picker. Open up a note, press Win+., and you can click an emoji and it's entered right into your note!! Works in the last 6.12 beta, and I'll just bet that it works in the 6.13 beta, which I'll install presently...

No. No need to thank me... 😏

Ooh yes, so there is.

Doesn't actually work though: in 6.13 clicking on an emoji does nothing except highlight it, it's not inserted into the note.

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0

As per the release notes:   "- More easily manage and navigate your notebooks from the Notebooks View. You can access this by selecting 'Notebooks' from the left panel."
When I click on 'Notebooks' in the left panel, only a list of all notes appears in the note panel.

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
27 minutes ago, Liam Gretton said:

Doesn't actually work though: in 6.13 clicking on an emoji does nothing except highlight it, it's not inserted into the note.

A bit more digging and the picker turns out to be a Windows 10 feature, not part of EN. But it only works with a US keyboard layout (I use GB). You can flip quickly with Alt+space, then the emoji picker works... for other applications but still not in EN! So Microsoft:0, Evernote:0.

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
3 hours ago, Liam Gretton said:

A bit more digging and the picker turns out to be a Windows 10 feature, not part of EN. But it only works with a US keyboard layout (I use GB). You can flip quickly with Alt+space, then the emoji picker works... for other applications but still not in EN! So Microsoft:0, Evernote:0.

I did say that it was a Windows hotkey (" a system wide shortcut that is always available in all contexts"), not an Evernote thingie. And, for me at least, and in 6.12 and the latest 6.13, it works as described. Bring up a note, ensure the note body has focus (click in it), press Win+;, and select your favorite emoji(s) there, and they're inserted into the text. They don't work in the title area, however, where they really might be useful...

4 hours ago, maggiemay said:

As per the release notes:   "- More easily manage and navigate your notebooks from the Notebooks View. You can access this by selecting 'Notebooks' from the left panel."
When I click on 'Notebooks' in the left panel, only a list of all notes appears in the note panel.

That's what I see as well -- looks like that feature has gone on holiday, at least for the time being.

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
13 hours ago, CalS said:

If a tree falls in the forest....  😉

....does that mean it was so infested with bugs that it died and fell over?

Is that how that statement goes?

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
1 hour ago, EdH said:

....does that mean it was so infested with bugs that it died and fell over?

Is that how that statement goes?

Not quite, though it does raise the question of how come for why the tree went down. 

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
On 5/11/2018 at 2:44 AM, maggiemay said:

As per the release notes:   "- More easily manage and navigate your notebooks from the Notebooks View. You can access this by selecting 'Notebooks' from the left panel."
When I click on 'Notebooks' in the left panel, only a list of all notes appears in the note panel.

Confirmed, the Notebooks view is not working.  

That was one feature I did like in the last beta.  

Will it be coming back?

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
On 5/10/2018 at 7:04 PM, Nick Nassiri said:
  • More easily manage and navigate your notebooks from the Notebooks View. You can access this by selecting 'Notebooks' from the left panel. 

Not working in 6.13.1.7192

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0

I just spent some reading through reviews of Evernote and comments by users on other forums.  Overall, some people are happy.  Other are really, really unhappy.  I struck by the number of comments about features that no longer work (maps), "buggy betas" and releases that "don't offer anything new".  I even read an entire thread where the users believe the company is soon to be sold.  

I am a big fan of the product.  However, in the last year, I cannot make sense of the direction.  The release of spaces is exciting, yet, no real timeline for the general public use.  The Windows product is less than stable and then I see growing frustration in external forums and this forum about the lack of clear direction and response to issues.  

Communication is vital in this world.  I would encourage the Evernote Team to think very carefully about the following.

a) If you are going to ask people to beta test something, then don't release a beta full of new features and then break the old ones.  I have read this complaint over and over again in the last year.  Please, listen to the people who are trying to give you good advice.

 

c) When betas are posted, release a full list of the fixes and what is still pending.  Each bug should have a tracking number and the fix should include the bug number and what was fixed.

d) Get us to a rock solid, bug-free version quickly.  The general public deserves to see the power of this product.  Not being left to figure what works and does not work everytime they move to an updated version.  I was amazed how poorly drag and drop worked and how many comments I read about people having their workflow process broken. Please, stop breaking core features that impact workflow.

e) Make a decision.  Either take the advice of people in the forum or simply close it.  It's not fair to ask to ask for advice, then go off in a new direction and disregard the advice.  If you are not going to use the advice, then tell people right up front.  They can then determine how to best spend their time and if they want to support the product through the development stage.  

 

It has been a long year.  I've learned and read a lot in the year.  One thing I can say with confidence.  Our beta testing program is broken.  I want to see this great product survive and thrive.

Please, fix the beta testing process and listen to your customers. 

 

Edited by Ethan Mings
typo
  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
On 5/10/2018 at 11:44 PM, maggiemay said:

As per the release notes:   "- More easily manage and navigate your notebooks from the Notebooks View. You can access this by selecting 'Notebooks' from the left panel."
When I click on 'Notebooks' in the left panel, only a list of all notes appears in the note panel.

Can confirm this, clicking on the notebook icon with the left panel open changes focus to All Notes (not how it worked with 6.12).  Clicking on the notebook icon with left panel closed changes focus to notebook selection (how it worked with 6.12).

Also, the All Notes icon has been removed from the left panel, which is a great move as far as I am concerned.  ☺️

And the new emoji picker here in the forums is like molasses sometimes ....  😞

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
2 hours ago, Ethan Mings said:

Make a decision.  Either take the advice of people in the forum or simply close it.

I've been a long time user and appreciate the forums for everything I learned, and the help received from other users.

I'm also a beta tester, and use the release discussions to post issues.

It's also a good tool to post feature requests; for users to indicate their support; to discuss.
I'm also aware that Evernote is under no obligation to implement the requests and advise, and there are other factors in prioritizing development work.

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
1 minute ago, DTLow said:

I've been a long time user and appreciate the forums for everything I learned, and the help received from other users.

I'm also a beta tester, and use the release discussions to post issues.

It's also a good tool to post feature requests; for users to indicate their support; to discuss.
I'm also aware that Evernote is under no obligation to implement the requests and advise, and there are other factors in development work.

Try testing the windows version....   😞

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
1 hour ago, CalS said:

Try testing the windows version....   😞

I get my entertainment 😱  in testing IOS and Mac.  
I still appreciate the forums, and wouldn't want them closed.

Also I do have the option of sitting out the testing, particularly beta's, or simply not installing upgrades.

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
Just now, DTLow said:

I get my entertainment 😱  in testing IOS and Mac.  

I do have the option of sitting out the testing, particularly beta's, or imply not installing upgrades.

At least the pain is shared....   😉

Pain needs to go away though.  We should be testing more intricate features, not whether drag and drop works or the cursor stays where it is supposed to stay.  🤕

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
On 5/12/2018 at 3:55 AM, Ethan Mings said:

Confirmed, the Notebooks view is not working.  

That was one feature I did like in the last beta.  

Will it be coming back?

I hope not. Maybe they removed the code to work on existing bugs instead of niche new features.

  • Sad 1

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
28 minutes ago, EdH said:

This is why I stopped participating in the iOS beta. Evernote effectively shut down the feedback forum for that which got rid of peer to peer support as well.

Funny thing is I think IOS has had the most improvements in speed and stability in the last year, at least for me.  Still has cross platform formatting snafus, reminder sort issues, but overall responsive to my use case.  Maybe if the windows beta forum shut down ....  🙃

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0

The bug where when in the note body the cursor rapidly jumps back to the subject / title line still happening.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
Just now, CalS said:

Funny thing is I think IOS has had the most improvements in speed and stability in the last year, at least for me.  Still has cross platform formatting snafus, reminder sort issues, but overall responsive to my use case.  Maybe if the windows beta forum shut down ....  🙃

That may be, and I am glad it is improving. But when they forced me to use the device feedback mechanism is when I bowed out.

  1. I have an iPhone SE. I don't have the patience to fully type out an elaborate response to explain an issue on what is going on that tiny screen.
  2. You cannot be in the feedback mechanism and reproduce the issue to fully document it. So you have to either memorize the steps to repro the issue then type them all in, or you have to go to your PC/Mac anyway and type it in there while you are clicking through the repro steps on your phone. Then you have to sync that to your phone, then copy and paste it into the feedback tool. 
  3. I never noticed the feedback working. I never got a response.
  4. If anyone was seeing the feedback at all, it wasn't the peer support forum members, so there is no possibility of sharing ideas for workrounds or any discussion around the bug.

However, I am sure the number of complaints and bug reports went down when they did that, so that must have been seen as a positive metric internally.

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0

Not disputing the need for simple feedback channels that are heeded.  More a sardonic view of if removing the channel improves the product, remove the channel.  

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
On 5/12/2018 at 3:55 AM, Ethan Mings said:

Confirmed, the Notebooks view is not working.  

That was one feature I did like in the last beta.  

Will it be coming back?

It will. It's turned off by default right now due to some serious performance issues. I'm in the process of cleaning this up now... (We decided it was better to turn it off temporarily rather than wait for my changes.)

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
24 minutes ago, jefito said:

The thing that would be nice would be to make a note of stuff like that in the release notes, whoever's in charge of those.

Amen.

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
On 5/13/2018 at 8:57 AM, Ethan Mings said:

c) When betas are posted, release a full list of the fixes and what is still pending.  

+1000! 

It would be very helpful to at least let us know in the release notes which bugs have been fixed rather than "Miscellaneous fixes".

On 5/13/2018 at 8:57 AM, Ethan Mings said:

Please, fix the beta testing process and listen to your customers. 

Indeed, what is quite clear to anyone using EN Windows and updating to the recent betas or even the recent GA releases is that the QC process at Evenote is broken. How would MS Excel fare if every version created bugs in calculations? Would Dropbox have been able to IPO if there version releases routinely created sync problems for users?

This QA issue is destroying the tremendous goodwill EN generated with its userbase. I would bet a lot of money that the % of heavy EN Windows users that evangelize for EN has dropped because we can't recommend to friends and family a piece of software that we have come to know will break existing features with nearly every new release.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0

Hmmn.  Bug.  Just tried to drag and drop a PDF file onto an existing note to attach it to the note.  The PDF file opened in Adobe (my software-of-choice for that type of file) but the note was unaffected.  Then tried pressing Shift+d&d to add as attachment - same result;  file opened in Adobe.  Attached from the note - file was added as you'd expect.

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
1 hour ago, gazumped said:

Hmmn.  Bug.  Just tried to drag and drop a PDF file onto an existing note to attach it to the note.  The PDF file opened in Adobe (my software-of-choice for that type of file) but the note was unaffected.  Then tried pressing Shift+d&d to add as attachment - same result;  file opened in Adobe.  Attached from the note - file was added as you'd expect.

I saw this as well, Copy/Paste still works....  Per my post way above, can't drag text either.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
On 5/13/2018 at 9:58 AM, CalS said:

Bug report.  Drag and drop from the main EN window to a note in it's own window seems not to work anymore. 

 

Thanks for the report. Are you dragging and dropping attachments from notes within the main note window into a note in its own window? If yes, which filetype?  
I couldn't reproduce this issue when I tried dragging images or dragging a note from the note list into a note in its own window (to create a local note link). 

Here's my test video: http://recordit.co/aSoM6lKBJe 

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
9 hours ago, gazumped said:

Hmmn.  Bug.  Just tried to drag and drop a PDF file onto an existing note to attach it to the note.  The PDF file opened in Adobe (my software-of-choice for that type of file) but the note was unaffected.  Then tried pressing Shift+d&d to add as attachment - same result;  file opened in Adobe.  Attached from the note - file was added as you'd expect

I'm not able to reproduce the issue. Would it be possible to provide a video or steps? Is the problem related to specific notebooks or notes type such as shared? 

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
2 hours ago, Austin G said:

Thanks for the report. Are you dragging and dropping attachments from notes within the main note window into a note in its own window? If yes, which filetype?  
I couldn't reproduce this issue when I tried dragging images or dragging a note from the note list into a note in its own window (to create a local note link). 

Here's my test video: http://recordit.co/aSoM6lKBJe 

Open a new note in its own window.  Highlight some text in a note in the main window.  Drag and drop to the new note window.. Nothing gets added to the new note 

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
4 hours ago, Em Gee said:

I'm not able to reproduce the issue. Would it be possible to provide a video or steps? Is the problem related to specific notebooks or notes type such as shared? 

Hi.  Now I'm trying to repeat the process it is (of course) working perfectly.  😒 

I was dragging a searchable PDF file from a sub-folder on my Win 10 desktop into the top of a note with existing content.  When I released the file into -I thought- the note,  it opened instead in an Acrobat window as a normal document.  I tried that a few times to confirm what did and didn't work.

I've since restarted Evernote,  which may be why things are back to normal - I'll keep an eye on it and yell (again) if that changes!!

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0

We need the ESC key to get out of the note panel to go back to the note list. Such a convenient method to switch between notes by using the keyboard only.

I know 6.7 has that convenience which I use daily. Testing out 6.13 at home PC and one of the things that jumped out. Please put that back! 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
On 5/11/2018 at 6:49 PM, jefito said:

I did say that it was a Windows hotkey (" a system wide shortcut that is always available in all contexts"), not an Evernote thingie. And, for me at least, and in 6.12 and the latest 6.13, it works as described. Bring up a note, ensure the note body has focus (click in it), press Win+;, and select your favorite emoji(s) there, and they're inserted into the text. They don't work in the title area, however, where they really might be useful...

Just checked with Beta 6.13 and the emoji are working also in the title - well they are there in their b/w ugliness as the emojis are not shown properly in EN (or Win10?) - but if you check the note in e.g. iOS, the emoji is shown correctly.

Was it worth to "break what feels like 10 core features" to get emoji? I doubt it but hey, we do not want to be ungrateful! THIS feature could be a fun pastime (because efficiency is SO boring!) and is ALMOST working correctly - a state other core features have not reached again!!! *sarcasm off* 😬

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
2 hours ago, Maddhin said:

Just checked with Beta 6.13 and the emoji are working also in the title - well they are there in their b/w ugliness as the emojis are not shown properly in EN (or Win10?) - but if you check the note in e.g. iOS, the emoji is shown correctly

Good to know that this is just an Evernote Windows client display issue.

2 hours ago, Maddhin said:

Was it worth to "break what feels like 10 core features" to get emoji? I doubt it but hey, we do not want to be ungrateful! THIS feature could be a fun pastime (because efficiency is SO boring!) and is ALMOST working correctly - a state other core features have not reached again!!! *sarcasm off* 😬

Not my call (and I don't understand your implication that emoji broke "... core features"), and since I don't have any knowledge as to level of effort to implement emoji in the Evernote client vs, say, getting editing to work exactly rock-solid perfectly (though I might have some intuition), I can't make that judgment. Not that I care about emoji all that much, but I had just read about the Win 10 emoji  'keyboard', and it amused me to mash it up against the new Evernote emoji support, and report my findings, particularly given the bitterness that some folks seem to feel about them having added it, and hey, lots of people like emojis (witness their popularity)...1

1 In other words, it was all a light-hearted troll

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0

I am willing to tolerate most bugs, but the jumping cursor issue makes it nearly impossible to work with my notes, is this single issue fixed yet, before I try this update?  Thanks.

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
58 minutes ago, Don Dz said:

I am willing to tolerate most bugs, but the jumping cursor issue makes it nearly impossible to work with my notes, is this single issue fixed yet, before I try this update?  Thanks.

it seems to work pretty well except for this issue, which has been around for several months at least and not fixed yet. 

https://discussion.evernote.com/topic/113550-evernote-for-windows-613-beta-1/?do=findComment&comment=505297

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
1 hour ago, Don Dz said:

I am willing to tolerate most bugs, but the jumping cursor issue makes it nearly impossible to work with my notes, is this single issue fixed yet, before I try this update?  Thanks.

Yeah, this one is crazy...even in a beta

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
22 minutes ago, EdH said:

it seems to work pretty well except for this issue, which has been around for several months at least and not fixed yet. 

https://discussion.evernote.com/topic/113550-evernote-for-windows-613-beta-1/?do=findComment&comment=505297

If I understand that post correctly, does that mean that if "set focus to note title" is not selected, then that problem doesn't happen?  I never use that feature personally, so if that's the only reason the cursor jumps, I would be ok with it. 

I always deal with the title after creating the note, if at all.

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
19 hours ago, CalS said:

Open a new note in its own window.  Highlight some text in a note in the main window.  Drag and drop to the new note window.. Nothing gets added to the new note 

Thanks! Looking into this now. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
9 hours ago, Austin G said:

Thanks! Looking into this now. 

Need anything let me know. 

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
On 5/13/2018 at 7:56 AM, DTLow said:

I've been a long time user and appreciate the forums for everything I learned, and the help received from other users.

I'm also a beta tester, and use the release discussions to post issues.

It's also a good tool to post feature requests; for users to indicate their support; to discuss.
I'm also aware that Evernote is under no obligation to implement the requests and advise, and there are other factors in prioritizing development work.

Correct, EN is under no obligation to implement the requests, but they are under obligation not to break a working features, features we have been paying for when we decided to subscribe. We subscribed for a reason, and, EN cannot simple take some of the features away!!!!! And they should damn read it here.

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
1 minute ago, AndreasM said:

Correct, EN is under no obligation to implement the requests, but they are under obligation not to break a working features, features we have been paying for when we decided to subscribe.

Can you show me in their Terms of Service where they are under that obligation? I don't know if any software vendor that puts themselves under that obligation in the TOS a user agrees to before using.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
On 5/18/2018 at 1:59 PM, AndreasM said:

Correct, EN is under no obligation to implement the requests, but they are under obligation not to ...

Evernote is not under any such obligation.

Users are not under obligation (mostly) to install software updates if they don't like the changes.
If you don't like the changes implemented in version n.nn, stay with the version you're happy with.

Also, you may not want to participate in the beta testing program.  These versions then to be worse at "breaking things".

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0

Really, so this is how software upgrades work.

If, for example, Microsoft upgrades Excel, and publishes the new version with an incorrect financial formula calculation, it is the user responsibility not to install it.

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
26 minutes ago, AndreasM said:

If, for example, Microsoft upgrades Excel, and publishes the new version with an incorrect financial formula calculation, it is the user responsibility not to install it.

Personally, if this is a formula I use, I would not install the new Excel version.  We did encounter this in beta testing a few years ago but it was an obscure calc error.

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
1 hour ago, AndreasM said:

Really, so this is how software upgrades work.

If, for example, Microsoft upgrades Excel, and publishes the new version with an incorrect financial formula calculation, it is the user responsibility not to install it.

Yes. We always validate new versions before rolling them out. Of course, we have users (like me) on the beta's of Office so we see issues before they are put into production builds and try to get them squashed before that happens. If not, we delay the rollout. Haven't seen Excel formula issues, but have seen issues with Excel tables, Outlook printing, etc. And we've delayed as MS works through the issues. 

Still waiting on the TOS link that Evernote is under obligation not to break features. 

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
3 hours ago, EdH said:

Yes. We always validate new versions before rolling them out. Of course, we have users (like me) on the beta's of Office so we see issues before they are put into production builds and try to get them squashed before that happens. If not, we delay the rollout. Haven't seen Excel formula issues, but have seen issues with Excel tables, Outlook printing, etc. And we've delayed as MS works through the issues. 

Why is EN not doing exactly this what you are saying?

 

3 hours ago, EdH said:

Still waiting on the TOS link that Evernote is under obligation not to break features.

Looks like you are working for EN.

Anyway, I don't need to show you TOS, not even attempting to look for this. It should be common sense. Software subscription is a product I paid for, and I expect this product to work/perform in the same way when I bought this.

Let say I purchased a blue car, and after two month the color faded out and the car is gray now. Do I look for TOS or what ever? No I would go to the dealer and demand a remedy. It is so simple.

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
15 hours ago, AndreasM said:

Really, so this is how software upgrades work.

If, for example, Microsoft upgrades Excel, and publishes the new version with an incorrect financial formula calculation, it is the user responsibility not to install it.

If it is a public release and they recommend I do the upgrade then the formula does not work, I would be pissed. I would agree with you here. There is some responsibility that lies with the developer too.

Of course, there would be bugs...nothing in life is perfect, why would I expect a software to be perfect? But I would expect it to do the core functions as promised and as it has been doing it in the previous version.

Excel needs to calculate formulas correctly, that is a very core function and if they released it with a major issue like this, someone needs to be fired.

When MS released Xbox 360 first and MANY users experienced the "red ring of death", that was not acceptable. You couldn't catch that during the testing while TOO MANY people experienced it. It is a core problem and it is not a bug.

Similarly, if Evernote releases an update to the general public, and the note taking abilities are hindered tremendously, I think it is a developer issue mainly. Because the agreement we have (what is advertised or what is apparent) leads me to believe that the note taking that is advertised will work. 

So although I understand the "do not install the update | roll back to the version that works", I still believe that there is accountability from the developer side. It is like when you buy a car you have certain expectations, when you buy a loaf of bread, you have certain expectations and the seller has certain obligations as well. I expect the brakes to work which is a core function yet there could be an issue with the navigation software.

My 2 cents!

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
23 hours ago, TK0047 said:

If it is a public release and they recommend I do the upgrade

We are posting in a beta version discussion.  1294315534_ScreenShot2018-05-20at06_10_17.png.d29dcda1f06276ec4afa3010d546c42e.png
When I signed up for beta versions, there was a warning about the risk, the potential for bugs and data lost.
I do not recommend beta testing for the general audience. 

Bugs do reach GA release; I blame the testers 😊, but it's also a management decision.
We can be pissed, but I also take responsibility to protect myself.

  • I review the forum discussion for any bug reports
  • As you mentioned; I roll back to previous versions

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0

Warrant of merchantability   

To be "merchantable", the goods must reasonably conform to an ordinary buyer's expectations, i.e., they are what they say they are.

I think this applies to the editor in particular, Beta or GA at this point.  Hence people getting so PO’d at the one step forward two steps back of the last six months  

IAC, mystery to me why anyone of influence at EN would allow this to continue.  Particularly if the company is attempting to attract more business users.  Let alone it is just shoddy.  

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0

It's crazy how some people say that it's okay to have issues to in public releases because TOS don't promise you anything...
When I encounter a serious issue, like an issue I encountered with Evernote, which basically results in data loss, which is the total opposite of what Evernote is supposed to do, which is to save your data.... Such an issue is not acceptable. I will not ask for compensations. But such issues make you think to ditch the software all together. If Evernote cares about keeping customers, they should care about releasing working software. If they don't care about that, they should tell us so we look for other alternatives.
And to be honest, I am now seriously thinking about switching to OneNote.

I will wait for a month or so, and if Evernote don't fix the bugs and improve their releases, I will be forced to go somewhere else...

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
2 hours ago, barnos said:

some people say that it's okay to have issues to in public releases

Don't think that's what they are implying.  It's never OK to have bugs in software that users rely on,  but there's no come-back on Evernote if something goes badly wrong because the T&C's broadly say "if something goes wrong, we're not liable".  The company does take a hit to its reputation,  and if people move away or decide to use a different product,  they'll see a drop in their income.  You're quite right to say that if Evernote don't fix a problem you'll look elsewhere - though you need to give them some assistance to find and fix the problem.

I used to run an IT support team (not Evernote) and I know from experience that it makes it a lot easier to support users if they are responsible and:

  1. report issues fully and answer any queries as quickly as possible - Evernote might not have been aware there was a problem until you report it;  you may be the first to do so.  The company may need your help to identify exactly where a process fails and whether it is a device issue or a bug.
  2. give the company a reasonable period to find a fix - sometimes it can be weeks before an issue is finally tracked down,  even if it takes only a few minutes to produce a correction.
  3. don't doubt that the company takes faults seriously - Evernote have fixed some new releases within days of being made aware of a problem.  Employees use the app themselves,  so there's a fair amount of ongoing testing.
  4. don't send new emails or tickets as 'reminders' - all you're doing is tying up resources that could be fixing a fault with pointless paperwork. 

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
On 5/19/2018 at 9:08 AM, DTLow said:

We are posting in a beta version discussion.  
When I signed up for beta versions, there was a warning about the risk, the potential for bugs and data lost.
I do not recommend beta testing for the general audience. 

Bugs do reach GA release; I blame the testers, but it's also a management decision.
We can be pissed, but I take responsibility to protect myself.

  • I review the forum discussion for any bug reports
  • As you mentioned; I roll back to previous versions

Warrant of merchantability. 

To be "merchantable", the goods must reasonably conform to an ordinary buyer's expectations, i.e., they are what they say they are.  

Hence folks getting PO’d at all the editor issues.  A mystery to me why someone of influence at EN isn’t doing something about this.  

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
On 5/19/2018 at 12:13 AM, AndreasM said:

Looks like you are working for EN.

Anyway, I don't need to show you TOS, not even attempting to look for this. It should be common sense. Software subscription is a product I paid for, and I expect this product to work/perform in the same way when I bought this.

Please stop believing/implying that someone who disagrees with you is working for Evernote. He's not; Evernote employees have "Evernote Employee" on their forum badge. He is correctly pointing out a risk that all of us take when using software (any software); that the software may have bugs (almost all non-trivial software that exists has bugs) or may change the way it operates, in its UI or its results (sometimes by design, sometimes not). But the Terms of Service governs all that, your expectations notwithstanding. I'll tell you this for free, though: nobody, including EdH, DTLow, myself, the Evernote staff, etc. is happy when bugs occur, or when things break. And sure, users are understandably upset if they lose data, or their workflow is altered. But that doesn't preclude the fact that your rights are limited by the TOS.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0

All you people defending the company here, you do not get the point. And it is so simple. I am paying for a product with features A, B and C. With some stupid, unwanted update the product has now features A, B and D. Feature C is gone now. Is it still the same product I paid for. NO, NO, NO, get this. And, what is most frustrating, the company (Evernote) is not focusing on restoring feature C, no, it is introducing another unwanted feature E, and while doing this it removes feature B. Evernote is doing this for such a long time now, that nobody within the company knows anymore which features are gone. I don't think we can trust such a company.

Therefore, I am encouraging to boycott the installation of any new release until the company gets their act together and cleans the software from bugs. Otherwise they will continue to do it.

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
8 hours ago, AndreasM said:

I am paying for a product with features A, B and C.    .....   Therefore, I am encouraging to boycott the installation of any new release 

Note: There is no charge for the Evernote software; there is no charge for the software updates

I encourage users to protect themselves; install releases only if they're satisfied with the changes being made, and can work around identified bugs. 

I also encourage users not to install beta versions unless they're willing to participate in the product testing.

>>If, for example, Microsoft upgrades Excel, and publishes the new version with an incorrect financial formula calculationit ithe user responsibility not to install it.

I encourage users not to install Excel upgrades if the new version includes an incorrect financial formula calculation  😊

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0

Since a couple of versions back I still experience that when I paste text into a new note i won't always save the text (the title still says Untitled note as well), which makes me lose the content. The only way to make sure that the text is saved is to manipulate the note manually after pasting...

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
On 5/18/2018 at 9:13 PM, AndreasM said:

Anyway, I don't need to show you TOS, not even attempting to look for this. It should be common sense. Software subscription is a product I paid for, and I expect this product to work/perform in the same way when I bought this.

Well, then that is wishful thinking on your part. Here. Let me help you with the TOS.

Quote

We retain the right, in our sole discretion, to implement new elements as part of and/or ancillary to the Service, including changes that may affect the previous mode of operation of the Service or Evernote Software. We expect that any such modifications will enhance the overall Service, but it is possible that you may not agree with us.

You agreed to that when you signed up, paying or not.

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
On 5/19/2018 at 8:06 AM, CalS said:

Warrant of merchantability   

To be "merchantable", the goods must reasonably conform to an ordinary buyer's expectations, i.e., they are what they say they are.

I think this applies to the editor in particular, Beta or GA at this point.  Hence people getting so PO’d at the one step forward two steps back of the last six months  

IAC, mystery to me why anyone of influence at EN would allow this to continue.  Particularly if the company is attempting to attract more business users.  Let alone it is just shoddy.  

Well, again with the TOS, there is no warrant of merchantability with Evernote.

Quote
  1. THE SERVICE IS PROVIDED ON AN “AS IS” AND “AS AVAILABLE” BASIS. TO THE MAXIMUM EXTENT PERMITTED BY LAW, EVERNOTE EXPRESSLY DISCLAIMS ALL WARRANTIES AND CONDITIONS OF ANY KIND, WHETHER EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO THE IMPLIED WARRANTIES AND CONDITIONS OF MERCHANTABILITY, FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE AND NON-INFRINGEMENT.

Very very common to be disclaimed in software.

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
38 minutes ago, EdH said:

Well, again with the TOS, there is no warrant of merchantability with Evernote.

Very very common to be disclaimed in software.

For sure, doesn't affect how users feel though.  Doesn't make it right either.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
6 hours ago, CalS said:

For sure, doesn't affect how users feel though.  Doesn't make it right either.

100% agree. I want it fixed as well, but I'm not going to argue from a legal or contractual basis on things that are specifically excluded.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
15 minutes ago, EdH said:

100% agree. I want it fixed as well, but I'm not going to argue from a legal or contractual basis on things that are specifically excluded.

Yeah, nor I, that juice ain’t worth the squeeze for a piece of personal software, particularly one as free form as EN.  

My view being the legality means little to folks who are frustrated with a non functional editor, which makes zero sense in a note taking plus app, which also implies it means little to EN. 

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
8 minutes ago, CalS said:

My view being the legality means little to folks who are frustrated with a non functional editor, which makes zero sense in a note taking plus app, which also implies it means little to EN. 

The little side lesson on software legal issues wasn't for everyone, you know. Meanwhile I want the editor to be rock-solid, like everyone else, but I'm not finding Evernote "non functional". I use it every working day (and often for personal use as well), keep my workflows simple, and try to dodge the quirks (which can change from release to release, and I do run the betas). It continues to get the job done for me.

Then again, one of my first jobs programming was writing a word process, and I used an early, tender version of it to write a college course final paper. Now *that* was harrowing... :) 

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
4 minutes ago, jefito said:

Meanwhile I want the editor to be rock-solid, like everyone else, but I'm not finding Evernote "non functional".

Of course not. Not now that we have the Emoji Engine working....

  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
2 minutes ago, EdH said:

Of course not. Not now that we have the Emoji Engine working....

Some people are "visual thinkers", I suppose... :) 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
3 hours ago, jefito said:

Meanwhile I want the editor to be rock-solid, like everyone else, but I'm not finding Evernote "non functional". I use it every working day (and often for personal use as well), keep my workflows simple, and try to dodge the quirks (which can change from release to release, and I do run the betas). It continues to get the job done for me.

Sorry, I just can't be that magnanimous re the editor.  Hard for me to give a development team a free pass for the issues created the last six months.  The editor just needs to get fixed, nothing extra, just do what it is supposed to do.  Things like reliable cursor position, single click for focus, drag/drop, some rules that stick for simplify/remove formatting, ability to remove blockquote so as to align text without having to edit an ENEX, etc.  The basics.

Share this post


Link to post
  • 0
13 hours ago, DTLow said:

I'm more practical than magnanimous.  

Given my Evernote editor experience, I limit my use to basic notes.  There are many alternative editors available.

I also directly edit the enml code (easier with a Mac)

I don't mind workarounds for function that doesn't exist.  I do mind workarounds for functions that just don't work to spec.  That is just wrong, IMHO.

Share this post


Link to post
  • -2
On 5/21/2018 at 9:52 PM, CalS said:

Sorry, I just can't be that magnanimous re the editor. 

I'm more practical than magnanimous.  
edit: practical - concerned with the actual doing or use of something rather than with theory and ideas

Given my Evernote editor experience, I limit my use to basic notes.  For other work there are many alternative editors available.

I also directly edit the enml code (easier with a Mac)

Share this post


Link to post

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×