Chris Darby

Thank you @agsteele. After having an extended period of not utilizing Evernote, other than the occasional search for an old note through my local offline database (27 GB) in Evernote Legacy 6.25.9198, it would seem that I've been able to move on, so I'm discontinuing my annual subscription at this point, since it is due to renew in a couple of weeks. As I had mentioned before in other past posts, I understand why Evernote completely refactored their Windows client application (i.e., increased cross-platform shared code and less developer headaches going forward), and I also recognize that I have a lot of work to do with my information collection and organization practices [i.e., stop capturing so much content (bloat) and then expecting it to be readily available offline]. I appreciate the service that I received before the changes were implemented and I wish Evernote the best in the future. Thanks again to many on here for your feedback and guidance. Take care.

1 hour ago, PinkElephant said:

Inserted into the note in EN is the PNG-picture twice, followed by the JPG. So it seems it really tries to import both pictures from the clipboard, and for whatever reason it does it twice for the PNG.

On the surface, it seems like this would be a straightforward update, although the developers would probably need to either make a decision about which image type to select (PNG/JPG) or add a new setting for the user to choose as the default. A new technique (function logic) also needs to be created for deciding which single item in an array of items to choose from the clipboard. The clipboard object in different operating systems might require if-then-else or switch-case conditional calls (since JavaScript doesn't support preprocessor directives) to handle respective O.S. clipboard library APIs differently. Or it could be that the electron.clipboard library performs in an O.S. agnostic fashion (cross-platform abstraction) such that the same lines of code can be utilized on all supported platforms to interact with the clipboard. In either event (object handling pun intended), the real issue here is the payload that is entering the app from the clipboard, which could be a single item (text, HTML, RTF, image) or an array of items. Determining how to handle the content to be pasted into an app can be helped by trying to understand the context (user intent), otherwise the "just dump everything from the clipboard" is the safe default approach, if the code isn't able to discriminate and choose just one element in an array of items in the clipboard. It's an interesting challenge, because the clipboard on any O.S. can contain a variety of different types of data, but I would start by having the code first determine if the clipboard contains an array of only images on every paste event, and if that result is true, then iterate through all items in the array and select a single image in the desired default format. But this is just guesswork, not knowing more about their development environment, and I'm rambling on about it here only because it seems like an interesting challenge to be resolved.

56 minutes ago, Chris Darby said:

In the meantime, the "Write plain text files" article is something that some of us might give more thought to. Thank you again for sharing those two websites.

@Boot17, I also found the below article interesting (stumbled upon while reviewing the articles that you shared):

https://www.al3x.net/blog/2009/01/31/the-case-against-everything-buckets

2 hours ago, Boot17 said:

It might be an interesting read for you too.

@Boot17, thank you for sharing those articles, as both are indeed very familiar. It's nice to hear from others who have had similar experiences and given these things further thought. I used to use plain text files extensively for many years, categorizing different topics by different sections within text files, different files within directories, and different sub-directories within directories. I ended up (for the most part) abandoning this approach since I ran into search problems when trying to find past content consistently, usually an issue of there being too many false positives in search results, due to a lacking complex multi-field Boolean queries. I still use various plain text files daily for various notes, but not nearly as extensively due to searching and scaling problems. On the other hand, in the "Write plain text files" article by Derek Sivers that you shared, he does make a good case for using standard field strings such as "date:" and "tags:" (which could be expanded further) in all text files, which might be able to solve searching problems.

With plain text files I'd like to be able to perform complex multi-field Boolean searches such as:

select * from MyBrain where (DateUpdated > '2022-04-01 00:00:00' and DateUpdated < '2022-04-05 00:00:00') and (tag = 'Chevy' or tag = 'Ford') and Author not like '%smith%'

This type of a query is possible with a SQL-style database. I've regularly made use of a Microsoft Access database for about fifteen years, since it is highly customizable (with tables, columns, queries, forms, reports) and it supports complex SQL queries for searching. It works great, but this only runs on Windows. It would get more frequent use if it would also run on Linux and Android.

I'd like to develop a custom backend synchronization library (Linux so, Windows dll) with interfaces that can be called from multiple platforms leveraging either SQLite or some other low profile multiplatform dataset storage technology (XML/JSON), which would also require developing multiple custom frontend user interfaces on multiple platforms in order to interact with those synchronized datasets via the backend synchronization library... but these are only concepts that lack the necessary implementation effort (i.e., me daydreaming and not doing).

I've also given some thought to making use of Git repositories beyond just source code (as per your Hacker News article). This would leverage the organizing capabilities that are native to all file systems (in the form of sub-directories), combined with git commit date/time values, comments/messages, revisions/branches and other features of Git. There are some included searching capabilities, such as git grep, but the built-in capabilities are not robust enough to support complex multi-field Boolean queries.

An "auxiliary brain" would ideally support the following capabilities: multiple platforms; full synchronization/mirroring of all data; grouping by hierarchies (e.g., sub-folders); tagging records; linking records; and complex multi-field searches.

Since it seems unlikely that I'm going to dedicate the time to "reinvent the wheel" by trying to create my own custom multi-platform data synchronization software product, I've been researching available file system indexing solutions that run on Linux and/or Windows, with the thought that I might return to using files and sub-directories as my primary mass information/concepts storage destination, but only if I could find a way to perform robust complex searches. Some candidate software that I've been looking at include: Elasticsearch/OpenSearch; Tracker; find; locate; rlocate; FSearch; Catfish; Recoll; Cerebro; Synapse; Search Monkey; ANGRYsearch; Doodle; and Everything. It's going to be some time before I've finished testing these various products.

Another advantage to falling back on files and sub-directories on a standard operating system file system is that it's portable and can be easily synchronized/mirrored using a variety of methods. Even simple tar gzip commands can be used to backup content. And git could be utilized for more robust computer to computer synchronizing on a per-file basis.

The only downside to these various software candidates for indexing files on Linux and Windows file systems is that this doesn't carry over to Android. This is why products such as Evernote and OneNote are so popular: they've managed to unify much of the described functionality into a backend that can be interacted with via their proprietary API by multiple platforms.

Evernote has been one of the closest candidates for fulfilling all of these capabilities over the past decade, until recently.

It seems likely that one will need to relax their expectations and divide these different capabilities between different products running on different platforms, as it seems unrealistic to expect all of these capabilities to run everywhere with one's full collection of data. This also relates back to the first "lesson learned" that I mentioned in my previous post: We shouldn't allow ourselves to become dependent on any single resource being used to capture all of our notes, thoughts and ideas. We should instead become more cognizant and accountable for how we manage our information, with more flexibility and diversity in the techniques utilized, while also striving to be minimize the quantity of data that we amass.

I'll try to remember to come back here and share any noteworthy findings if I make any headway with alternative solutions in this regard. In the meantime, the "Write plain text files" article is something that some of us might give more thought to. Thank you again for sharing those two websites.

@JohnLongney, @Boot17 Frustrating as it has been for me to work through the changes with Evernote (as discussed here), ultimately abandoning my previous decade-old massive database and essentially start over, I'm walking away with a couple of significant "lessons learned" from the year-long experience. First, it was foolish of me to become so dependent on Evernote as my "auxiliary brain" and use it as a catch-all, and from this I'm taking steps towards becoming more cognizant and accountable for how I manage my information (less of a "tag it, store it and forget it" mentality). Second, while I recognize the value had by Evernote deciding to create new consolidated source code that is more cross-platform compatible, thereby saving time and reducing the need to hire additional developers to support multiple platforms, I'm also coming to realize that making everything cross-platform is not always the right move. There really are some significant differences between the way that the native "Evernote Legacy" software for Windows performs and the new multi-platform Evernote performs, with respect to responsiveness and features. It's a tough call to choose between spending maybe 500 K USD and 1 M USD (wild guesses here) on extra staff to support optimized performance and features, versus maybe half or a fraction of that on a multi-platform solution with mostly shared code. I don't know the answer in the case of Evernote and they probably made the right decision, but from an end-user perspective, the present iteration of the new software is still significantly behind how well the legacy software for Windows performed. Regardless, as I continue to focus on my first lesson learned, I'm grateful to have gone through this experience and I look forward to better managing my personal data collection going forward, without being so dependent and disorganized.

On 3/26/2022 at 10:57 AM, Chris Darby said:

6. Last, after waiting the full two days, disconnect the Windows computer from being online, and then attempt to open all notes while offline.

Note results here.

7. Report back the results of my test.

Note results here.

Here's continuing where I left off:

6. Last, after waiting the full two days, disconnect the Windows computer from being online, and then attempt to open all notes while offline.

2020328 1100 CDT: Preparing to perform test of using Evernote for Windows while offline. The software has been running and online for over 48 hours. While still online and before going offline, reopening the same notes as were opened two days ago: Test notes 1 through 17; test notes 28 through 31; test notes 47 through 49; and test notes 88 through 90. These opened and revealed their full contents without any problems. Also, for the purpose of confirming that the current Evernote for Windows software session is active and online, opened the following 5 additional test notes (in no particular order) while online: Test notes 20, 22, 35, 51 and 83.

20220328 1110 CDT: Disconnected the Windows computer from the Internet (no Ethernet, no Wi-Fi). The computer is now offline, as confirmed by the network status and by the inability to connect to websites via a web browser.

20220328 1112 CDT: Start of offline Evernote for Windows software testing. Successfully opened the contents (including attachments) of all 100 test notes while offline.

7. Report back the results of my test.

20220328 2145 CDT: This test demonstrates that my previous assumptions were wrong, as it turns out that the new Evernote for Windows software does actually download notes on a computer that has not previously opened those notes, although it should be noted that this test was performed with a new Evernote account with only 100 notes.

Final conclusion and venting of frustrations:

I'm not seeing these same results with my main Evernote account that I've been using since 2011, as these notes are not available to open when offline. I've tested leaving the new Evernote for Windows software running 24/7 for about a week at a time, but in light of me having over 30,000 notes, I can only guess that either much more time is needed to download all notes, or maybe there is a problem with client-server synchronizing of such a large quantity of notes. I doubt that my local Internet Service Provider is likely to be part of the problem, since my ISP speeds reach up to one gigabit per second (1 Gb/s) and my Windows computer is running on gigabit Ethernet (tested and confirmed). It is understandable that Evernote might be throttling data transfers on their end, so as to share bandwidth among all customers, but it's not clear how many weeks or months I would need to leave my computer on 24/7 in order to download my full database for offline use from the cloud. With the old Evernote for Windows software, my entire database would download within a few hours, or at the most in less than one day, and then be fully available for offline use. It would be helpful if the new Evernote for Windows software provided an easily accessible and clear download status, such as "Downloading note 27,123 of 39,999", instead of needing to manually attempt to estimate progress based on monitoring data transfer progress using developer tools in Chromium web browsers.

I also have concerns that it might not be possible for me to retain full ownership of and access to my data for the foreseeable future. If there is any truth to what I've read in other forum posts, it sounds like the new Evernote for Windows software cannot be installed fresh on a new offline Windows computer and then run for the purpose of accessing locally stored notes, not without being online and first authenticating with the Evernote cloud. This is a problem because one cannot be certain that the Evernote cloud will always be available to authenticate with, so one can't be certain to be able to access their locally stored data at a future date.

In either case, at the end of the day, I am unable to access all of my notes when using the new Evernote for Windows software. Yes, I can continue to use the old Evernote for Windows software to access my past notes, but this results in a break in continuity, since my "auxiliary brain" that has existed within this single large Evernote database is no longer fully accessible when offline with the new software. Even if I abandoned my current database, giving up the ability to cross-reference and link new future notes to my past notes, it's still not clear going forward that new future notes will be accessible offline years into the future.

I need to evaluate alternative solutions, either in addition to or instead of Evernote. The new Evernote software is not currently capable of functioning in a way that ensures that the user's data will be fully accessible to them in the future, at least not in a situation where the data needs to be recovered from locally owned offline storage media and in the event that the Evernote cloud service is no longer available. As a consumer of various products and services, it's ultimately my decision as to how I make use of products and services that I purchase, and it's my responsibility to also accept the consequences of that decision, to include the possibility that I might have been misusing Evernote over the last 11 years. It just worked out that I chose to be dependent on Evernote as my "auxiliary brain" for conducting research, tagging and cross-referencing a broad variety of data, and my assumption that this would continue to be within the capabilities of Evernote is my error and misuse of the product.

Evernote has been an awesome product and service, and I hope that the people behind Evernote continue to have great success. I mentioned in a previous and separate forum post that Evernote made a difficult decision to standardize their new software across the board for all platforms so as to lower their software engineering burden, and I fully understand and respect their decision. It's just unfortunate and frustrating as a longtime user that I chose to so tightly integrate Evernote in my day to day practices and can no longer be certain to always have full access to all of my data. I "put all of my eggs in one basket", but I should have only been using Evernote as strictly a note taking tool, and should not have assumed that this would always be a more general use long-term information storage and retrieval tool.

19 minutes ago, PinkElephant said:

A lot of effort, thank you. I checked text and pictures. 

What are your conclusions ?

I'm just starting the second phase of testing, as per step 5 in my earlier post today. At this current time, the Evernote for Windows software continues to run and is online, and will continue to run and remain online for about 2 days. The next step will be that, on Monday morning, 28 March, I will disconnect the Windows computer from the Internet (no Ethernet, no Wi-Fi), going offline, and I will then attempt to open all of the 100 test notes while offline.

After that has concluded (on Monday), I will then post my findings here. The objective will be to see if all 100 notes will open while the computer is offline.

I'm defining positive functionality as follows: All notes can be opened with all content available, likely indicating that the Evernote for Windows software does download the full contents of all notes and would be available of offline use.

I'm defining negative functionality as follows: All notes cannot be opened with all content available, likely indicating that the Evernote for Windows software does not download the full contents of all notes and would not be available for offline use.

However, I'm giving it a full 48 hours of running online in an attempt to allow it sufficient time to download all content for all 100 notes.
 

This post relates to the preceding post, for the purpose of providing the screen capture image files separately.

On 3/9/2022 at 4:23 PM, Chris Darby said:

[truncated]

Subsequent testing will be as follows:

I will add 10 or 20 new notes on the PC.

I will add an additional 50 to 100 new notes using a combination of the web version of Evernote and the Android version of Evernote.

On the PC instance of Evernote, I will open 10 to 20 of the notes that had been created via web and Android. This will leave around 40 to 80 of those externally created notes unopened on the PC.

I will leave the Evernote software logged on and running 24/7 on the PC while online for two full days (48 hours), in the hope that this allows sufficient opportunity to download those other 40 to 80 unopened notes.

Last, after waiting the full two days, I will then disconnect the PC from being online, and then attempt to open all notes while offline.

I will report back the results of my test.

 

For anyone who might be interested (including @PinkElephant, @eric99, @Boot17 and others who have shared advice and offered guidance), after taking my time over the last two weeks I've finished populating my new Evernote test account with 100 test notes, and have started the online full synchronization testing that I mentioned back on 9 March 2022. I anticipate concluding the test after about 2 days and will let you know of the results.

The below text is a copy of my notes that I am using to track this test. I will provide an update with the findings (to be recorded in steps 6 and 7) in about 2 days. I am also including some related screen capture image files in a separate post immediately following this post.

Evernote Synchronization Test Checklist

Because my high quantity of records might be the problem, I will perform an additional test of offline access with Evernote for Windows, entirely isolated from my current account and existing collection of note records. I will purchase an additional second Personal account for one month of testing ($7.99). I only have one Windows computer available at this time, so I am unable to remove this device from the problem isolation testing, but I will fully uninstall the new version of Evernote, look for and delete remnant directories and files, restart the Windows O.S., and reinstall the new version of Evernote. 

Subsequent testing will be as follows: 

1. Purchase new subscription and install clean instance of software on Windows computer. When accessing the account via web browser, to ensure that only my new test account is utilized and not my original main account.

20220311 2130 CST: Done.

2. Add 10 or 20 new notes on the Windows computer.

20220311 2215 CST: Done.

3. Add an additional 50 to 100 new notes using a combination of the web version of Evernote and the Android version of Evernote, and using the email gateway.

20220326 0958 CDT: This occurred over two weeks from 11 March through 25 March.

4. On the Windows computer instance of Evernote, open 10 to 20 of the notes that had been created via web and Android. This will leave around 40 to 80 of those externally created notes unopened on the Windows computer.

20220326 0959 CDT: Upon opening the new Evernote for Windows software for the first time in about two weeks, I received a notification that a new version is available. Proceeded to download and install the new version. It now shows as version 10.33.5-win-ddl-public (3295). [Ref. file capture_20220326_10.png]

20220326 1001 CDT: While online, opened test notes 1 through 17. Test Note 1 was created using Evernote for the web browser. Test Notes 2 through 17 were created using the Evernote for Windows software.

20220326 1003 CDT: While online: opened test notes 28 through 31, created using the Evernote for Android software; opened test notes 47 through 49, created using the Evernote for email gateway; and opened test notes 88 through 90, created using Evernote for the web browser.

5. Leave the Evernote software logged on and running 24/7 on the Windows computer while online for two full days (48 hours), in the hope that this allows sufficient opportunity to download those other 40 to 80 unopened notes.

20220326 1006 CDT: Start of background synchronizing download test. Numerous test notes have been opened while online, as noted in the preceding step. The Evernote for Windows software will continue to remain running while online, with the last note tested remaining selected open (Test Note 90). The Evernote for Windows software will remain running in a normal window state (not minimized) while online; however, other software might be utilized at the same time periodically, such as email and web browser software. Although the older Evernote Legacy software is installed, it is not running and will not be run during this time. The computer will remain powered on and online for the next 48 hours, along with the new Evernote for Windows software running during that time.

20220326 1030 CDT: Created screen capture PNG image files named capture_20220326_01.png through capture_20220326_10.png. Screen captures 01 through 09 show the Test Note 1 through Test Note 100 as viewed using a web browser (so as to not corrupt the Evernote for Windows software test in progress). Screen capture 10 shows the Evernote for Windows software running along with the current About screen software version. [Ref. folder C:\Users\chris\OneDrive\Documents\Evernote_testing]

6. Last, after waiting the full two days, disconnect the Windows computer from being online, and then attempt to open all notes while offline.

Note results here.

7. Report back the results of my test.

Note results here.

Thank you @PinkElephant, @eric99, @Boot17 and others who have shared advice and offered guidance.

It does seem that different users are observing different outcomes when attempting to access Evernote records offline. I have had a paid Personal account for many years and still do, so the offline functionality should be included.

I have attempted a full reinstallation and redownload of all records with the newest version of the software on Windows 10, but so far my experiences have been the same: when disconnected from the network and offline, I can open notes that were recently opened, but I cannot open other notes. This is after a full reinstall and new synchronize. One of the frustrations with the new Evernote is that there doesn't seem to be a clear indication of the synchronization (download) status... neither 5% nor 95% ... not even a busy indicator.

However, I might also be an unusual customer, since I have over 30,000 records in Evernote. It's been a great "auxiliary brain", research tool and catch-all for me, with how I've been able to relate different topics with tags and advanced searches. Because I have so many records, it is understandable that this might be overwhelming the Evernote service and software, maybe to the point of preventing full offline usage. I have left the PC on for a very long time: I'll need to test again, but I seem to recall leaving it on 24/7 for over a week. Full offline access to any and all records still did not work. Or maybe it's not my situation of having so many thousands of records, as support has repeatedly stated that they're still working on full offline capability... unless they are mistaken in stating that, as has been mentioned as a possibility in this forum.

Because my high quantity of records might be the problem, I will perform an additional test of offline access with Evernote for Windows, entirely isolated from my current account and existing collection of note records. I will purchase an additonal second Personal account for one month of testing ($7.99). I only have one Windows computer available at this time, so I am unable to remove this device from the problem isolation testing, but I will fully uninstall the new version of Evernote, look for and delete remnant directories and files, restart the Windows O.S., and reinstall the new version of Evernote.

Subsequent testing will be as follows:

I will add 10 or 20 new notes on the PC.

I will add an additional 50 to 100 new notes using a combination of the web version of Evernote and the Android version of Evernote.

On the PC instance of Evernote, I will open 10 to 20 of the notes that had been created via web and Android. This will leave around 40 to 80 of those externally created notes unopened on the PC.

I will leave the Evernote software logged on and running 24/7 on the PC while online for two full days (48 hours), in the hope that this allows sufficient opportunity to download those other 40 to 80 unopened notes.

Last, after waiting the full two days, I will then disconnect the PC from being online, and then attempt to open all notes while offline.

I will report back the results of my test.

I appreciate your detailed guidance and the time that you spent providing this information. I'm sure that others will come across what you've shared and find it helpful. Thank you.

In my instance, the problem that I described is with the software that runs on the Windows operating system. After extensive repeated testing, I can confirm that Evernote Legacy version 6.25.2 for Windows does indeed download all notes after running for several days, along the lines of what you've described for the software that runs on the iOS operating system. However, the same cannot be said for the newer versions of Evernote for Windows, such as with version 10.32.4. With the newer version of Evernote for Windows, I can additionally confirm that this does not download all notes after running for several days. I have many thousands of notes and when I disconnect from the Internet, the notes will not open. For instance, if I open 10 notes at random while online, and then go offline, then I am able to open those 10 notes, but only those 10 notes, not the other notes.

The legacy Evernote for Windows does actually download everything and make it available offline, whereas the new Evernote for Windows does not.

Thank you again for weighing in on this.

I have been regularly checking in with Evernote support on this subject, about once every three months, and so far the answer has been the same. Not having the ability to access all content while offline renders this to be of more limited use as a tool for archiving and organizing information. I understand their reason for rearchitecting their product, as the advantages outweigh the disadvantages (including my offline use-case), but it's still frustrating to lose a major aspect of the functionality that I presumed would continue to be available.

Responses thus far over the last year have included the following:

"I can see how a great addition to Evernote this feature would be and I think other users would find it helpful. I am happy to submit this as a feature request to our development team."

"The product team will assess the offline note status and work on prioritizing this in a future release, but I do not currently have an estimated time on when it will be addressed."

"Although we do not currently have an estimated time on when it will be addressed, rest assured that we have received your request. that the product team will assess the offline note status and work on prioritizing this in a future release."

"Please note that we haven’t included this feature yet into the new Evernote app. This is one of a handful of features we are still considering. Thanks for letting us know that this is important to you."

"We're still working in improving this so that all notes are available when offline after the initial sync is complete."

"... we still haven’t built this feature into the new Evernote app. This is one of a handful of  features we are still considering. Thanks for letting us know this feature is important to you. I will let our product team know about your follow up to this concern."

I missed that. Thanks for letting me know. I just removed my post.

I haven't tried this, but if you have an additional drive available, and then reinstall Evernote on that other drive, then I wonder if the database would also be stored on that other drive. If that doesn't work, then there might be some other tricks involving file path redirects or symbolic links to fool the Evernote application into accessing the database on another drive (i.e., maybe Evernote looks to store data in C:\Evernote\data\ but a redirection mechanism forces it to actually store on E:\Evernote\data\).

On 11/26/2020 at 11:01 PM, DTLow said:

Of course
- there's an offline database (optional) and it's search-able

There does not seem to be an offline database in the sense that the full collection of notes are available while offline. The new Evernote seems to only download a note when it is opened while online, after which point in time that particular note (that was previously opened) will then be available while offline. However, if I have thousands of notes and have not opened each one of them recently while online, then when I am offline on an airplane I am not able to open those other notes. Put another way: If I have recently opened notes 1 through 100 while online, then I can access those offline; whereas, if I attempt to open notes 101 through 1,000 while offline, then I cannot access those notes. I am hopeful that Evernote prioritizes full offline functionality in the near future.

4 minutes ago, NorcalScott said:

This whole episode with Evernote 10 has made me realize that it is really important for me to break away ... Overall, if you are willing to put in the effort, Joplin is very much a viable alternative, and I expect it is going to continue to get better and better as the development team is motivated and talented.

Thank you for sharing your experiences with this, I do greatly appreciate it.

On 11/30/2020 at 12:14 PM, ELeatherwood said:

I am a writer and researcher who went all in on this platform 5 years ago, and whose careful tagging and filing over that time has been rendered unusable by this latest version. This actually affects my livelihood.

I have about 20,000 notes that represent five years of careful tagging. I use tags daily to cross-reference my research to write content.

...

 

 

I keep running into this issue with technology and I suspect others do as well. We invest significant time and effort over years to make use of some incredible tools that people create, like Evernote, and we are more than happy to continue to purchase or subscribe to their services as a result, but then our "house of cards" teeter on the brink of collapse when the product suddenly and unexpectedly breaks or dissolves. As you alluded to, as we each organize and tag thousands of records, enabling us to rapidly retrieve past thoughts and concepts through indexed searches, leaves us dependent on tools like this as a sort of auxiliary brain. Ultimately I only have myself to blame for this, investing so much confidence and faith in a single tool and service provider, rather than breaking it out among different products. If I were to start over, I would rearchitect my approach by possibly focusing on open source software (although there are certainly support and maintenance pitfalls there as well), as well as spreading out the approach to data organizing among multiple different products. The problem with splitting up our auxiliary brains between multiple products is that we lose data correlation (record "A" now relates to record "B" in a different information ecosystem). I suppose the only potential for rearchitecting one's approach would be to focus on using open standards (i.e., service-oriented architecture, microservices) in which different products can communicate back and forth, ideally between each other within an isolated offline instance and online. Or maybe Evernote will surprise us and fix their previously product offering, and I can continue my dependency on their previously awesome software even in light of its proprietary nature.

On 11/23/2020 at 6:55 PM, Enteecee said:

There are hundreds (thousands?) of posts all over these forums from people who dislike the new version, ranging from "Meh, not very good" to "You've trashed decades of work and the attendant trust in you".  Given that, Evernote should provide users two things.  First, a provisional timeline for feature parity, ideally enumerating exactly which features they plan to restore.  Second, as you point out, a commitment to support Legacy for a certain period, and statement that such support will be extended if specific benchmarks aren't met by the new product by that date.  If they genuinely think "there's little risk in introducing a new bug that would potentially block you from using the legacy version" that shouldn't be a difficult commitment to make.

. . .

Legacy should never have been "Legacy".  It should have remained the standard, while adventurous users should have been offered the exciting opportunity to help Evernote blaze the trail forward until they've got something worthy of replacing the current standard.

Exactly. The approach should have been to make the new version available, but not force everyone onto it. The current properly functional application should be maintained while they continue to improve the new-and-improved modern shared code base (etc. etc.) version separately. I understand where they're coming from, they want to simplify, reuse code, organize, modernize and try to future-proof their products, and where they're going with the new version is probably on the right path. However, to suddenly force (or at least mislead) everyone to upgrade (downgrade?) without warning, and to leave them no other option than to install a "legacy" version of the application, this is not the way to retain a loyal customers. If I were to suddenly force all of my users to start using vastly different version of a major production enterprise application, with performance problems (delays and freezing) and a lack of equivalent features, they would be making such noise that I would probably be left having to look for another job. And that's just one guy supporting code in one business. I can't imagine how all of the leadership at Evernote concluded that pushing out this new version the way that it was pushed out was the way to go, impacting hundreds of thousands if not millions of users, all nearly simultaneously. They should have taken a phased approach over six to nine months (maybe longer given their larger user base), requested feedback from those users, go back to fix, iterate over and over, re-release, and slowly expand the deployment audience. And even with a phased approach with smaller user counts at first, it still should have been optional. I get that it is absolutely impractical to pay for extra coders to continue simultaneously support both the older version and the newer version, and that unification and simplification is the smartest and most economical way forward for the business on the surface, but it should have been handled differently.

I agree as well. I was just looking to see if this issue has been mentioned and it looks as if I'm not alone.