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Posts posted by ScottLougheed

  1. Since the change to the paid tiers took place, there seems to be a non-removable sidebar nag to "upgrade your team", even for me, a premium user. When clicked, you are presented with an overlay describing Evernote Premium for Business. This overlay can only be dismissed by pressing the escape key. It cannot be dismissed by clicking outside of the overlay, nor does the overlay itself has an "x" or "close" button. 


    Have other Premium users encountered this sidebar item and overlay? Have you been able to remove it from your sidebar?


    For EN staff who might come across this:

    1) It does not make sense to thrust this advertisement on Premium users. There is no guarantee that a given premium user is part of a team, or is in a position to make such decisions even if they are part of a team.

    2) This sidebar item needs to be removable. Why allow premium users to remove Market and Announcements and Ads, but not this? Where's the logic in that. 

    3) The hard-to-dismiss overlay is frustrating and a bit aggressive. 

    Overall this is a disappointingly forceful move on Evernote's part. 

    • Like 1

  2. It has not been discretely disabled. Background sync, in general (not related to evernote, specifically) does appear to be somewhat flakey. Its particularly flakey on older devices, I found after upgrading to my iPhone 6 that it was working a fair bit more regularly. 


    One thing to remember is that this background updating isn't that frequent. Depending on the application, it could be as infrequent as once per hour. I've sometimes found it hard to detect whether it works or not with Evernote because often times its only a few notes that have been added since I last launched, and usually they are not large, so it can be difficult for me to discern whether they were downloaded at launch, or downloaded prior to launch... 


    Anyway, I don't trust it to flawlessly update my offline notebooks, I always manually verify their contents before I enter into a not-connected area. 

    • Like 3

  3. Yes, I tried the crop function, but unfortunately it's not the same and doesn't work for slides.

    For a start, you can't tell there is significant camera shake until after you've taken the photo and cropped it(by which time the slides have changed).

    Secondly, the other lacking feature is being able to change exposure. If you're taking a photo of a PowerPoint slide, you need to change the exposure level so it's visible as the brightness of the slide within a generally darkened room fools the camera meter. Zooming in digitally would hopefully at least cause the autoexposure to change, but it would be better to be able to also change it manually (like you can with the iOS camera app)

    Those are definitely two significant shortcomings of the built-in Evernote Camera if you are looking to use it as if it were a traditional camera. Unfortunately I don't think this is how Evernote is expecting it to be used, I think they are expecting it to be used primarily as if it were a scanner, which requires much different controls (and far fewer manual controls!). 


    I suspect your best bet is to use the iOS camera, then import all the images in bulk to Evernote afterwards. Since iOS stores your photos chronologically then it should be fairly easy to maintain order. Not an ideal workaround at all, but workarounds rarely are ideal otherwise they wouldn't be workarounds!

  4. Sure, I think Evernote would be wise to add this as an option for their camera, though with their smart document scanning system they've implemented I'm not sure it would work. Thats technical stuff only Evernote knows though, but one can speculate!


    A bit of an aside, in zooming the way you do you are "digitally zooming". This is not too different from (in fact, its almost identical to) taking the picture without zoom then cropping it down and sizing it back up. Given this to be the case, you could snap the photos using Evernote's camera without zoom, then crop them down afterwards achieving, essentially, the same effect (and all of the glorious quality loss inherent in either workflow in the absence of optical zoom!). 

    • Like 1

  5. This isn't possible at the moment. You'll have to add the scannable scan as a separate note and use the web or desktop application to merge or just drag the attachment to the other note. 


    On your phone: Possibly you could take the scannable scan, add it as an attachment to a new note, select the attachment in the note body, copy it, and paste it into your meeting notes note. Then delete the now-superfluous scannable scan note you just copied the attachment from. 

    • Like 1

  6. You might not need to do a backup of your Evernote database on your computer. Log into the web interface of Evernote and confirm that all of your notes are present there. If stye are all there you can uninstall and re-install the evernote application on your windows machine without needing to backup. (That being said, having backups of your computer is generally good practice so if you don't already have a backup system in place, you should consider doing so)

  7. Broken in what way? does it clip at all? Does it launch but not clip? Does it clip but clip badly? Does it clip but cause a crash? 


    Have you tried disabling/re-enabling the extension? 

    Have you tried uninstalling and re-installing the extension?


    the more-or-less non-optional cloud storage ... I'm not interested in broadcasting tens of students work and personal information in one fell swoop should there be a glitch or hack!


    My partner and I keep all our household documentation (insurance forms, car and veterinary receipts, recipes, records of wines we enjoyed, events we might be planning, etc) in Evernote. 


    See, that's the part that gets me. I'm not comfortable putting insurance forms, receipts, etc. in Evernote for the reason above, so I'm finding myself increasingly forced to look into other solutions like devonthink as I attempt to become more organized.


    I guess I'm surprised that you have security concerns that apply to student work, but not your own financial documents? Is the sharing functionality really useful enough trade-off for that risk?


    I don't see my insurance as being the same as financial information. My financial records do not go in Evernote. Sure, insurance contains personal info, but not in the same level of detail nor the same potential impact as detailed financial info. (Ironically, all of my banking and investments are stored on a cloud operated by my financial institutions, so... hard to know precisely how much more secure they are there!).

    Also, I am willing to take the heat for losing my own data. I refuse to put other people's data at risk. 

    • Like 1

  9. I suppose since this is an Evernote forum I might be smart to relate this back to Evernote. Continuing from my descriptions above, it might be worth inquiring, can this be reasonably approximated by Evernote? And if Evernote could reasonably approximate this functionality in these use cases, would it then still be a suitable option. 


    Evernote cannot index files outside of its database. Most of the literature I describe in the first use case is "indexed" (in the DEVONThink use of the term). That is, it resides in an arbitrary folder on my computer's hard drive (in this case, my personal literature collection in Dropbox, or a shared folder with my collaborators in Dropbox). Because 1) some of this literature is in a shared folder, and 2) I periodically like to access my own literature from other devices such as my iPad, it is fairly important to me that the files can live wherever I want them to. This is especially critical for the shared files, since I cannot impose organizational schemes and software on my collaborators. It would not 1) be reasonable to ask them to use Evernote,as would be required if I wanted to keep those files in Evernote and then share them with my collaborators; 2) it would be immensely inefficient to duplicate the contents of that shared folder in another program (not to mention a waste of space). 


    Evernote has "context" but it: 1) may suggest outside sources if you've configured it as such, and those sources are not appropriate for the work I do; 2) presents a small number of related notes or other content but the relationship does not seem to be as strong as the relationships identified in DT, which also presents a larger number of suggestions (and ranks them so you can see how related they are); 3) Does not offer any automated facilitation of organization. It relies on the user's own recollection of their taxonomical scheme and cannot make any suggestions to facilitate that process. If the user's organizational scheme in DEVONThink is reasonably carefully constructed (and you follow a couple of minor suggestion from DT's documentation), the Classify feature really speeds things up and I rarely have to think too hard about what belongs where. 


    In addition to academic literature, I have a growing amount of research data that contains potentially identifying and proprietary information on somewhat sensitive subject matter. I cannot store these on third-party servers , let alone third-party servers in another country, for various legal and common sense reasons. I appreciate being able to apply the same retrieval and organizational techniques facilitated by See Also & Classify on those research data for preliminary analysis prior to dumping them into my qualitative data analysis software, and for long-term storage after analysis. Even if Evernote were to be able to perform the "AI" functionality in the same way that DT does, the less robust database integrity and the more-or-less non-optional cloud storage would preclude my use of it in this case. This is also true of my second example related to teaching. It would be unwise to place student's data in a cloud service. Sure, the students probably worked on it in a dropbox or OneDrive folder, but in that instance they would be losing their own data if something went awry. I'm not interested in broadcasting tens of students work and personal information in one fell swoop should there be a glitch or hack!


    So again, Evernote gets some stuff, but for these more complex tasks, Evernote either lacks the functionality, doesn't comply with the rules of my institution or the law, or both. 


    But what does Evernote do very well? Sharing with other Evernote users. This is where DEVONThink doesn't perform so well, and indeed I don't think it even attempts to. DEVONThink allows me to use DT on files and my collaborators are none-the-wisers. This is okay for some stuff, but not for all.


    My partner and I keep all our household documentation (insurance forms, car and veterinary receipts, recipes, records of wines we enjoyed, events we might be planning, etc) in Evernote. Evernote does an amazing job here because we can add things and be assured that the other has them too. Clipping on mobile and desktop is great for recipes and event planning. The mobile apps make scanning items with our phone and tossing them into EN a breeze. We also almost always do most of our retrieval of recipes and many other documents on our mobile devices rather than desktop. Here again, EN wins out.


    EN and DT also share some elements that, when combined with EN's unique advantages make it especially suited to some use-cases. Tags are effective so our Cooking notebook is well-organized and it is easy to retrieve meals or use tags as criteria for searching. Cooking also gets all of our wine notes, easily excluded using tags (-tag:wine) or easily retrieved (tag:wine). It also makes the images of wine labels searchable, which DT does not do in quite the slick way (I could convert it to a PDF using DT but I find DT is better at converting scanned text to text, rather than images which happen to contain text, but again, the sharing in DT is lacking anyway). 


    It seems ironic to me, however, that while Evernote is increasingly pushing into work/enterprise, it is precisely those elements of my life that I've extracted from Evernote for various reasons (data integrity and security being critical, but just the start!). Evernote has proven itself immensely useful for exactly the type of thing Libin has in mind as he attempts to "shift from a consumer tool also used by businesses into one with workers in mind". For me, Evernote has shifted from being a work tool in which I also manage my household, to simply a household management tool. 

    DEVONThink is the tool that fuels my work (and some aspects of my personal) productivity, but is less good for many of the household management tasks Evernote continues to excel at. 

    • Like 1

  10. I primarily do social scientific research (if you're tuned into such things, we could say, broadly, I do some brand of Environmental Sociology/"Science and Technology in Society"). I have, and continue to, accumulate a very extensive library of digitized academic books and electronic journal articles. The breadth of the subject matter covered by this collection exceeds what any single manuscript or project would cover. That being said, there is considerable overlap. 


    I use "classify" (the top portion of the "See Also & Classify" pane) for helping me decide into which group/tag a new addition to my collection should be deposited. Sometimes it's the top suggestion, often its not (but this might me more indicative of a shortcoming of my organizational scheme than of the predictive capacity of the program). 


    I use "See also" primarily when I am consulting the literature for a new project or manuscript. In general I know the canonical texts for a given area and retrieve those first either through browsing or search (e.g., "Beck 1992" or simply "Beck" will bring up texts authored by Ulrich Beck, Or "Governmentality" will return Mitchell Dean's seminal elaboration on Foucault's theory of Governmentality usually as top results). However, it can be a bit laborious to locate in my rather large database, related materials. "see also" brings related content right up front, and you can get into a bit of a "rabbit hole" of sorts (which, in this case, is a good thing), as you locate a new article, use the "see also" on that to find another article or three, and use "see also", and so on. 


    So, used in conjunction with groups and tags, see also can surface a lot of relevant content quickly and without much manual intervention. It can often surface material that I might not have thought to consult, either because it had been a long time since I last read the article/book, or because I hadn't read it yet (I hate to admit I have a few too many articles I've nabbed but not read in their entirety), or because they are one section in a larger book or edited volume the title of which is not indicative of the diverse contents, and so on. Moreover, it can surface reading notes on articles as well, which I also store in DT. So instead of re-reading entire articles, I can often consult the reading notes I have (and those contain a link to the original PDF if I need to consult that). 


    So that's one way I use the see also and classify. In general I find it very effective for this use case. It's capabilities are not necessarily easily reproduced, not even, say, by an elaborate search language. Indeed, the DT system is much more familiar with the contents of every single article and book in my database than I am and can identify links between articles that I couldn't think to search for. Basically it helps me find more related content to read, and it does a remarkably good job of it. 


    Another way I use it is for some elements of the teaching I do. For example, a course I was a teaching assistant for required students to write three iterations of a complex essay. I put each iteration in their own folder (Essay 1, essay 2, essay 3). When it came to mark the 2nd or 3rd essays, DT would automatically surface the previous draft (or two drafts) in the "see also" so rather than having to locate it manually to consult and examine the extent of the students' revisions, I could just access it from the See Also pane. This might seem trivial, but the 30 seconds per essay it saves is significant when you have to do it for 40 essays on two different occasions (e.g., the second and third submissions). 

    • Like 1

  11. @ Scott

    You really want to get us talking about Wikipedia again, don't you :) "Thread," not link. Specifically, just a post or two down from where JM stopped reading.



    Ah, yes, that makes sense. In my scanning of the posts to catch up with the discussion I didn't think to follow a link to another discussion thread for this type of info!

    • Like 1



    Thanks for your post. All of your links/references seem to confirm my earlier post that Evernote was founded in 2007.

    It is also most interesting that Wikipedia is cited as the first reference a number of times.

    I understand, and accept, that Wikipedia is not an original, authoritative source for academic studies.

    But then, is any encyclopedia? I think not. They are, by definition, a summary of information provided by other sources.

    My main point above is that we should challenge any software developer who claims to provide AI in their product.

    "AI" has now become a marketing term, and is claimed by far more vendors than actually provide it.

    I'm just getting started evaluating DEVONthink. They do claim AI, but I'm not convinced yet.

    I am also not convinced that Evernote's Context is real AI. I've not seen any evidence that EN Context is self-learning, and updates/improves its own algorithms as it is used. Could be, I just have not seen it.


    Refreshed my memory:


    " the Evernote web service launched into open beta on June 24, 2008"


    June 24, 2008

    "Big news today: Evernote is now in Open Beta and we’ve rolled out many changes, including premium accounts.

    Four months ago, we introduced the invitation-only private beta of the new Evernote service. Our goal was to get about 10,000 people to use the system so we could fine-tune our servers and try out new features. We were blown away by the response and watched with equal parts of glee and horror as the closed beta users count passed 10,000, then 25,000, then 50,000… By the end of the four months, over 125,000 people had participated in the closed-beta! Luckily, our hardware, software and team held up with only minor incidents of spontaneous combustion."


    Feb 21, 2008

    Big news today, we officially launched our invitation-only beta for the all new Evernote Service. Read all about it in TechCrunch. There are only a limited number of beta invites available right now, but we’ll be releasing more in the coming days and weeks.

    So I guess I jumped in 1-2 months into the closed beta.

    Scary how time has flown.


    Please read the thread again. The date of 2000 is clearly written there. If you prefer to rely upon Wikipedia, then maybe I can go over there and change the date to 2000 so that everyone will then be in agreement :)

    I hate to perpetuate what has now diverged from the main topic of discussion, but GM, are you referring to the Wikipedia article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evernote ?

    If so, I actually can't find 2000 mentioned anywhere which now has me puzzled. 

  13. Whether it is truly AI or not is certainly an interesting question to pursue and is something worth exploring. However, I am largely uninterested in the name and much more interested in whether and how it fits into my workflow and enhances my productivity. So, whether it is really Artificial Intelligence, or whether it's a clever name for "word association" is irrelevant to me if it makes me work better, which it does!



    AI is the current rage, the current buzzword.  Lots of companies may claim they have an AI product, but few, IMO, meet the requirements for AI (see my above post).  It's mostly marketing hype, IMO.


    AI is very different from having clever, powerful, easy-to-use search engines.


    In general the use of the term AI has been intended to refer to the feature called AI by DEVONThink (and, subsequently, other people's use of "AI" to refer to similar features). While I can't speak for GM, I certainly did not mean to suggest that this truly was some form of AI, as I am not knowledgeable enough to make any accurate claims about what is or is not AI. Just using the noun that the company tosses around. 


    Sorry, I don't buy that "Related Notes" is anything close to Artificial Intelligence (AI).
    That's just search results.
    Frankly, I'm not sure I would even classify EN Context as AI -- seems more like marketing hype than anything else.
    Real AI would be if the Evernote algorithms (not data, but code) were changing (learning) in response to what you have entered in your Note.

    Real artificial intelligence is effectively thinking for itself. It can go beyond the built-in programming. It can evolve. AI can learn for itself



    Wasn't my claim, just suggesting that might have been the intended meaning. 

  16. @GM:


    I don't recall any AI in Evernote prior to 2014 with the introduction of EN Context.  Even then, I'm not sure I would call it an "emphasis".

    Evernote didn't even exist until 2008.

    Are you thinking of something different?

    "Related Notes" existed for a number of years prior to the release of "context" in 2014, which was basically the same as Context minus the media tie-ins. I suppose this could be considered a degree of AI but it isn't nearly as robust, as DT's which I'm sure you've discovered in your DT adventures!

    • Like 1
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