Move to OneNote !

[delawaredave 55]

Go to OneNote and don't get hosed by Evernote's outrageous pricing plans.  Here's link:

https://blogs.office.com/2016/03/11/make-the-move-from-evernote-to-onenote-today/

[GrumpyMonkey 4,319]

Or, stay and use the free service that still exists. Or, pay $30 a year for a product that you want to keep around in the future. Or, use other apps in conjunction with Evernote (that's what I do) if the free tier doesn't provide the functionality you need. I think it is fair for Evernote to ask its users to pay for the service if they get some benefit out of it. They are people just like us with lives, careers, and families to support. Facebook likes and free users won't pay the rent.

And, it seems like a mean-spirited thing to do, going onto a company's forum and starting a thread telling everyone to leave and go to a competitor. 

[delawaredave 55]

It is "mean spirited" to offer a free product for years, get users to invest it in, then spring dramatic increases and scr*w the base that supported you.

Microsoft Office 365 costs $60/year, and provides 10x the value, utility, and functionality for a professional over EN (5 or 6 apps, cloud storage, and OneNote).

And that price includes:  Cloud access, 1 PC, 1 phone, 1 tablet.

Evernote pricing is outrageous by any measure. 

[tavor 668]

EN Forum is quite open minded about letting people post information about the competition (a year or two ago, there was a long-running EN alternatives thread), and I appreciate that, but this kind of thread is just abusive of their policy.

If you have constructive criticism, or even just want to vent about the pricing change, there is a thread for that. And if you want to leave, and move to a competitor, do that. Just don't be obnoxious.

[GrumpyMonkey 4,319]

16 minutes ago, delawaredave said:

It is "mean spirited" to offer a free product for years, get users to invest it in, then spring dramatic increases and scr*w the base that supported you.

Microsoft Office 365 costs $60/year, and provides 10x the value, utility, and functionality for a professional over EN (5 or 6 apps, cloud storage, and OneNote).

And that price includes:  Cloud access, 1 PC, 1 phone, 1 tablet.

Evernote pricing is outrageous by any measure. 

Evernote offered a free product. It continues to offer a free product. Nothing changed there. In fact, they just added a feature (pin lock) to the free plan. I don't see how giving you something free is mean spirited or scr*wing over the user base.

Evernote did adjust the number of devices from unlimited to limited. It did raise its prices. Adjustments like this have happened in the past. They will happen in the future. Every company, including Microsoft, has to adjust to market conditions. Apparently, judging by the changes, Evernote has decided the old revenue stream wasn't working. Is it better to run the company into the ground so that no one gets to use it, or is it better to make adjustments?

As for price comparisons, that's fine, but I guess that depends on what your priorities are. Please do subscribe to MS if you want, but you don't need to come here and start threads disrespecting this company because you chose another product. And, vice versa. I hope Evernote users coming over from Microsoft aren't doing anything like this in those forums. 

Personally, Evernote's new pricing is beyond what I am willing to pay for any subscription service, but I respect the decisions of folks who are fine with it, and I don't  see anything outrageous here.

[gazumped 11,656]

If you're into photography,  Adobe's 'most popular' package for their suite of apps is $60 per month.  Mindjet mind mapping software is $400 annually.  By comparison Evernote is not expensive,  even for the premium plan - although like I just cancelled my Mindjet subscription because I'm using Freeplane (which is free like it sounds),  it obviously makes sense to downgrade or drop a subscription if you can't afford it or have a cheaper alternative.  IMHO if you're then contacted by the company and asked 'why are you leaving?' it's fine to say "I found something better/ cheaper".  Anything else is just flouncing.

[delawaredave 55]

Get real - those are commercial program - with commercial functionality far beyond a note-taker like Evernote.

I understand "freemium" model.  I understand Feedly, Pocket, and others have "Pro" versions for $30 year.

Evernote is disingenuous and using sleezy "Bait and Switch" tactics by taking away features of Free version (cropping to 2 devices).  

Instead they should be adding value by adding wanted features and advancing the product to encourage people to pay for Pro versions.

The product isn't advancing, they're just monetizing their earlier bait.

[s2sailor 2,186]

1 hour ago, delawaredave said:

Evernote is disingenuous and using sleezy "Bait and Switch" tactics by taking away features of Free version (cropping to 2 devices).

Good grief.  If anything they are guilt of poor communication.  If you haven't read it elsewhere yet you will still be able to logon on from other devices but you will be asked to select which two devices you want to currently use.  You have really only lost  convenience and not function.

As a premium user I agree that they should be adding more value especially in light of the new increase.

[gazumped 11,656]

Evernote claim to convert something less than 5% of their total customer base to paying customers.  They're shooting for 200M users in July,  so that means they're currently carrying (and I use the term carefully) well over 150M free users.  I don't have any way to estimate how many of those are active,  or to what extent; but the storage and bandwidth required even to keep all those account details and allow for a small percentage to sync regularly must be something akin to running IT services for a small country - like Russia.  Like Russia,  Evernote is not a charity.

Basic accounts are free to users,  but they must be a major cost item to Evernote.  Agreed there are promotional benefits to having this level - it allows folk to try out the features,  learn to use them and move on,  if they wish to,  to another level.  If someone has used a basic account for any length of time though,  it's pretty clear that they won't ever upgrade,  and are committed to freeloading.

Where in all that is there an incentive for Evernote to spend more resources developing better features for the basic account in hopes that some generous user will decide to pay a little more for the service s/he's using?  I'd say the company's first priority is to ensure its continued existence.  They've dropped premises,  and staff,  increased prices (twice) and now they're offering a stronger incentive for basic users to pay up or perambulate off.

When I realised I was using the app on a regular basis I went premium.  Not because I needed the extra features (although on occasion they do come in handy) and definitely not for the mega storage - I was a major uploader for a couple of years,  while digitising a work library I'd built up,  but since then I use about 1% of my monthly limit on a regular basis. 

I pay because the company needs income to develop better features and in the past several years my use of Evernote has grown alongside it's expanding range of services.

It's amazing how many posts I've seen over the years from Basic users who have nobly said "If only Evernote would add/ improve <this random feature>" I would consider subscribing.  I don't know whether Evernote ever fell for such blatant and insincere blackmail in the early days,  but I'd hope they're pretty immune now.

Evernote isn't being 'disingenuous and sleazy' or using bait and switch.  They're making commercial decisions to continue servicing the users who actually pay for their service.  It's unlikely they'll make any major change in their strategy,  even on the basis of this feedback.  So (like the UK recently) it's Time to Decide:  In or Out?

[CalS 5,280]

1 hour ago, delawaredave said:

Evernote is disingenuous and using sleezy "Bait and Switch" tactics by taking away features of Free version (cropping to 2 devices).

The Bait is pretty old after 6 or 7 years.  Maybe they should have switched it earlier....  But hang on, EN can still be used for free wherever on whatever you want, just have to log out.  So not sure it actually got switched?

[DDr_12 4]

On 7/3/2016 at 7:26 AM, delawaredave said:

Go to OneNote and don't get hosed by Evernote's outrageous pricing plans.  Here's link:

https://blogs.office.com/2016/03/11/make-the-move-from-evernote-to-onenote-today/

Great post! Thanks for the link.

Don't see why people get so ticked off by posting a tool. Users want to protect their data, including the ability to migrate. Nobody wants to invest time and effort into a system and then throw it away or redo the work.

The tool makes EN a lower risk, IMHO.

But as for me, I'm using OneNote- complete with its hangs, slow sync, and slow to clip to new notebooks. Saving and then searching PDFs...GREAT! Free-form notes added onto docs (mostly) works.

Just don't expect support from M$. But...their support forums aren't full of angry 'supporting' people who belittle other posters when they are dissatisfied. EN as a whole has a "bad attitude" towards users.

I think that's their biggest problem. If EN and 'supporters' valued feedback and tried to help and encourage their (fellow) users, they would likely be much more popular.

Before the guard dogs start barking, realize rudeness from 'supporters' is pervasive and only took a few posts to read about a tool to find one.

 

 

 

[Dave-in-Decatur 3,950]

3 hours ago, DDr_12 said:

Just don't expect support from M$. But...their support forums aren't full of angry 'supporting' people who belittle other posters when they are dissatisfied. EN as a whole has a "bad attitude" towards users.

I think that's their biggest problem. If EN and 'supporters' valued feedback and tried to help and encourage their (fellow) users, they would likely be much more popular.

Before the guard dogs start barking, realize rudeness from 'supporters' is pervasive and only took a few posts to read about a tool to find one.

Guess I'm a "supporter," but I don't think I'm rude. There have been 2 or 3 "supporters" who have made what I would consider rude replies to people raising the roof about the price and service changes. But there have been dozens of people posting comments hostile to Evernote that would be considered flames, and reported and deleted, on a good many other forums. Frankly, I think EN is remarkably tolerant of negativity from its users (both ongoing and departing). How is any of this a "bad attitude" toward users on their part? I've been on a fair number of user-to-user forums, and I have never seen anything approaching the level of spite and vituperation that some users display all over these forums. "Where's my feature?" "Why isn't this fixed?" "I need 3 devices for free!" ... often accompanied by character-assassination terms like "sleazy," "disingenuous," and much worse, as people make angry assertions about EN staff's evil intentions, laziness, and incompetence. The level of flaming here is just beyond anything I've ever experienced on a (mostly) user-to-user software support forum.

I suppose it could be explained by concluding that EN really does have this "bad attitude" that causes justifiable anger on the part of its users. But I don't buy it. 95% of the 'tude that I see here is from disgruntled users, and it's not just in response to the price and service changes--it's been all over the forums and all throughout the few recent months that I've been active here. I'm at a loss to explain it, but it makes this a really unpleasant place to come and try to help other users. The only thing I can think of is that if you give people today a good service for free, they come to think that they personally have earned and deserved it, and that any changes not to their liking, or failure to implement their desired improvements immediately, is a violation of their rights. If there are something like 150,000,000 users of EN, then none of us is being personally attacked, ignored, neglected, or abused by anything that EN does. We may be angered by it, or feel betrayed by it; but it isn't personal, and to respond with personal attacks on EN and its staff is unfair at best.

EN did a really poor job of communicating the coming changes, both in terms of lead time and in terms of clarity. But they're not evil and they don't hate us. If and when my Premium subscription price goes up from US$45 to US$70, I'll be unhappy. But I hope I'll be able to respond to it in a way that doesn't embarrass myself or those who read my responses.

[delawaredave 55]

People have this emotion because taking away functionality that used to be free is sleazy and disingenuous.   "Pro" versions of software are very common - and companies are free to charge (and raise) what pricing they think they can command.

I cannot name a company that reneged on free software functionality and took it away - can you ? 

I think OneNote has a lot of potential - especially its integration with Office 365.  The note formatting in OneNote is superior to Evernote (which has horrible text formatting).

But OneNote does not have tagging (yet) and I can't figure out the search yet.

If you scan a lot, OneNote integrates really well with Microsoft Lens - the best scanning app on the planet, by far - it is amazing how it scales and proportions the image if you camera is tilted.

So I wish the best for everyone to find the note taking solution that meets their needs and budget.  I also hope that EN can take note taking "to the next level" and be rewarded through subscriptions by the marketplace.  

 

[Dave-in-Decatur 3,950]

Thanks, Dave. And I agree, I hope that everyone is able to find what works for them in their particular circumstances.

But I can't agree about "sleazy and disingenuous." I haven't used a lot of free major software over the years (I suddenly realize), so I can't answer about others who've "taken away" free functionality. (And I mean genuinely free, not paid for by selling my personal info.) Anything I use for serious purposes is generally paid. Anyway, the 2-device limit may be absurdly low in today's tech world; and the changes could and should have been announced well in advance. But there's nothing sleazy about changing the terms on something you're giving away for nothing. I did once cancel a magazine subscription when they totally revamped the thing; I felt that the promise made in taking an advance subscription had been violated. But again, that was something I paid for. IMHO, an expectation that something will continue to be free and get better or stay the same indefinitely is too shaky for the disappointment of it to be considered sleazy (as opposed to just, well, disappointing).

[TechPerplexed 222]

47 minutes ago, delawaredave said:

I cannot name a company that reneged on free software functionality and took it away - can you ? 

Yes, I can. LogMeIn. 

http://radialcreations.com/the-death-of-logmein-free/

[Dave-in-Decatur 3,950]

14 minutes ago, Sophia said:

Yes, I can. LogMeIn. 

http://radialcreations.com/the-death-of-logmein-free/

That's an interesting parallel, and in some ways much worse than what EN has done: LogMeIn went from free to $99/year (with an initial 50% discount) and gave you a week to pay or lose your service entirely; and they had in fact promised to keep it free forever, which EN never did.

[GrumpyMonkey 4,319]

14 minutes ago, Dave-in-Decatur said:

That's an interesting parallel, and in some ways much worse than what EN has done: LogMeIn went from free to $99/year (with an initial 50% discount) and gave you a week to pay or lose your service entirely; and they had in fact promised to keep it free forever, which EN never did.

Hi. Actually, Evernote has repeatedly made this promise to be free forever. From a 2010 blog post: "Evernote is free. You can use Evernote forever without paying us a cent, and we’re ok with that. To some, this may seem crazy, but thanks to Evernote Premium, it’s actually a business model that works..." The thinking behind this is that people can put everything into Evernote without hesitation, because they know that even if they don't ever pay, or stop paying, they can still access the data they have accumulated (this also helps explain monthly upload amounts and "unlimited" storage on their servers). If they don't keep this promise, I think they will have a problem, because it would undermine their foundational philosophy. 

4 hours ago, DDr_12 said:

Great post! Thanks for the link.

Don't see why people get so ticked off by posting a tool. Users want to protect their data, including the ability to migrate. Nobody wants to invest time and effort into a system and then throw it away or redo the work.

 

I'm not angry. I'm not a dog. This is a community of Evernote users, where people like myself come to talk with other users about the product, and we post links to competing services and tools when it is relevant. Usually, in my case, I try to make comparisons among products and show what Evernote could do to improve, or highlight the strengths and weaknesses of the service. One could certainly criticize me for even doing that.

The original poster went a step further and created a thread telling users to leave Evernote along with the link to facilitate it. That seems mean-spirited to me. If you want to leave, fine, but I don't think you should use a company's forums to attack it and actively try to push users to another product. This goes for Onenoters on their forums pushing users away from that product to Evernote as well. That's just not friendly at all, and I prefer a friendly forum to a hostile one.

But, we don't have moderators anymore (it's crowd-sourced these days), so it isn't my call. Post whatever you want -- as Dave said, Evernote will probably not do anything about it.

[TechPerplexed 222]

1 hour ago, Dave-in-Decatur said:

That's an interesting parallel, and in some ways much worse than what EN has done: LogMeIn went from free to $99/year (with an initial 50% discount) and gave you a week to pay or lose your service entirely; and they had in fact promised to keep it free forever, which EN never did.

Yes, it's much worse than what Evernote has done. At that time, LogMeIn sold their Android app for $30. Several of my family members bought a copy, only to have the free service taken away for good a few months later. We literally flushed hundreds of dollars down the drain, especially because from then on, LMI increased their prices exponentially each year. Our pleas for a refund were countered that we were welcome to purchase their pro plan at a 50% discount... but I think it is not hard to see why we declined the offer.

We all moved to TeamViewer and couldn't be happier with their services. All we use it for is to maintain our Home Theater PC and help my 80+ parents with their computer.

I can't help but feel a certain similarity though, hence my post count went up from about 5 to 30 this week alone in expressing my disappointments. 

[delawaredave 55]

Someone said elsewhere (I think) that historically only 5% of EN's base pays subscription.

That shows that it was overpriced.  So raising the price is going to help ?  Duh.   

They need a "Lite" tier for $15/year that includes some limited number of off-line handheld stored notes (100 ?).  I think a lot of people that will never pay $40 would pay $15 for this "Lite" tier.

I am getting more comfortable with OneNote - still in "beta" for me - but I can easily go over and be fine.

Microsoft has a winner with Office 365.  If you do not have it, try it before sending $40 to Evernote.

[gazumped 11,656]

27 minutes ago, delawaredave said:

Someone said elsewhere (I think) that historically only 5% of EN's base pays subscription

That was (probably) me,  based on 2-year old guesstimated stats - which were before Evernote introduced the 'Plus' tier at a lower price.  Evernote took submitting notes by email away from Basic at the same time.  Conversion may,  or may not have improved since.  The issue with upgrading however has always been "why would you pay when you get all this for free?"  Hence - presumably - the 2-device limit.

[delawaredave 55]

Rather than paying $40 for EN, which is NUTS, I subscribed to Office 365 for $10-20 more. 

Office 365 is awesome - much better value and utility.

I have not yet figured out how to do all the same things in OneNote as EN - not sure all the same functionality can be replicated - but  it is clear OneNote can "do the job"  for me.

Is there offline access with OneNote ?  Reading below looks so ?  Nice !

https://support.office.com/en-us/article/Can-I-work-offline-d75e8b4d-fd37-4fd7-afbf-4ec285fe76c3?ui=en-US&rs=en-US&ad=US

 

[Sayre Ambrosio 520]

On 7/8/2016 at 4:04 AM, delawaredave said:

Rather than paying $40 for EN, which is NUTS, I subscribed to Office 365 for $10-20 more. 

Office 365 is awesome - much better value and utility.

I have not yet figured out how to do all the same things in OneNote as EN - not sure all the same functionality can be replicated - but  it is clear OneNote can "do the job"  for me.

Is there offline access with OneNote ?  Reading below looks so ?  Nice !

https://support.office.com/en-us/article/Can-I-work-offline-d75e8b4d-fd37-4fd7-afbf-4ec285fe76c3?ui=en-US&rs=en-US&ad=US

 

There are things that OneNote can do that EN can't and vice versa. I have Office 365 and seriously hate OneNote. I use all the other features of the plan and I have the family subscription so my 10 bucks a month can be shared with five people. Some of whom use OneNote and some don't. Each of us get all the features that you do so I understand why you like it.

I however will be staying for EN and staying Premium. 

The pricing structure change has people angry and I can see where they coming from as I was too when I first saw it. But I looked into what other software I use and OneNote doesn't play nice with it.

I use some "commercial" apps as you put it and I'm a stay at home mom, author and not "commercial" in anyway. That was kind of a silly statement TBH.

The way I see it EN works better for the way I think. I am an Aspie and I have to have clean and simple yet powerful so I stay with EN.

OneNote gave me an anxiety attack because it wasn't intuitive. (I used OneNote for years before discovering EN). I don't like that there's no tagging system in OneNote. EN has learned my tags over the years. I scanned some stuff in the other day and went to tag it and it was already done and where it needed to be.

At the end of the day people can vent, rant, try to influence others but it's an individual choice. If it's not something that you are willing to pay for then don't. If you want to stay then awesome. If not you can move on without being rude about it.

[OrbWeaver 83]

If MS ever figures out how to sync notebooks in a reasonable amount of time time (under 45 minutes would be nice) EN will have a serious competitor. Until  then, I'll stick with EN and its one-chance-in-ten startup. It's easier to try to get EN running ten times (start-hang-end process, repeat 9 more times) than to wait for MS to sync. If sync is not required though, OneNote wins easily these days. Since EN 6.4.2, the frustration level at trying to get it running means any local stuff goes to OneNote by default. Once the MS sync works reliably, so will the online stuff. Hint...hint...fix the hanging EN...

Next morning update...

Went back to 6.3.3 and everything's just wonderful again. No more hanging at startup.

[gazumped 11,656]

12 hours ago, OrbWeaver said:

Went back to 6.3.3 and everything's just wonderful again. No more hanging at startup.

If and when you get the urge to update again,  do raise any problems with Support (if you can) or contact Evernote on Twitter @EvernoteHelps.  Without knowing your system setup it's not possible to work out why it should hang at all - you're the only person with this issue AFAIK.  Evernote may accidentally fix whatever is bothering your setup for next time - but with your feedback they'd be able to duplicate the issue and work on a specific fix.

 

[Pearceweb 2]

It amazes me that you are complaining that Evernote finally decided to charge for all that they offer. For years I used it for free and felt somewhat guilty for not paying for something I used each and every day. I literally use it all day long. I used OneNote back in a previous job and never loved it, well except for the formatting, that is one thing I would love to see Evernote fix. When you copy and paste between Evernote and Office Products it would be nice if the formatting looked better but part of that could be MS. 

Back to the point, Evernote offers a fantastic product and if you are willing to use it on two devices it is in a sense free. Sure you might not have all of the functionality but why would anyone give that away for free. Eventually companies have to make money, Facebook does chanrge but they make plenty of money off of you and your data. Data storage costs money and again great products can't stay free for ever. 

To me spending $28.00 for Evernote Plus was a steal and I was happy to pay for it. 

[Sayre Ambrosio 520]

19 hours ago, Pearceweb said:

It amazes me that you are complaining that Evernote finally decided to charge for all that they offer. For years I used it for free and felt somewhat guilty for not paying for something I used each and every day. I literally use it all day long. I used OneNote back in a previous job and never loved it, well except for the formatting, that is one thing I would love to see Evernote fix. When you copy and paste between Evernote and Office Products it would be nice if the formatting looked better but part of that could be MS. 

Back to the point, Evernote offers a fantastic product and if you are willing to use it on two devices it is in a sense free. Sure you might not have all of the functionality but why would anyone give that away for free. Eventually companies have to make money, Facebook does chanrge but they make plenty of money off of you and your data. Data storage costs money and again great products can't stay free for ever. 

To me spending $28.00 for Evernote Plus was a steal and I was happy to pay for it. 

Couldn't have said it better myself.

[OrbWeaver 83]

I have to agree that it is a fantastic bargain. I too would like to see a few enhancements on the formatting front but if that would mean taking forever to sync as OneNote does, or being unable to easily copy text from my note to elsewhere (OneNote has major problems by using DIBs for everything) I'll stick with Evernote. I've been Premium for a few years but had to back down to Plus for the coming year. I'd rather have reliable than pretty.

[WilliamL 654]

Onenote is a great product too, however its syncing is not as flexible as evernote.  Quick example, on my android its set to automatically sync once per hour, onenote can only sync when I open it.  So with evernote I can be confident within a fair reason that when I open my android app and I have no signal my documents are likely to be there.  Onenote needs me to hold its hand through this, whilst for many thats not a problem, my Android tablet is often in no wifi places, so onenote would not be helpful there.

Evernote is not massively expensive, I think the pricing is fair, if people want to move to onenote, fair enough, its a good product but planning ahead with things that can be automatic will be required.  Id rather not do that. 

[sgtaylor5 9]

Just wanted to say: I love Evernote, but, boy it sure is an individual choice! Evernote Premium just works the way my mind thinks. Can't stress that enough. I tried to switch to OneNote 2016 today to save some money and just couldn't bring myself to even look at one converted page in OneNote for more than 2 minutes. Just finished deleting everything I uploaded into OneNote.

I tell my customers that if they are the creative type and are more free-flowing, then OneNote might be a better choice. If they are more structured and particular in how they think, they might be more comfortable in Evernote.

I need to be able to edit my web clippings and pages the way I want them to be saved: no advertising, no photographs or graphics unless they are necessary for the article, simple, uniform formatting and easy to read. On the other hand, the ability to OCR the text out of a picture on OneNote so that you don't need the picture is fantastic. If you are the type that puts everything digital possible into your notebooks, then it's OneNote, all the way. If you can keep the picture and search for the content within it, Evernote works. Evernote even OCR's my handwriting from my scanned in Padfolio sheets! I still think that's amazing.

Update Dec 14, 2016: In light of the recent Privacy Policy, I downloaded OneNote again and tried harder. Still didn't work. On Windows, either OneNote app (either UWP or Win32) still uses about twice as much memory as Evernote does. On Android, I use Nova Launcher Prime as my launcher, or shell. OneNote consistently makes the whole screen save the wallpaper, vanish, then reappear a few seconds later when I open it. The OneNote icon opens up into Recent Pages, when I want it to open to one of my four notebooks (think Stacks in Evernote) to get at my Sections (think Notebooks in Evernote). Can't make it change.