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Control Which Image Shown in a Note's Thumbnail/Snippet View


marcelo

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On 8/9/2017 at 7:52 AM, ToddinTX said:

I think it's obvious, at this point, that Evernote users want the ability to select the default thumbnail for notes.  I agree that it seems ridiculous that this conversation started in 2013 and 4 years later this hasn't been added to the application.  As a visual person, the thumbnail helps me quickly find what I'm looking for.  For example, when I'm looking for a recipe for pancakes, an image of the video (pertaining to the recipe) of two cooks doesn't help me find what I'm looking for.  I need to be able to select the pic of the stack of pancakes.

The whole purpose for using Evernote is to be able to organize things so that they are easily found/accessed.  I'm confused why this isn't already an option.  This seems so simple to implement.

Can we get some love on this issue?!

So I'm just starting with Evernote, it's 2020 and why is this still not an option? There are so many great things about this platform but so many agrevating things that suck all my time and energy from my projects that I end up losing my enthusiasm for them. 😐 Then I read posts from years ago like this and I am even more frustrated. 😡

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What does it take for Evernote to provide this basic functionality.  Big demand going back at least 8 years.

A FIX: Image->Right-Click->Make Note Thumbnail, can't be more than a couple of minutes work.

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This has been requested for over 10 years and with my limited programming skills I believe this could be implemented in a day or two. There could be some backend server database issues but it's not technically hard when they already can use an image, it wouldn't be that much work to make it possible for a user to select it.

Evernote is the most shi**y company when it comes to listening to it's users, frustrating and sad. I already use a couple of other services but none is as complete and they know it and just keeps on lazily surfing on their initial success. If I had an option I would leave immediately.

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Could someone from Evernote please explain why this LONG-requested, seemly-quite-reasonable feature is NOT being addressed? It's hard to imagine why selecting/presenting a thumbnail–which is currently done in a naive, automated fashion–couldn't be a user-driven feature. If we missing something, please let us know.

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I asked a tech about this feature to see if he can maybe move this decade long request up the developer ladder so we'll see. Below is his email reply I just got from him (Oleg-VERY nice and helpful tech!)...

 

Oleg T (Evernote Help and Learning)

Oct 28, 2020, 14:44 PDT

Hi Nick,

Thanks for writing back. The ability to control which image is shown in a note's thumbnail/snippet view has been a popular feature request for quite some time. I certainly agree that this functionality would be very beneficial to many of users.

With that being said, I'm more than happy to raise the priority of this feature request via the internal channel. I’ve gone ahead and sent a note of this to our development team. While we can’t commit to getting all feature requests into the product, we do rely on our community to tell us what they’d like to see in the future.

Please let me know if I can be of any other assistance.

Best regards,

Oleg T
Technical Support Specialist
Mon-Fri, 9:00-5:00 CST

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Hmmm, I wonder how many other companies can ignore their customer's top request for a decade and still remain relevant?

Just a reminder Evernote for this kind of arrogance and mentality, as the following businesses, as well as many others, all once dominated and yet are no longer around...

  • Border's Books
  • PanAm
  • Toy's R Us
  • Tower Records
  • Blockbuster Video (technically, I think there's still 1 store-lol)
  • Sears
  • Lehman Brothers

...only time will tell!

 

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+1 to this. Is this really all that hard to implement? Just let us have an option when we right click on a picture to set it as the thumbnail image. This makes searching and locating my notes much easier!!! 

I love evernote but the speed at which basic updates/features are implemented is appalling! 

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Yikes, I used to be able to solve this by deleting all the irrelevant images in a note until I got one I liked - but now THAT doesn't even work anymore! Now this most recent "update" is apparently caching the original image it deemed thumbnail-worthy so I can't change it no matter what. After 8 years of struggling with thumbnail images I am at my wit's end!!!!

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Dear Evernote Admins.

Please take not of how few people are saying this is a bad idea (Zero at last count) and how many are in support of this feature.

I really am getting so fed up of waiting ten years for basic functionality!

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7 hours ago, Eduardo Estefano said:

 Now that they have re-implemented the encryption edition, I have a feeling that this long lasting feature will be implemented soon. 

Well this thread had been going since 2011. No change in a decade so I'm not holding my breath even though the image thumbnail is broken in v10.

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This feature would be particularly useful when you have an audio attachment that is quite big. It shows you the 'audio' icon. In order to overrule this I had to add an image that is even bigger than the attachment which blows the note size unnecessarily up. 

Found WORKAROUND:
So - size doesn't matter apparently. Whatever your algorithm is doing it has nothing to do with file size when there are audio & image files present.

First: insert the image you want to see in the snippets view for example.
Second: add your audio file.

P.S.: This is for the PC version

Edited by carolinj2010
Found workaround
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This is a feature that needs to be implemented asap. The algorithm doesn't make sense at all. Why would the biggest image be the most important?

For example, I want YouTube thumbnails or book covers to be the main image preview after I have captured them with my screenshot tool.

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I can edit the metadata of my notes. I've been working with IT development and databases since before this bug (being unable to edit the thumbnail metadata field) was reported, and it is no reason this couldn't be added an half a day's work, and tested in the next half - or say a whole new day to be generous (the documenting could be done here). And give it yet another day to write a simple if/then clause to select either the automatically created thumbnail or the manually added one for display. So, in less than a week this could be fixed. It's not even complicated, it's simply another field in the metadata!

And, by the way, if functionality is not enough: the automatic thumbnail often detracts from the experience of the product. Truncated titles for those who don't need thumbnails, and eyesores for the visual needs some of us have.

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1 minute ago, gazumped said:

technically unable

I understand how the sausage is made. They're not technically unable to make this happen.

As paying customers, we're fully within our rights to make noise about a feature we want in the company-provided forum for just that purpose.

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No dev team will ever fulfill „all“ wishes of users, subscribers, wanna-bes and other stakeholders. If they did, the software would simply become unusable.

A couple of features get implemented over time, others not, some never. There must not even be any logic behind it. It is normal that in every dynamic project things happen in a non linear chain of events. What it hip and top notch today may fall to new priorities tomorrow.

What I found interesting: In this quite extensive thread there is little talk about other apps allowing to pick thumbnails for notes. Putting it negatively, the feature seems pretty low priority for all in the market.

Putting it positively, EN has a real chance to set itself apart with a very limited technical effort. It can’t be difficult to allow a user to select a piece of content and make the thumbnail from it.

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23 hours ago, jrryj said:

Seems like I'm not the only one experiencing this problem,

Hi.  It doesn't seem like the worst issue Evernote users have to deal with, but you have 449 votes and 8 pages of agreement. However this isn't a democracy,  and (AFAICS) Evernote aren't amazingly stupid - they're not obliged to honour requests here,  but they normally try to accommodate users where they can.  If they can add thumbnail choices,  they'll do it when the task fits their schedule.  Meantime - if you didn't already - please vote at the top left of this page...

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On 8/10/2021 at 7:16 PM, PinkElephant said:

Anything substantial to say ? Or just venting hot air ?

You can add your vote to the request by clicking on the button top left.

Well maybe that's because it's the only rational explanation after waiting 10+ years for a seemingly basic feature.

And what's venting air seems to be voting for this feature, as user votes seeem to be completely ignored by the devs 😐

We're in 2022, still no way to do this?

As people have said, if you cannot allow the user to pick the thumbnail for whatever reason, then at least change the heuristic used to pick the thumbnail and pick the first thumbnail in the note. And if the design is so bad that you cannot find the first thumbnail of the note from wherever that code runs because they're not accessible in sorted order in the database or whatever, then do not display thumbnails in notes ! or allow to disable that broken feature. I'd much rather have no thumbnail than a random image which is both distracting, misleading, and even though inside the note, might be irrelevant to the note preview in its globality (when you have 20 images in a note, clearly, this happens)

How to frustrate users & send tables flippin 101...

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3 hours ago, Steven Gauck said:

I don't get why EN has not picked up on this.

This is a feature suggestion thread,  not a request forum.  Evernote take up those requests that they can fulfil - within budgets of time and cost - and which will benefit users to the extent of (in their view) generating more business.

The existing process of choosing an image (I guess) is because

  1. Many users won't make a specific choice of image for every note,  so they need an automatic assignment of one image from the note.
  2. Since many will be clips of web pages,  it's possible that some images will be low-res icons which would not contribute to the purpose of a thumbnail.
  3. It's also possible that users will have included very large image files which would also not be useful if shrunk down too small - and which would very considerably bulk out the database if thumbnails are kept as separate files - as they'd have to be to keep the overhead of repeatedly shrinking the originals down (which would also slow things down!)
  4. So Evernote chose a process which avoids icons and large images but still selects the smallest (probably) significant image in the note.

They haven't yet found a need to change that,  and won't (usually) comment on why,  when or whether they might do something differently.  We'll just have to wait...  

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On 3/19/2022 at 7:12 PM, gazumped said:

This is a feature suggestion thread,  not a request forum.  Evernote take up those requests that they can fulfil - within budgets of time and cost - and which will benefit users to the extent of (in their view) generating more business.

The existing process of choosing an image (I guess) is because

  1. Many users won't make a specific choice of image for every note,  so they need an automatic assignment of one image from the note.
  2. Since many will be clips of web pages,  it's possible that some images will be low-res icons which would not contribute to the purpose of a thumbnail.
  3. It's also possible that users will have included very large image files which would also not be useful if shrunk down too small - and which would very considerably bulk out the database if thumbnails are kept as separate files - as they'd have to be to keep the overhead of repeatedly shrinking the originals down (which would also slow things down!)
  4. So Evernote chose a process which avoids icons and large images but still selects the smallest (probably) significant image in the note.

They haven't yet found a need to change that,  and won't (usually) comment on why,  when or whether they might do something differently.  We'll just have to wait...  

Well they won't even fix the broken external protocol links so I'm stuck on the legacy version until they ever get around to that in any case.

 

They don't seem to give a f what users want.

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On 6/2/2022 at 6:43 PM, gazumped said:

... From recent discussions where Evernote seems reluctant to change a thumbnail,  even where the image is deleted from a note,  I wonder whether it might be possible to start a new note using one chosen image,  so that the note gets a suitable thumbnail - and then copy/ paste the content of another original note including random other images into that new container with the approved thumbnail...

?

This is possible! I wrote this long time ago.. But if you start a new note.. The 1(picture for the thumbnail) should be the very first thing to put in.. Then when you 2(write the title) of the note it will update the thumbnail and then you can paste or write anything else.. The thumbnail won't change again in this note.. If you've copied and pasted from another note.. You can then delete this old one.. 

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20 hours ago, ttony said:

The way I see it is, Evernote could easily have existed without ever introducing a thumbnail feature. They could have also, in theory, never introduced a title feature as well. But they did! The title and the thumbnail are features that help organize, identify, and locate your notes; which is the entire point of this app.

Imagine if the app auto selected a random (or by arbitrary algorithm) a sentence in the body of your note to use for the title. That would be completely unacceptable; no one would ever use the app because that would make no sense. Why should it be OK for the thumbnail to be auto-selected then?
 

ttony, well said. I think you nailed why we're all so baffled this isn't important enough for them to fix.

Also, welcome to the thread. (Now it's customary to wait until PinkElephant and/or gazumped tells you why you're wrong/uninformed. It's fun!)

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The thumbnail for one of my notes is an image that doesn't even exist in the note and there's still no way to fix it... Thanks Evernote...

(I think it was an image I accidentally added when I first made the note and later deleted.. but it's still the thumbnail).

I would honestly prefer not having the thumbnail feature than having the feature not work properly with no way to fix it. 

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OK, got it. I think anything else would have too many words, and "largest smallest" probably works because it's short and easy to remember (and apparently self-contradictory). Cool.

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Yeah. For example, if you have 3 images with the following dimensions:

75x100

100x400

200x300

The "smallest" dimensions are 75, 100, and 200, respectively. We're going to use the image with the largest of those "smallest" dimensions (i.e., 200).

There are probably better ways to describe that algorithm, but that's how we've been describing it internally.

Thanks for the explanation. I guess if someone really wanted to promote a specific image, they could use a photo editor to re-size the photos. That's too much work for me.

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An alternative is the image with the largest number of pixels. This is a good predictor of importance of the image to the note's content.

e.g.

75x100=7500

100x400=40000

200x300=60000

250x150=37500

Largest -> 200x300=60000

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One way to express this in a more definitive way is the image with the largest width, assuming that your example you gave is in the order of width x height.

My list is ordered by increasing size of smallest dimension. We don't want to pick the image with the largest width, since that would result in us selecting things like graphical horizontal lines (e.g., 600x1) for some notes, which isn't very useful.

For example, what if we add an image that is 250x150?

Then the list would be:

75x100

100x400

200x300

250x150

Does that mean that EN would now select the last image (250x150) for the thumbnail?

No, we choose the image with the largest smallest dimension. To keep my list sorted by increasing size of smallest dimension, your new entry should be third:

75x100

100x400

150x250

200x300

So we're going to pick the last one again (200x300), because it's still the image with the "largest smallest" dimension.

does it make sense to anyone at Evernote to choose the first image in the Note for the thumbnail?

It does make sense sometimes, but it doesn't make sense a significant number of times too. Some part of the algorithm needs to factor in the dimensions and/or sizes of the images or else you end up with non-useful thumbnails (see 600x1 example above).

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An alternative is the image with the largest number of pixels. This is a good predictor of importance of the image to the note's content.

e.g.

75x100=7500

100x400=40000

200x300=60000

250x150=37500

Largest -> 200x300=60000

Yeah, that's probably another good algorithm (and note that in this specific case, that is the image we choose). I think we're reasonably happy with the algorithm we're using; they're all subject to false positives, unfortunately, but I think our algorithm ends up choosing a fairly representative image a lot of the time.

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Well, it does have the advantage of being easier to explain. Which usually results in a more likely to be correct implementation.

The best, and most likely, implementation of either algorithm would pick the first "largest" in the event of a tie.

My guess is that in most cases (>90%) either algorithm would pick the same image for the thumbnail.

Hmmm.

Not sure which algorithm is more likely to pick the squarer image. Squarer usually results in a more recognizable thumbnail. Probably a toss up.

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Well, it does have the advantage of being easier to explain. Which usually results in a more likely to be correct implementation.

Hmmm, bubble sort is easy to explain, and it's not hard to get a correct implementation of a bubble sort, but so what? Implementation is not usually the problem, it's choice of algorithm, and bubble sort is of course notoriously poor for anything but the most trivial uses.

The best, and most likely, implementation of either algorithm would pick the first "largest" in the event of a tie.

My guess is that in most cases (>90%) either algorithm would pick the same image for the thumbnail.

Hmmm.

Not sure which algorithm is more likely to pick the squarer image. Squarer usually results in a more recognizable thumbnail. Probably a toss up.

I think you're right -- there are probably fail cases in any algorithm that will be used to pick a thumbnail candidate out of a collection of images. I think that making a good guess is fine, but the best case for users would probably be to allow them to designate which image to use if the guess is not the one that they want.

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bubble sort
:lol:

Nah. This is a single pass scan. No sorting. Just compares.

And, bubble sort, can NOT be fully described in a single, non-compound, sentence.

----------

Ummm. Re-read your comment. Never mind my comment about single pass. You were using it as an general example, not a specific example. :?

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Sometimes I have multiple images in a post, and evernote seems to pretty randomly choose which one to use as a thumbnail. Is there any way to pick which one it is? Sometimes the photo chosen is no help at all, so I would like to be able to change it, either by selecting which one or being able to determine what position to put the one I want in (i.e. first or last) so it gets picked.

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Can someone tell me why evernote doesn't have this ability yet? This seems incredibly near-sighted.

I read on someone else's post that evernote uses an algorithm to choose the thumbnail image depending on what the largest image is, it uses that one as the thumbnail.

I want the algorithm to conform to ME, not the other way around.

:)

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But it doesn't seem like that because I can go in and edit my notes to my heart's content. So if I can edit my notes as much as I'd like, I feel like that would be even more difficult to accompany than the ability to change the note's thumbnail. It seems silly that I can have all of this customization to my note, but NOT the thumbnail image. It would be much easier to have a standard system on the servers that doesn't let you edit your note at all. Less coding to be flexible with the whims of its users.

So since this is NOT the case, it seems strange that the ability to edit the thumbnail of the note is not available, while I can edit my note to any degree I wish (something arguably more complex to account for than changing a thumbnail).

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How do you assign a specific thumbnail to a note?

I have many images in many notes. When there is more than one image, EN does not always take the topmost (first) image as the note's thumbnail image. In addition, even if you "trick" EN to use a given image as the thumbnail by creating the note with only one image initially then adding others after the thumbnail has been generated, EN will sometimes reassign the thumbnail image to one of the subsequent images within the note.

This is frustrating when these thumbnails are instrumental in quickly identifying notes, but there seems to be no predictable way to control them.

Perhaps this should be a field in the note header area where you "Click to set thumbnail image" would work.

Any advice would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Steve & Angela

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Here is a link to a discussion on this issue. There is no easy solution if you have several photos in one note. I guess if someone really wanted to promote a specific image, they could use a photo editor to re-size the photo to create the "largest smallest dimension".

That's too much work for me.

http://discussion.ev...dpost__p__92194

Evernote explanation:

We select the image with the largest smallest dimension. There are some other rules, but that's the main one.

Examples:

75x100

100x400

200x300

The "smallest" dimensions are 75, 100, and 200, respectively. We're going to use the image with the largest of those "smallest" dimensions (i.e., 200).

There are probably better ways to describe that algorithm, but that's how we've been describing it internally.

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The largest smallest dimension?

Yeah. For example, if you have 3 images with the following dimensions:

75x100

100x400

200x300

The "smallest" dimensions are 75, 100, and 200, respectively. We're going to use the image with the largest of those "smallest" dimensions (i.e., 200).

There are probably better ways to describe that algorithm, but that's how we've been describing it internally.

with all due respect, what you really mean is the "largest smaller" dimension. :D

for the word "smallest" to apply, you'd have to be comparing at least 3 items -- or, in this case, dimensions (such as the 3 sides of a triangle, or 3 or more of anything, really). but images are two-dimensional; they have only height and width. therefore, neither dimension is the "smallest" of the two; it's the smaller of the two. :)

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The way the system works now is completely non-intuitive. A larger image does not mean a better representation of what the note is about. I could make a strong argument that the first image in the note (above a certain size threshold) would be the most representative of the note. For example, I took a clipping of a product page. I want to capture the primary product but also the "related products". However, the images of the related products happen to be larger than the primary product so now I have a note about one product with images for a different one shown as the thumbnail. I have similar frustration for other scenarios as well. I agree, the image for the thumbnail on the note should be user-selectable. It's fine to have a default, but I should be able to override it if I wish. Right-click the image --> Set as thumbnail. Simple. Even if that is a desktop-only feature, that's fine. The product already has certain features that only exist in certain implementations of the product, so that's nothing new.

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@Gimpster: Please read the discussions jbenson2 posted, it is *not* the largest image that is used. On the other hand, overriding the system-selected image used would be a nice improvement. It's not clear to me that that's something that is transferred with the note; it may be determined on-the-fly by the client (I haven't been able to figure it out by looking at an exported .ENEX file yet), though I suppose it's also possible that that's determined by a call to the server, too.

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I wasn't searching to find out whether or not changing the thumbnail was possible, I was searching to find out how to go about changing the thumbnail. I guess that's what you get when you make assumptions! :)

I hope this will be implemented at some point soon. As Gimpster pointed out, a desktop-only option would be fine (similar to changing the added and modified dates).

As it stands now, your notes can really end up with some odd and completely illogical thumbnails!

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As it stands now, your notes can really end up with some odd and completely illogical thumbnails!

Most of my thumbnails are so illogical that I pretty much just ignore them in the Snippet view.

It would be very cool to right-click on the Snippet View Note, and select "Choose Thumbnail".

EN could present a selection of images in thumbnail size for the user to pick from.

It would seem that EN has all of the data it needs to do this in a small popup window, since the Note images are all files which EN knows for each Note.

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One of the ways I use Evernote is to store photographs (JPEGs) with notes on how I've processed them and a copies of the picture as processed by the camera (JPEG) and the original file (RAW format) . So, typically there will be three images in the post, interspersed with text:

Edited JPEG

Camera JPEG

RAW file (this is not displayed in the note, as you need specialist software to interpret RAW files, so it is just a file attachment)

I like to have the edited photo first, so you can see it straight away and then scroll down to see my notes.

I also share some of these notes in a shared notebook with fellow hobbyists, so these comments also relate to the Web version of Evernote.

In Windows.

Evernote seems to choose the last JPEG you add to a note as the thumbnail and this is invariably the camera JPEG, which doesn't look as nice.

In Web.

Evernote doesn't display a thumbnail in the snippet at all, although it does if there are only JPEGs in the note. I think it wants to make a thumbnail of the last image added to the note but it can't because it's a RAW file.

I would prefer Evernote in all cases to use the first image in the note.

Can anyone think of any way of achieving this?

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AFAIK there's no way to choose which picture EN uses in snippet view where there's a choice of files. I don't think it regards RAW and as image file format though.

You could try to force your 1st picture to the head of the queue by zipping all the others, so there's only one choice; or maybe use apply two-note policy - put your headline picture in one note and add a link to another note with the rest of the details. If you're sharing these notes it would speed up page loading - the 'index' note could just be a small(er) thumbnail version of the main picture with the full detail in a linked Note.

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You could try to force your 1st picture to the head of the queue by zipping all the others, so there's only one choice; or maybe use apply two-note policy - put your headline picture in one note and add a link to another note with the rest of the details. If you're sharing these notes it would speed up page loading - the 'index' note could just be a small(er) thumbnail version of the main picture with the full detail in a linked Note.

Thanks gazumped. Those scenarious would solve the problem but inconvenience me in other ways! But I appreciate you taking the time to think about it.

gazumped is basically correct; Evernote chooses the thumbnail for the snippet. The procedure used, at least the last time that anyone from Evernote commented on it is something called the 'largest smallest dimension'; it's explained here: http://discussion.ev...gest%20smallest

Thanks for the link jefito. I see now, the problem is that all my images are the same size so it's either picking randomly or using some other rule (not sure why I get no image in snippets in the Web version though). I could resize the other images to make sure my preferred image is the one that appears as the thumbnail, but that too is a faff.

I think I'll just live with it as it is.

From the other topic I see it's been suggested before that users be able to select which image appears as a thumbnail and I think that would be good. I can imagine hovering over the thumbnail and seeing alternatives to click on.

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I would really like to be able to choose the thumbnail. Is there a way to make and/or support suggestions for new Evernote features (like UserVoice)? Or will people just raise these topics in the forums and hope that they get the attention of Evernote developers?

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So may I add my voice to this request.

Thanks to you guys for explaining the largest-smallest or whatever algorithm. I can see clearly now. However, I would love to choose which one of the pictures in a note is shown as preview thumbnail. Because the "largest-smaller or whatever" pic rarely is the one that indicates my note perfectly. ;)

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Hello,

I am new to Evernote, I just started using it today and the first wall I hit was not being able to change the thumbnails on my notes. Then I came to this forum and read all this stuff about choosing the right algorithm for automatically generating a thumbnail.

What puzzles me is: How do you put that much thought into selecting an algorithm for auto-generating an image for a more intuitive note-taking experience... and not consider letting us pick our own?

For instance, I'm trying to use EN to compare-shop different audio interfaces for my macbook... a note for each model I'm considering... but the thumbnails are a mess; they show the store logos or ads that also appear on the page but none show the actual item I'm trying to compare. Is my intuition that far-fetched? This forum topic started a year ago, and it's still unchanged, really?

Is it me? If there's a different, more positive way for me to view this, please let me know.

Thanks

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OK, got it. I think anything else would have too many words, and "largest smallest" probably works because it's short and easy to remember (and apparently self-contradictory). Cool.

...except it's somewhat ineptly named, because at least 3 items (in this case, "dimensions") are required for the suffix "-est" to be applicable. therefore, since an image has only 2 dimensions, 1 dimension would be the smaller of the two, not the smallest. so, it should be the "largest smaller" dimension. :)

but i don't think jeff coined the phrase, so it's not his fault. :)

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The fact that something is the smaller of two items doesn't make it any less the smallest.

with all due respect, you just don't get it. if you understood grammar, you'd realize your statement was nonsensical. :)

you can't just decide to use the wrong word because it "sounds right" to you. though you may think the two words are interchangeable, they simply are not. the smaller of two items is NOT the smallest. it's the smaller. the word "smallest" is grammatically incorrect. period. if you use the word "smallest," the fact that someone will understand what you "mean" doesn't change the fact that it's grammatically (and mathematically) incorrect.

unless there are at least three items being compared, "-est" is ineligible for use. there are no exceptions. :)

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You may be on somewhat better ground grammatically speaking, but with "all due respect", you have no idea what you are talking about, mathematically speaking. Maybe you should "put your best foot forward" and try to learn something. You do have more than two feet, do you not?

Because despite what you claim, it is mathematically correct: "smallest" refers to the smallest member of a set, regardless of how many elements are in the set (even if there's only one). When we apply the function "smallest" to a set, it doesn't return failure if the set has at least one element, it just returns the smallest element. In computer programming, I don't need to write a special function that operates only on sets of two items, I write one function that works for all.

unless there are at least three items being compared, "-est" is ineligible for use. there are no exceptions. :)

Except for the exception when the number is indeterminate from context. *cough, cough*

So maybe yes, you are technically correct with respect to grammar, but language is used for communication, and if someone understands what I say, then language's work is accomplished. So feel free to pick your prescriptive nits if that's how you want to spend your time here but everyone here (including you) understands the phrase "smallest dimension", even when it's applied to a two dimensional object. Language and the human mind are both flexible enough to manage.

By the way, I've noticed a lot of misspellings and misplaced commas elsewhere in the forums, and I think there's a run on split infinitives going on in the Android forum; are you up for it?

p.s., following an insult with a smiley doesn't make it less insulting, it makes it passive aggressive. You might want to watch that.

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You may be on somewhat better ground grammatically speaking, but with "all due respect", you have no idea what you are talking about, mathematically speaking. Maybe you should "put your best foot forward" and try to learn something. You do have more than two feet, do you not?

math was one of my college majors. i began my college mathematics courses at the age of 15, and i ultimately graduated summa cum laude (valedictorian) with a 3.98 GPA.

it was one of our math professors who taught us that "the language of mathematics is exact, concise, and precise." if you're comparing only two objects (or concepts), the word "smallest" simply cannot, and does not, apply. the fact that you believe with all your heart that it does does not change that. that's all i have to say on the matter.

p.s., following an insult with a smiley doesn't make it less insulting, it makes it passive aggressive. You might want to watch that.

i didn't write "insults," per se; i simply stated facts. but, aware that they might bristle, i added smileys to indicate friendly disagreement. i'm sorry you didn't appreciate that approach. with that in mind, in the purest sense -- meaning "possessing a lack of knowledge on a subject," as opposed to lacking intelligence -- i'll just say: you're ignorant. (no smiley. better?)

we're at an impasse... there's nothing more i can add, and nothing you can say that will change the facts. at this point, you'll be tempted to digress into pure insults, and i'm not going to participate in that. so, i will read/post no further, and i wish you the best of luck. (again, no smiley. i hope that's to your liking.)

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First: if by saying "I'm sorry", however you're apologizing for your part in that misunderstanding, then I sincerely return the apology, for my part in it.

That said, math was one of my majors as well. I am certainly not ignorant on that score. It's been 30+ years since graduation, but my in my field -- computer software -- I still use math a pretty fair amount (that would be an understatement). Curiously, as it happens, I also took a college math course and a computer programming course at the age of 15, but that was just a one-off thing; I'm not trying to start a "who's got the biggest, um, brain" contest here.

But are you really, really saying that there can be no smallest element of a set containing two objects? If so, you are sadly mistaken. The term "smaller", in math and in general speech, mind, is a specialization of the more general concept of "smallest", but which is only used to apply to sets of two things. That doesn't malke "smallest" stop working on sets containing two (or even one) objects; it's just a convention that we have that we use "smaller" to apply to sets containing two objects. For sets with cardinality equal to 2, "smaller" is equivalent to "smallest". For sets of other cardinality, "smaller" doesn't apply.

Mathematically we might say something like: smallest is a function mapping a set of numbers A to the number x in A, such that for all members y of A, x <= y. This works for all sets of any cardinality, except of course, the empty set, which has no members. There's nothing wrong with calling out smaller as a specialization of smallest; mathematicians apply special names to common or useful subsets all the time, but that's all it is: a specialization of a more general rule. The smallest function doesn't magically stop working when it encounters a set of two elements, it just returns the smaller of the two.

[by the way: your professor's saying ("the language of mathematics is exact, concise, and precise") is cute, but not exactly mathematical by his own definition, as "precise" and "exact" are synonyms, and so therefore not "concise". Maybe it was just wishful thinking?]

And the linguistic rule whereby we apply to "smaller" to pairs of items, and "smallest" to sets of items with 3 or more members and sets with indeterminate size, that's just a convention, just like the rule whereby we ought not seek to blithely split infinitives, or start a sentence with "and", or the kazillion other conventions that operate in some realms of the English language (but certainly not all of them). You might prefer to call these conventions "facts", but they're not exactly enduring ones. So long as meaning is conveyed without confusion, and I'm pretty certain that you are not confused by the use of "smallest" when applied to two dimensions. Miffed, piqued, or annoyed, perhaps, but that's just a matter probably best kept between you and your favorite grammar book.

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Apologies for the necropost, but I would like to throw in a vote for some way to override what thumbnail I use for a note. This would be helpful in journals where you want to add an image to a note, but you also use a different set of images to put at the end so you associate that day with that thumbnail image. Perhaps a right click on images that says "Make this the note thumbnail in X view?"

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Hey guys,

I had the same problem today and ran into this post.

I know for some going around chaning sizes is a bit tedious, however here is something that worked for me:

System Description:

Windows 7 Professional

Evernote version 4.5.6

1) Once all your images are loaded on the note right click on those you want to resize.

2) The image will automatically be selected and a pop up menu will appear.

3) Select "open with" option and then choose Paint

4) The file will open in Paint and windows will read it as a temp file from memory.

5) Choose resize and resize the picture to a smaller size, let's say 50%.

6) You can then click save and windows will automatically save the file in Evernote automatically resizing the image on the note itself.

It seems Windows has the ability to recognise the file loaded from Evernote and resize it on the fly.

It is not an automated solutions an I know is not as good as what we would all want which is right click --> set as thumbnail.

But it works pretty well and it saves a lot of time of mucking around with a picture file and try to resize it before loading it into the note.

I hope this works for those that want a better way.

Cheers,

=)

./h

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I'd also love to have a feature, which lets me pick my own thumbnail.

The current algorithm is -lets name it- random. For me as user it makes absolutely no sense to use this algorithm.

In each of my notes I have multiple images with more or less importance. And the thumbnail should be the most important or meaningful image. Not the one with the best proportions!

Please, please include this feature!!!

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Just as a matter of interest? what was the thinking behind this rule to select the thumbnail LOL.... why not just go with the first or last image/attachment in the note?

I think this is a case of the programmers trying to be cool with a "clever" algorithm, yet they did not have a good understanding of the end-user's needs/perspective. We have tried several times to convince the EN team that the current selection process does not work very well, but they don't seem to want to hear it.

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Just as a matter of interest? what was the thinking behind this rule to select the thumbnail LOL.... why not just go with the first or last image/attachment in the note?

I think this is a case of the programmers trying to be cool with a "clever" algorithm, yet they did not have a good understanding of the end-user's needs/perspective. We have tried several times to convince the EN team that the current selection process does not work very well, but they don't seem to want to hear it.

I don't think your speculation about the developers is supported by the evidence. In fact, they seem very concerned about the user experience :)

What I got out of the developer comments in this thread is that they were looking for a way to populate the thumbnails with images that would make sense to the user and avoid having horizontal bars or other non-sensical images showing up. The process occurs automatically and actually does a good job in most cases for me. As we discussed in the other thread, there are good things about the product, but also areas that need improvement.

It seems like a smart design decision, and I like it, but I think it would be nice if users had the option to overide the algorithm in a note. Hopefully, the developers will consider this in future updates.

Just because the developers don't do what we ask them to do doesn't mean they are not listening or not hearing us. We may have been un-persuasive. They might be waiting to roll it out together with a different update so that they don't have to recode for a new interface. They might disagree. Or, they could be too busy. Who knows? Rather than questioning their commitment to a good user experience, I think we can offer real life use cases that will help them design it better in future ones.

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It seems like a smart design decision, and I like it, but I think it would be nice if users had the option to overide the algorithm in a note. Hopefully, the developers will consider this in future updates.

I disagree. It may be "smart" from a technical point of view, but not of a users point of view.

There is very little correlation between the image size and what image is the most important, or most relevant, to the user.

On top of that, the thumbnail often crops the image in the middle, making it almost unrecognizable.

Don't see anything "smart" about this.

Choosing the first image whose width and height are both greater than that used for borders would be "smart", as well a give the user control over which image is used for the thumbnail.

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It sounds crazy on the face of it..... But they will have tried different settings and could immediately see the effect on thumbnails.... The problem is everybody's notebooks are different so what might work well for the majority may be rubbish for 40% of users.....

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It seems like a smart design decision, and I like it, but I think it would be nice if users had the option to overide the algorithm in a note. Hopefully, the developers will consider this in future updates.

I disagree. It may be "smart" from a technical point of view, but not of a users point of view.

There is very little correlation between the image size and what image is the most important, or most relevant, to the user.

On top of that, the thumbnail often crops the image in the middle, making it almost unrecognizable.

Don't see anything "smart" about this.

Choosing the first image whose width and height are both greater than that used for borders would be "smart", as well a give the user control over which image is used for the thumbnail.

It works pretty well from this user's point of view. The images chosen are appropriate, and even when cut-off (as they must be to fit within the constraints of the snippet view), they are perfectly recognizable.The designers must have done something right if the results work so well a lot of the time (for this user, at least), so I'll stick with calling the current implementation "smart." It would be "smarter," of course, if they added the ability to override the existing algorithm :)

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It seems like a smart design decision, and I like it, but I think it would be nice if users had the option to overide the algorithm in a note. Hopefully, the developers will consider this in future updates.

I disagree. It may be "smart" from a technical point of view, but not of a users point of view.

There is very little correlation between the image size and what image is the most important, or most relevant, to the user.

On top of that, the thumbnail often crops the image in the middle, making it almost unrecognizable.

Don't see anything "smart" about this.

Choosing the first image whose width and height are both greater than that used for borders would be "smart", as well a give the user control over which image is used for the thumbnail.

It works pretty well from this user's point of view. The images chosen are appropriate, and even when cut-off (as they must be to fit within the constraints of the snippet view), they are perfectly recognizable.The designers must have done something right if the results work so well a lot of the time (for this user, at least), so I'll stick with calling the current implementation "smart." It would be "smarter," of course, if they added the ability to override the existing algorithm :)

Additionally, most people who have created/designed apps have made choices that seemed good at the time & later realize it may not have been. Reversing such choices may not always be an easy task. I have no idea whether EN has had any second thoughts on this choice. Nor do I care, b/c personally, I have no issue with the thumbnails. But I do think it's a waste of time to rag on the devs for choices they have made & applying each individual user's idea of what is easy/smart to something they really have no clue about, which is why the decision was made & why/how it affects all the platforms EN lives on.

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Agreed, If they did change, it would need to stay as is for all the previous notes uploaded (as no doubt some people love it!) But you could have an option to go back to an old note and select another preference as well as overide when creating new ones.

So I think we've done this to death now... so I'm out B)

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In my experience (on a Windows system), if I delete the picture that is selected as thumbnail, EverNote then pics the next picture as thumbnail. So I go through this process (delete, save note, undo) successively until it picks the picture I want. Tedious, but usually works.

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I have read some posts regarding how Evernote 'decides' to select the thumbnail image to show on notes and I still do not understand why I cannot override this behavior by clicking on an image in a note and selecting "Assign Thumbnail". Until this is done I cannot pay money for Evernote as Springpad managed to get this working.

Even with this automatic method, Evernote PC vs Web vs Android do different things. On the PC I somehow managed to get the thumbnails that I wanted showing by cut/sync/pasting until it worked (highly annoying). Then I go to view my notes on the Web or Android client and the thumbnails are completely different (super annoying).

The most frustrating thing about the poor automatic selection is that even though I have say a 400x400 image that I wish to use as a thumbnail, it keeps picking PDF files that are also inside the not as the thumbnail. And RARELY is the first page of a PDF something I want as a thumbnail.

So *please* add a user assignable thumbnail option! I know better than you what I want to see as the thumbnail.

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