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REQUEST: Increase limit on number of notebooks


rnjstevens

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Business account is too much.  what I'm saying is .. there are lots of small and average business who need more but not to the point of what a business account is offering.  

 

I'm not sure how you would know that?

 

IAC, Evernote just revised their plans/pricing, and it is unlikely, IMO, that they would offer special pricing on just one feature.

If you want to use Evernote, and you need to share with more than 500 people, then a Business account at $12/month is your only choice for the foreseeable future.

 

If you are charging for subscriptions to your Notebook, then I can't imagine $12 would be much of a cost, especially if you are expecting more than 500 subscribers.   ;)

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I had done some searching on the Evernote forums on this topic prior to contacting Evernote Support Chat because I was concerned, as many of you in the thread are, about the 250 limit on notebooks. I couldn't find the answers to all of my questions about it, so I ended up chatting with an Evernote Support rep today. I'm sharing the info I got because many of you seem to have the same questions. Hopefully, this will help you :)

 

 

Currently, free and premium Evernote accounts have a limit of 250 notebooks, 10,000 tags and 100,000 total notes. These limits only apply to synchronized services.
Local notebooks and notes are unlimited for all users.
Per Will @ Evernote Support: There is no limit for the local notebooks as those are saved in your computer and not the server.
 
 
In addition, if you find that you need more than 250 synchronized notebooks, you can upgrade to an Evernote Business Account.
Evernote Business Accounts can have 5,000 synchronized notebooks.
Per Will @ Evernote Support: # of Business Notebooks: 5000 synchronized
 
So, Evernote does have a plan to meet everyone's needs. People who need more than 250 synchronized notebooks may pay the higher cost of a business account, but they will get more for their money. Currently, Evernote Premium (250 notebooks synchronized) is $45 per year and Evernote Business (5,000 notebooks synchronized) is $120 per year.
 
My premium account more than meets my needs now that I know I can have unlimited local notebooks. I store a lot of data in Evernote that I really only need access to on my MacBook. For instance, I don't need access to all my saved PDFs of utility bills and receipts from my mobile devices. Many of you are probably the same :)
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Yep. Just to be clear, this is not the app that Evernote develops, but a third-party integration by Shamrock Records

Yeah, I thought it's pretty clear from the video that it's a third party app. :)

I'd like to see this kind of functionality in the Evernote app.

Sure, me too... But the functionality is already available in a third party app so you don't really have to wait.

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The simple ways are the best - I've actually been using temporary notebooks for retagging in bulk;  find notes to retag / move temporarily to new notebook / tag,  retag etc / move back to general store.  Ctrl-Alt-T is better.  Doh.

 

And on this total notebook thing: aren't local notebooks exempted from the 250 max?  Or is that just upload limits I'm thinking about...

 

(I appreciate local notebooks have lots of limitations when it comes to sharing,  OCR,  mobile use etc.,  but that was my intended fallback if I ever got to the limit.  Current highest total notebooks active: 15, for sharing,  sorting and general maintenance purposes.)

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Yep. Just to be clear, this is not the app that Evernote develops, but a third-party integration by Shamrock Records

Yeah, I thought it's pretty clear from the video that it's a third party app. :)

I'd like to see this kind of functionality in the Evernote app.

Sure, me too... But the functionality is already available in a third party app so you don't really have to wait.

Unless you prefer not to use a third-party app.

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I understand. That is why I really just want EN to give me a notebook count to let me know when I am at 250. My EN system is very fluid and the way I don't end up with 10,000 notes is by archiving notebooks to a cloud account. This way I can always retrieve notebooks for a specific project as needed in the future. I suppose I could do this with tags but it seems counterintuitive. Once again, this is the system that works for me. Your mileage may vary...

This question of tags vs notebooks may come up as EN switches to their Business mode. We ( a large architectural firm) are evaluating EN Business as a possible tool. Letting everyone an a team pick or name their own tags may get a bit crazy. It will be interesting to watch.

Hugh

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There's lots of discussion around - if you'd like any help trying,  we'll be pleased to try and assist.  I promise most of us will play nice.

 

You're a kind voice in a wilderness of tags, gazumped. Thanks for exemplifying what's best about the EN forums. :)

 

We visual folks trying to wrap our heads around tags appreciate voices from the "How we can help?" camp, as opposed to the negative "This way or the highway" response: 

 

 

What "has" been said repeatedly is that's the way Evernote is built & if you want to use EN, one will have to adapt to that. It's a pretty factual statement & applies to not only Evernote but any piece of software. If _____ doesn't work for you, then you find something that does. Pretty simple.

 

Guess that's one way to approach someone struggling with a challenge (not my way, but hey). No need to debate or reply.

 

To fellow notebook fans:

 

I sooooo feel your pain. Just spent five hours overhauling my stacks/notebooks/notes strucutre in response to the Dreaded Notification of Notebook Doom alerts received the night before last. While EN looks all nice-n-pretty now, it's taking me longer to locate documents that were at my fingertips 48 hours ago...plus duplicated notes are appearing in the Default notebook...plus EN suddenly refuses to sync large notes it's been successfully syncing for nearly a year....

 

Hang in there. We'll all make it through, one way or the other. :)

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I think we have to view third-party apps as "disposable heroes" :-) or "situational". Makes the cost case a little worse, but not too bad. But at least it gets the function out there and represents a kind of "market research" for the official Evernote app.

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"the genesis of Evernote is tied in with the Apple Newton - the innovative, but ultimately ahead of its time, Personal Digital Assistant (PDA) from Apple from the late 80's to 90's."

Kinda ironic that Evernote is the worst on iOS at the moment though...

Here is a quote from Phil Libin:

"After Stepan sold that company to SGI [in 1997] and spent a few years there, he and his core team of Russian and Russian-American R&D folks - researchers and technologists - started Evernote in 2005. They started it with this idea of giving everyone a better brain, giving everyone a perfect memory. And they spent a few years working on the technology. There wasn't really a product [at that time], but there was a whole bunch of really interesting back end tech around image recognition and things like that."

http://readwrite.com/2010/11/10/the_path_from_apple_newton_to_evernote

Would be nice if Evernote actually handled photos properly, I mean at this point you can't even import photos into Evernote and retain their native metadata like date and location (even though date could be added via filename renaming workaround).

Also facial recognition would make a hell of a lot of sense in Evernote as well IMHO. In my view it's even more important than text recognition, because, quite frankly, I rarely (if at all) find myself searching for text in images, even though it's a nice feature.

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My premium account more than meets my needs now that I know I can have unlimited local notebooks. I store a lot of data in Evernote that I really only need access to on my MacBook. For instance, I don't need access to all my saved PDFs of utility bills and receipts from my mobile devices. Many of you are probably the same :)

This goes along with the general caveat that you should remember to have a back up routine your local notebooks' notes (the method differs by platform), so that they are safe in case of drive problems.
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Unless you prefer not to use a third-party app.

I agree in that I now use several third party apps b/c it's annoying to have to use one app to do this & another app to do that.. Fastever, Fastever Snap, Egretlist, Clever. BUT...the EN iOS app is soooo darned slow (for me) that I only use the EN iOS app when I really, really have to. I even normally use Logmein from my iPhone to use EN from my home computer rather than use EN on my iPhone (which is still not Clever compatible, since it's on iOS 5.0). SO....For *me*, a crucial iOS improvement would be to make it work more expeditiously on iOS. IDK if my large database has any bearing on it, but I'm guessing it might. Stacks & image editing definitely take a backseat, IMO. Anyway, the third party apps are what allow me to continue to use EN on my iPhone & iPad.

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It's not misleading for you, but I bet it is misleading for new users.

Agreed.  It's a term people associate with a method of organization that other evangelists keep telling us in irrelevant in the EN world.
Kindly point out a single quote that where an evangelist says that notebooks are irrelevant in the Evernote world. As far as I know, nobody is saying that. Not that what you are arguing has much to do with that part of the conversation.

What May was replying to (but you didn't quote) to was about the notion that using notebooks is -- by the very use of the name "Notebook", apparently -- was therefore "THE way they should organise Notes", particularly for new users. New users might somehow have that notion, maybe, but but tags are not a hidden feature of Evernote, so they're bound to run into them at some point. And eventually, they might come to find out that tags are better than notebooks at some categorization tasks. That does not make notebooks irrelevant in Evernote; indeed, anyone who knows anything at all about Evernote understands that currently notebooks are crucial to the sharing model, local notebooks and offline notebooks.

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That is why I really just want EN to give me a notebook count to let me know when I am at 250.

Got it -- I don't think that that's unreasonable.

This question of tags vs notebooks may come up as EN switches to their Business mode. We ( a large architectural firm) are evaluating EN Business as a possible tool. Letting everyone an a team pick or name their own tags may get a bit crazy. It will be interesting to watch.

I seem to be the only one around who doesn't mind people on a team choosing their own tags. Of course, it's probably a good idea for a team to start with a specified (maybe agreed-on) tag vocabulary, so that at least there's some common ground.

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Nevermind, I guess i'll just upgrade to business if I reach to that limit. I just hope ... that if I reach the 5000 limit.   there is something waiting for me in there. I hope so.   (since my problem is "sharing limit" I hope I can settle an aggrement since in order to share my notebook a client needs to install evernote which is a win win situation for both me and evernote.)

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2 Notebooks would be enough for me, really. As long as I could share Tags and have offline Tags.

I think "Notebooks" is actually a poor name for this feature because it kinda misleads people into thinking that this is THE way they should organise Notes. Which isn't actually the case in Evernote.

 

 

 

There's nothing misleading about the term "Notebook". It is what it is, a convenient way to partition your notes, just like with physical notebooks. But categorization is a different topic; tags let you categorize across your note collection, regardless of notebook.

 

 

 

It's not misleading for you, but I bet it is misleading for new users.

 

 

Here's the way the convo flowed.  And I would disagree that the term 'notebook' is misleading except possibly for a minority of users who are pretty new to the whole computer experience.  Again, that would be a very small minority of people, I would think.  The rest of us are used to calling a rose by any other name.  Notebook, folder, node, directory, etc.  Possibly EN chose the term 'notebook' since they weren't incorporating nesting capability.  This kind of differentiates it between a directory/folder/node.  Just like they chose the term 'stack' for the grouping of notebooks. 

 

Actually, I even seem to recall someone pointing out notebooks were a better term b/c in real life, you don't nest notebooks inside other notebooks.  But you do stack notebooks on top of notebooks.  I think that was from May, too.  I quickly tried to find this post, but was unsuccessful.  If the forum were not so slow today, I'd look harder.  :(  But then again, this isn't really the topic of the thread anyway.

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I think we have to view third-party apps as "disposable heroes" :-) or "situational". Makes the cost case a little worse, but not too bad. But at least it gets the function out there and represents a kind of "market research" for the official Evernote app.

Amen to that.

Let's hope that's what they are doing. That and reading these forums.

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As for the notebooks they aren't actually necessary at all but they are still usefull IMHO because each Note can have only a single Notebook which is actually an advantage in some cases, like, for example, when you want to organise the "essence" of things as either "this OR that".

So Notebooks like "inbox" and "processed" are still more convenient than Tags because each Note can only be either organised or unorganised, it can't be both and you don't need Tags for this. And it's easier to move Notes between Notebooks(a single step) than applying and removing Tags(2 steps).

Even though, yeah, you could do everything with just Tags, or apply a "processed" Tag to all organised Notes and use a saved search "-tag:processed" as your inbox. It's just not as straightforward, considering Evernote UI design.

In Clever you could do this easily though, since the menu panel is fully customisable, you could just pin this "inbox" saved search at the top of everything and hide notebooks completely.

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What "has" been said repeatedly is that's the way Evernote is built & if you want to use EN, one will have to adapt to that. It's a pretty factual statement & applies to not only Evernote but any piece of software. If _____ doesn't work for you, then you find something that does. Pretty simple.

 

Guess that's one way to approach someone struggling with a challenge (not my way, but hey). No need to debate or reply.

 

 

Love the "drive by". 

 

Another way to look at it (if you will) is if you are struggling with a challenge, maybe it's already been addressed & answered.  Maybe/possibly (and often probably) many times over.  Takes a bit more work on your end to do the search but you're the one with the question & you just may learn something else along the way. 

 

With the exception of those who are labeled "Evernote Employee", the rest of us volunteer our time here.  It's not at all unusual for us to post very detailed & exquisite replies to someone on how to do something.  So when someone new to the board simply posts the question w/o searching, I know I'm hesitant to repost my detailed reply when it's already out there.  To use & modify Gaz's example (from another thread), it's like you walk into a library & walk up to the desk & ask the librarian if they have a book on using tags in Evernote instead of sub-notebooks.  The librarian may walk you over to the perfectly good card catalog & show you how to use it & then let you know if you have any problems to ask.  But unlike the librarian, we are not paid.  So yes, you may get a reply you think is curt or "text -bludgeoning" but is just pointing you to the perfectly good card catalog.  (shrug) 

 

"No need to debate or reply."

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While I appreciate your dedication at keeping the forum "clean", there was a reason why I wanted to add the information in this particular topic. Being as the reason I was moving notes around in the first place was to work with the limit of Evernote of 250, the troubles I encountered trying to do so ( hundreds of notes getting moved to the trash bin after syncing ) are a direct consequence . Furthermore, aside from warning other users of that possible bug, I want to make sure that whatever glitch in the EN system that I think has to do with syncing , doesn't go unnoticed.

I have never been able to get any kind of real help from all the service requests I have submitted, they always seem to suggest I reinstall EN, and I really do not think the problem is there. There is something really strange going on when synching occurs, notes get moved around, changes get lost etc. And I have already pointed out that the way EN handles versions with synching means that you cant even perform a personal backup since when you would try to restore your notebooks from your backup , EN would change all your notes to match the servers version ....

EN is a great program but right now, I'm starting to think it's almost better to use it completely offline and backup your own data because I really do not trust the way it handles versions between the server, your computer and any other device, and it doesn't let you select a Master, it just decides which version is the right one and changes all the others to match it. In theory this is great if it works but that not what I am experimenting . What's really annoying is that I never had any of those problems until I hit the 250 limit , then all sorts of errors started showing up so there is definitely something they have to fix there and I'm afraid they are too busy trying to design a family app to pay attention to this problem. I have asked countless times REAL and PRECISE information about how this works so I can avoid any errors and I always get very vague and useless answers....

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For all you fervent tag users, thanks again for all your tips.

My whole point was never to declare notebooks better than tags, but rather to point out that while one might fit the needs of one particular person, the other might be much better for another person's needs.... And that it would make a lot more sense if we were able to use both in an unlimited manner... Everyone would be happy.

 

1+

 

In the end, this all boils down to how the user's brain processes info. For me, as a visual person, hierarchal stacks/notebooks/notes is the perfect fit, and a thousand times easier/faster/cleaner than tags.

 

For someone whose brain processes information differently, tags are easier/faster/cleaner.

 

No one's right. No one's wrong (although, sadly, I have seen a couple of EN forum threads where the person asking about the notebook limit was mercilessly text-bludgeoned by tag fans who apparently think otherwise).

 

I'd be the first person in line to pay for an additional 250 notebooks, if that was an option. My first dreaded Notification of Notebook Doom landed on me last night, with a big, fat :::whump!:::

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Letting everyone an a team pick or name their own tags may get a bit crazy. It will be interesting to watch.

Hmmn. I managed a Wiki at one stage which had a (fairly large) team of users picking their own categories (Wiki categories = Evernote tags)

It was a slo-mo car crash of a system with duplicated entries, multiple changes, missing information.. we eventually had a small pool of 'expert' moderators nudging information into a sensible order so we could still find stuff.

Maybe it was just that situation, or maybe folks are just designed that way - I can only recommend that you keep your head down!

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For all you fervent tag users, thanks again for all your tips.

My whole point was never to declare notebooks better than tags, but rather to point out that while one might fit the needs of one particular person, the other might be much better for another person's needs.... And that it would make a lot more sense if we were able to use both in an unlimited manner... Everyone would be happy.

 

1+

 

In the end, this all boils down to how the user's brain processes info. For me, as a visual person, hierarchal stacks/notebooks/notes is the perfect fit, and a thousand times easier/faster/cleaner than tags.

 

For someone whose brain processes information differently, tags are easier/faster/cleaner.

 

No one's right. No one's wrong (although, sadly, I have seen a couple of EN forum threads where the person asking about the notebook limit was mercilessly text-bludgeoned by tag fans who apparently think otherwise).

 

I'd be the first person in line to pay for an additional 250 notebooks, if that was an option. My first dreaded Notification of Notebook Doom landed on me last night, with a big, fat :::whump!:::

 

Maybe the forum's "expertise" is a little slanted - and prone to be caustic when subjects come up over and over again - but the fact remains you're in a Library,  asking for a burger.  We don't serve those here,  so sorry: you'll have to try elsewhere.  It's really not that tags are better (though IMHO they are) but just that to use Evernote you really REALLY have to make the adjustment.  There's lots of discussion around - if you'd like any help trying,  we'll be pleased to try and assist.  I promise most of us will play nice.

 

I can't reliably comment on how easy or otherwise a change might be - but Evernote has 50M users to look after so they're likely to be cautious with any fundamental issues like this one...

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While I appreciate your dedication at keeping the forum "clean", there was a reason why I wanted to add the information in this particular topic. Being as the reason I was moving notes around in the first place was to work with the limit of Evernote of 250, the troubles I encountered trying to do so ( hundreds of notes getting moved to the trash bin after syncing ) are a direct consequence . Furthermore, aside from warning other users of that possible bug, I want to make sure that whatever glitch in the EN system that I think has to do with syncing , doesn't go unnoticed.

I have never been able to get any kind of real help from all the service requests I have submitted, they always seem to suggest I reinstall EN, and I really do not think the problem is there. There is something really strange going on when synching occurs, notes get moved around, changes get lost etc. And I have already pointed out that the way EN handles versions with synching means that you cant even perform a personal backup since when you would try to restore your notebooks from your backup , EN would change all your notes to match the servers version ....

EN is a great program but right now, I'm starting to think it's almost better to use it completely offline and backup your own data because I really do not trust the way it handles versions between the server, your computer and any other device, and it doesn't let you select a Master, it just decides which version is the right one and changes all the others to match it. In theory this is great if it works but that not what I am experimenting . What's really annoying is that I never had any of those problems until I hit the 250 limit , then all sorts of errors started showing up so there is definitely something they have to fix there and I'm afraid they are too busy trying to design a family app to pay attention to this problem. I have asked countless times REAL and PRECISE information about how this works so I can avoid any errors and I always get very vague and useless answers....

Lpr, with all due respect, several (very fluent in Evernote) users spent a lot of their free time trying to help you with your problem. You repeatedly overlooked or ignored their advice and chose to instead focus on what you can't do in EN rather than finding a solution to your problem. You seem to be continuing that "tradition" with EN support ("I have never been able to get any kind of real help from all the service requests I have submitted, they always seem to suggest I reinstall EN, and I really do not think the problem is there.") & seem to think you know more than the developers do. The biggest reason the devs want you to be using the most current version is to have a baseline - they know that your problem is not due to a bug that has subsequently been fixed. IME, most (all?) devs (regardless of the software) will first tell you to be sure you're using the most current version of their software. In fact, I received a reply from a trouble ticket for another app I'm trying to use (Diskaid) and the first things they say is to make sure I'm using current versions of my OS & their software.

Contrary to what you say here, you CAN restore from backups. ((I pointed this out to you in another thread two days ago along with DETAILED instructions on how to work around this). But sometimes, when someone has been dinking around trying to fix something, the way to restore notes may differ from one case to another. IOW, restoring from a backup will differ if nothing has been added since the backup vs a weeks worth of work done since the backup. This has always been the way of restores, in my 35+ years of being in IT.

Also contrary to what you say here, you have been given very detailed replies to your posts on the board.

However, you've posted your thoughts & opinions & that's fine. But repeatedly posting this (mis)information is not helpful to anyone.

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As a recent convert to tags I'd like share a view. "Is there much difference?" . When I previously tried putting things in Notebooks and replicating my hard drive or my filing cabinet (for scans) I felt secure that I was tucking something away in an electronic draw or manilla folder as if it was some kind of physical thing that is compiled together and put next to other data in a similar category. But in actual fact, this electronic data created is going to be spread all over several hard drives in another part of the world. What correlates electronic data with other data is the assignment of an electronic attribute. In this respect, you are not actually 'putting' a note in a notebook (as if it was some physical placeholder), you are assigning an electronic notebook attribute to the file. This is really no different to assigning a tag in my view. But tags have an advantage. You can assign more than one which is great since you can very easily categorise data multiple ways. I can categorise all my receipts for example and at the same time tag a particular project on top of some of them. I can then be flexible about grouping data when I need it on the fly.

In fact EN made it easy for those of us who had the 'notebook' fetish by replicating the 'look' and feel of previous notebooks structures in the lower part of the left pane. There you can have the same hierarchy with tags that is familiar to us using notebooks.

So for me I see notebooks and tags as really being the same thing (file attributes) but with more restrictions on how you use notebooks. I'm sold on tags.

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Seriously.

Evernote has been bragging about the more you use it the more you will want to use it since day one, and how it becomes your second brain. Well I guess my second brain is seriously limited. What am I supposed to do now? I have no desire to start using tags instead of notebooks as their support suggested.

...

I am also a confirmed notebook vs tag user. I have tried many times to make tags work as a primary organizational feature but the stuff I keep in EN works better in notebooks. I have bumped into the 250 nb limit a few times and have several strategies. I'm not sure they will work for you but here are a few.

1. When a project (I am an architect) reaches completion I archive the notebook(s) for that project to a folder on DropBox. In that way if I eventually find out I need it I just restore it from that folder wherever I am.

2. I break many projects into a stack of several notebooks. I keep an eye on those and look for opportunities to combine notebooks as the project evolves.

3. Finally I look through my folders once in a while and look for those that have 1 or 2 notes in them and I look for ways to shift those notes somewhere else. I also look for folders that I really never look at. Those I either archive, combine elsewhere or delete.

While I hit the 250 limit once in a while I think I want EN to keep the limit because it pushes me to keep my database a little better organized and in control.

Hugh

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2 Notebooks would be enough for me, really. As long as I could share Tags and have offline Tags.

I think "Notebooks" is actually a poor name for this feature because it kinda misleads people into thinking that this is THE way they should organise Notes. Which isn't actually the case in Evernote.

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All info for all cars (insurance, tags, maintenance, etc) goes into that notebook. Tags do the differentiation. So I add my note to the "Auto info" notebook & simply tag it "Car A". Boom, yer done. There is nothing in the note itself I would do differently if I had a separate "Car A" notebook.

Not to beat this mercilessly beaten dead horse but... your workflow adds a second step to the process of creating a note that I do not have in a multi stack/notebook system. Mine is, I add my note to the correct notebook and Boom, yer done.

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The simple ways are the best - I've actually been using temporary notebooks for retagging in bulk;  find notes to retag / move temporarily to new notebook / tag,  retag etc / move back to general store.  Ctrl-Alt-T is better.  Doh.

 

And on this total notebook thing: aren't local notebooks exempted from the 250 max?  Or is that just upload limits I'm thinking about...

 

(I appreciate local notebooks have lots of limitations when it comes to sharing,  OCR,  mobile use etc.,  but that was my intended fallback if I ever got to the limit.  Current highest total notebooks active: 15, for sharing,  sorting and general maintenance purposes.)

 

I can't find official word on it, although I seem to recall either Dave or Heather posting it.  Anyway, I *think* 250 (which includes stacks & notebooks) includes local notebooks.  Another reason I think this is b/c when people reach the 250 limit, the course of action is to find a notebook, tag the notes appropriately & move them to another (existing) notebook.  You can now delete the empty notebook.  If I find the post, I will link to it.  It may have been on the old message board & not survived the migration to the new one.

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your workflow adds a second step to the process of creating a note that I do not have in a multi stack/notebook system. Mine is, I add my note to the correct notebook and Boom, yer done.

That's not correct... You can add new notes to a selected Tag as well with a single step, it's just not a default behaviour in Windows.

In windows you can change registry setting "SetNewNoteTags" from 0 to 1.

In iOS you can add notes directly to tags or notebooks, it's a default behaviour to begin with.

I almost always add new notes to the inbox Notebook and organise them later, so I personally prefer the default Windows behaviour.

To change it:

Quit Evernote completely by right-clicking the elephant icon in your system tray and choosing Quit.

Launch the Windows Registry Editor by clicking Start, Run and typing regedit.

Expand the HKEY_CURRENT_USER folder and browse to Software\Evernote\Evernote.

Change "SetNewNoteTags" from 0 to 1.

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No one's right. No one's wrong (although, sadly, I have seen a couple of EN forum threads where the person asking about the notebook limit was mercilessly text-bludgeoned by tag fans who apparently think otherwise).

I think you'd be hard pressed to find any posts saying someone is "wrong" by wanting more notebooks and/or sub notebooks. What *has* been said repeatedly is that's the way Evernote is built & if you want to use EN, one will have to adapt to that. It's a pretty factual statement & applies to not only Evernote but any piece of software. If ____ doesn't work for you, then you find something that does. Pretty simple.
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People always ask for no limits and no restrictions on their stuff. Look at the USA election results a few days ago.

It is human nature.

It is also human nature to forget about the unseen costs that must be borne by the young start-up companies.

Costs? "Why it's just electronic data bits floating around the cloud. That should be free to the consumer."

But is all this stuff free?

http://goo.gl/T3gkd

I think not.

It doesn't have to be free, I actually wouldn't mind paying more. Any option is better than no option at all.

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OOPS SORRY LOOKS LIKE YOU ARE DONE USING EVERNOTE! YOU'VE REACHED YOUR NOTEBOOK LIMIT!

WTF

I JUST FOUND OUT ABOUT THIS AND I AM FREAKING OUT !

I'm so angry right now. That is unacceptable!!!!! I have been a premium user for years now, I use Evernote for everything! I have my life in it literally. I never even go near one tenth of my monthly limit but now all of a sudden today Evernote gives me an error saying that I have too many notebooks???? What am I supposed to do about this? Delete them? Everything I have is organized perfectly, and I need all these notebooks. I created them for a reason. Why should I even have a notebook limit? How does it make any kind of sense? Data limit I can understand but notebook limit? WWHHHYYY? Seriously.

Evernote has been bragging about the more you use it the more you will want to use it since day one, and how it becomes your second brain. Well I guess my second brain is seriously limited. What am I supposed to do now? I have no desire to start using tags instead of notebooks as their support suggested.

I'm sure I should be using a nicer "tone" right now but I after having invested and trusted so much information into a program using the paying version, this little surprise really feels like a slap in the face.

PLEASE FIX THIS!

SOON!

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People always ask for no limits and no restrictions on their stuff. Look at the USA election results a few days ago.

It is human nature.

It is also human nature to forget about the unseen costs that must be borne by the young start-up companies.

Costs? "Why it's just electronic data bits floating around the cloud. That should be free to the consumer."

But is all this stuff free?

http://goo.gl/T3gkd

I think not.

It doesn't have to be free, I actually wouldn't mind paying more

Good point. 500 notebooks for premium members might generate some more interest in premium membership :)

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Lol.. was already going to say it's good to know I can still learn new stuff about Evernote by hanging around the Forums - looks like that applies to both of us!  Thanks for the input anyway - we'll have to wait and see whether someone who actually knows the answer...

 

Oops - interrupted mid post.  Thanks!  That's a very good link to be Evernoted (done) and maybe a partial help to those pushing the 250 total.  Maybe someone at that level can confirm that they can still create local notebooks over and above the synced limit.

 

:)

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What your basically telling the other person is that he has to mould his organizational structure to suit the shortcomings of a serious issue that Evernote hardly stresses upon...

 

As you can tell by the conversation in this thread, this is debatable. Most of the users here think it's not a serious issue if you actually look into Evernote's capabilities. Sure, if you want to organize your own way, you'll have to make do or might run into problems - but if you use Evernote to the strengths with which it was built, you'll probably find that there isn't a shortcoming, unless you need to share with 250+ people.

 

What concerns him is that his organizational structure which he deems best for his needs well within the frame work of what EN offers is basically screwed.

 

Obviously, it's not well within the framework of what EN offers if he's hit a limit. He's pushing right against the border of the framework. And by choosing to use a workflow that has such a limit, he's "screwed" by his own choice, unfortunately. The notebook limit isn't exactly hidden, and someone who plans to use the software to such an extent should really do a bit of reading up on it before becoming invested, or be willing to make changes to his/her workflow to continue using the app.

 

So, tell a user who has used EN for 2 years to change his organizational flow within EN's parameters really doesn't sound right.

 

If you try to fit a square peg in a round hole...

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Hi heather,

 

I contacted support and they clarified that the 5,000 quota is for all users combined; it's still 250 per user under a business account. Oddly enough, it doesn't even mention 5,000 in advertising, but maybe I missed it. Evernote suggested I start using tags, so that's what I'm doing. Guess what, you can have up to 100,000 tags! That should do just fine. I'm downgrading from Business to Premium again.

 

Thanks

 

SoFresh_SoClean

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Hi heather,

 

I contacted support and they clarified that the 5,000 quota is for all users combined; it's still 250 per user under a business account. Oddly enough, it doesn't even mention 5,000 in advertising, but maybe I missed it. Evernote suggested I start using tags, so that's what I'm doing. Guess what, you can have up to 100,000 tags! That should do just fine. I'm downgrading from Business to Premium again.

 

Thanks

 

SoFresh_SoClean

 

Hi. Glad to hear you got it all worked out. If you are interested, I have a post that lists as many of the limits (published and unpublished) that I know about for Evernote.

http://www.christopher-mayo.com/?p=169

 

One thing to note is that the 5,000 is in the Business Library. What that means is that all of the users in the Business can put those 5,000 notebooks into their own accounts, but only 250 notebooks at once. 

 

Tags are a great way to organize, and that is really what Evernote is built to do best. Here is a page with suggestions and links to useful systems.

http://www.christopher-mayo.com/?p=437

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The search function is only your friend if you are willing to quietly accept the limitations of the program.

 

 

The search is not the best, but in some cases (like this one), it's very useful.

 

attachicon.gif250 notebooks.jpg

 

>or Evernote will think we are all as happy as the evangelists..

 

 

Please elaborate. Pretty much every (every?) evangelist has things they wish EN would do.  If you're such an unhappy user, perhaps EN is not the app for you. Nothing worse than staying with an app that doesn't work for you & that you feel the need to constantly/regularly complain about.  (shrug)

 

Not true... if you are unhappy with a feature in an otherwise wonderful program this seems like the best place to voice your concerns.  I also think that just because an issue was discussed some months ago and the conversation ended, I do not consider the issue resolved.  Since EN does not make official announcements about features (understandable) they have to put up with ongoing complaints.

 

My comment about the evangelists expresses my concern that people who admit they do not officially speak for EN and who have their own points of view about how the program should be used could cause new users to limit their complaints about EN.  EN needs to hear these comments even if they have heard them before.

 

I LOVE this program and that is why my posts over the years have included concerns or suggestions to make a great program better.

 

Hugh

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I see this topic was created a long time ago, but I was just hit the notebook limit myself and am furious.  I read everyone's comments on how tags are the same thing, yada yada, but by definition they are NOT.  I am a real estate agent and have a notebook for each of my clients.  The notes within their notebooks follow I system which I created.  I have my client notebooks in stacks (Acitve, Pending, Sold, and a few other stacks depending on how far out that client is from doing anything).

 

When I open my Evernote, I see all of my stacks... I expand them to see my clients from birds eye view so to speak.  It's very organized and efficient.  I share my notebooks with my clients as well so they can see the process in real time and contribute if they wish.  It took my business to a new level when I began offering this innovative service.

 

Sure I could have those stacks as simply notebooks with a whole bunch of notes with tags for each client.  But that would be like going back in time to when I had physical files and racks sitting on my desk and a bunch of paper scattered around with no organization to it whatsoever.

 

As a Realtor, I multi-task and deal with emotions for a living.  Opening a notebook and seeing 10000 notes would be senseless at best.  FAIL!!!!!!

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There's nothing misleading about the term "Notebook". It is what it is, a convenient way to partition your notes, just like with physical notebooks. But categorization is a different topic; tags let you categorize across your note collection, regardless of notebook.

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Maybe someone at that level can confirm that they can still create local notebooks over and above the synced limit.

:)

 

Yeah, I agree official confirmation would be good.

 

B/c we know the kb isn't always right... :D

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All in favor of raising the notebook limit for all our us 'old-school' thinkers who have faithfully paided our Evernote premium group membership ... :)  I am not having to change my entire scheme of organizing notes to accomodate this 'setting' change.  

 

Please let us choose :)   Thanks!  Erick

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Careful what you ask for. I do Performance for a living (which nails the question of WHICH Martin Packer I am). :-) You might find >250 (or >500) or (>1000) the whole thing performs horribly, is unnavigable, or any darned thing.

Let's just await someone from Evernote's viewpoint. Unless we think we've waited long enough. :-)

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People always ask for no limits and no restrictions on their stuff. Look at the USA election results a few days ago.

It is human nature.

It is also human nature to forget about the unseen costs that must be borne by the young start-up companies.

Costs? "Why it's just electronic data bits floating around the cloud. That should be free to the consumer."

But is all this stuff free?

http://goo.gl/T3gkd

I think not.

It doesn't have to be free, I actually wouldn't mind paying more

Good point. 500 notebooks for premium members might generate some more interest in premium membership :)

500 notebooks? I can't imagine using more than 10 myself...but yes...Evernote should look at it if that's what people are requesting.

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I'm a reporter and I use premium because Evernote is essentially my steno pad and I need all my notes automatically synced on all my computers and devices.

I was creating a notebook for each story I was working on, with a number of notes within them, but I reached the 250 synced notebook quota. I've just started to transition all of my stuff over to tags by creating a new tag with the name being the issue of the paper I'm working on (8/20/2013), hoping organizing notes into specific dated tags will help group my notes with the right edition of the paper. I'm retagging everything and deleting empty notebooks as I reorganize.

Grumpy, let me me know if this makes sense. I'm not as experienced with tags as you are.

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There's nothing misleading about the term "Notebook". It is what it is, a convenient way to partition your notes, just like with physical notebooks. But categorization is a different topic; tags let you categorize across your note collection, regardless of notebook.

Yes. Notebook. Folder. Node. Directories. In my many decades in IT, those are the terms that have been commonly used. One of my husband's oft used phrases (as unbecoming as it is) is,,,"Pot, weed, reefer, Mary Jane...it's all the same thing. You smoke it & you get high."

A more accepted prhase is "a rose by any other name..."

If you can't adapt to the terminology, then you're going to have bigger problems than the inability to have sub-notebooks.

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I'm a reporter and I use premium because Evernote is essentially my steno pad and I need all my notes automatically synced on all my computers and devices.

I was creating a notebook for each story I was working on, with a number of notes within them, but I reached the 250 synced notebook quota. I've just started to transition all of my stuff over to tags by creating a new tag with the name being the issue of the paper I'm working on (8/20/2013), hoping organizing notes into specific dated tags will help group my notes with the right edition of the paper. I'm retagging everything and deleting empty notebooks as I reorganize.

Grumpy, let me me know if this makes sense. I'm not as experienced with tags as you are.

 

Hi. I'm actually not a big tag guy myself (I have more on my site about that), but given your situation, here is one approach I would suggest:

 

1. Name everything with YYMMDD, because the notes, tags, and notebooks will automatically arrange themselves in chronological order.

http://www.christopher-mayo.com/?p=367

 

2. Start a notebook for 8/20/2013 called "130820-article"

 

3. Consider using keywords and dates for titles. For example, every note for an issue gets 130820 in the title somewhere (I prefer the front). Research notes (clippings, etc.) get "research" as a keyword in the title, writing gets "writing" in the title, and correspondence gets "correspondence" in the title. It would look something like this:

130820 writing article nasa space station

130820 correspondence director nasa station program 

130820 research white paper nasa station

 

4. When you are done, select everything and make a table of contents note (label it appropriately with "contents").

https://www.evernote.com/Home.action#b=2b3f5418-2ab1-4ee6-8ff4-5cd977fb19ea&st=p&n=a808397a-bdee-41b3-954e-e144a45f306c

 

5. Select everything and apply the tag "130820" to it. 

 

6. Select everything and drag it to your "archive" notebook.

 

7. Rename your "130820-article" notebook "130821-article". 

 

8. Rinse and repeat.

 

The idea here is that you have multiple hooks for browsing, finding, and discovering information. If you remember when you did something, you could search for "intitle:1308* intitle:contents" and find every table of contents for every article you worked on in August neatly lined up AS IF they were all in a notebook. This is the beauty of Evernote. You can filter your notes to show you certain information, and so the notebooks become unnecessary. Why did I ask you to make that first one? Well, it helps in the early stages of a project to lump stuff together without worrying about doing anything but dumping it in a notebook. The tags, table of contents, etc. can come when you are finishing up and moving on. There is no point in having 5,000 notebooks if everything is clustered together chronologically and even has nice, neat tables of contents to go along with them. 

 

You could also search for "tag:130820" and find everything connected to 130820. If you are ambitious with your tags, you could have additional categories like "political", "science", etc. to enable searching later for themes. One thing I recommend is to either capitalize every word or use lower case (I use lower case), use the singular, and never use spaces (dashes if you must). The idea here is to maintain consistency and make sure you don't have tags for "grumpy monkey," "Grumpy Monkey," "Grumpy-Monkey," etc. If you do, then things will get quite messy.

 

That's my advice.  

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I don't really understand why you're furious.

When you started to use EN didn't you see the notebooks limits?

It is obvious that this limit will be hit if you use them one per client. No ?

If your post is to search solutions I'll be glad to help. If it's just to say "more notebooks" I fear you'll have to wait.

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While I appreciate your dedication at keeping the forum "clean", there was a reason why I wanted to add the information in this particular topic. Being as the reason I was moving notes around in the first place was to work with the limit of Evernote of 250, the troubles I encountered trying to do so ( hundreds of notes getting moved to the trash bin after syncing ) are a direct consequence . Furthermore, aside from warning other users of that possible bug, I want to make sure that whatever glitch in the EN system that I think has to do with syncing , doesn't go unnoticed.

I have never been able to get any kind of real help from all the service requests I have submitted, they always seem to suggest I reinstall EN, and I really do not think the problem is there. There is something really strange going on when synching occurs, notes get moved around, changes get lost etc. And I have already pointed out that the way EN handles versions with synching means that you cant even perform a personal backup since when you would try to restore your notebooks from your backup , EN would change all your notes to match the servers version ....

EN is a great program but right now, I'm starting to think it's almost better to use it completely offline and backup your own data because I really do not trust the way it handles versions between the server, your computer and any other device, and it doesn't let you select a Master, it just decides which version is the right one and changes all the others to match it. In theory this is great if it works but that not what I am experimenting . What's really annoying is that I never had any of those problems until I hit the 250 limit , then all sorts of errors started showing up so there is definitely something they have to fix there and I'm afraid they are too busy trying to design a family app to pay attention to this problem. I have asked countless times REAL and PRECISE information about how this works so I can avoid any errors and I always get very vague and useless answers....

Lpr, with all due respect, several (very fluent in Evernote) users spent a lot of their free time trying to help you with your problem. You repeatedly overlooked or ignored their advice and chose to instead focus on what you can't do in EN rather than finding a solution to your problem. You seem to be continuing that "tradition" with EN support ("I have never been able to get any kind of real help from all the service requests I have submitted, they always seem to suggest I reinstall EN, and I really do not think the problem is there.") & seem to think you know more than the developers do. The biggest reason the devs want you to be using the most current version is to have a baseline - they know that your problem is not due to a bug that has subsequently been fixed. IME, most (all?) devs (regardless of the software) will first tell you to be sure you're using the most current version of their software. In fact, I received a reply from a trouble ticket for another app I'm trying to use (Diskaid) and the first things they say is to make sure I'm using current versions of my OS & their software.

Contrary to what you say here, you CAN restore from backups. ((I pointed this out to you in another thread two days ago along with DETAILED instructions on how to work around this). But sometimes, when someone has been dinking around trying to fix something, the way to restore notes may differ from one case to another. IOW, restoring from a backup will differ if nothing has been added since the backup vs a weeks worth of work done since the backup. This has always been the way of restores, in my 35+ years of being in IT.

Also contrary to what you say here, you have been given very detailed replies to your posts on the board.

However, you've posted your thoughts & opinions & that's fine. But repeatedly posting this (mis)information is not helpful to anyone.

Maybe you should meditate on what people write a bit longer before feeling compelled to answer them rushing to EN's rescue. If you had, you might have noticed that I was following your own advice by reorganizing my whole EN to use tags more instead of notebooks to work within EN's limitations. You might also have thought of the possibility, as it is indeed the case, that I already had installed the latest version of the software when the problem arose ( I always install updates the moment they come out ) and so , getting as the sole and repeated problem solving trick from EN to update my software a bit of a letdown. Finally, you might also have noticed that I often do praise EN. I really do think it is a great program and use it everyday. But when the safety of my data is at risk , I do not take this lightly and forgive me if I make a point of using these forums to express concerns , raise issues and warn other users of possible problems.

Respectfully, The Misinformer.

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2 Notebooks would be enough for me, really. As long as I could share Tags and have offline Tags.

I think "Notebooks" is actually a poor name for this feature because it kinda misleads people into thinking that this is THE way they should organise Notes. Which isn't actually the case in Evernote.

Offline tags. Shared tags. These would make a huge difference for me. I don't know if Notebooks are misleading. I'd say they are an easier organizational metaphor to understand than tags. Who doesn't have a real life binder of something?

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OOPS SORRY LOOKS LIKE YOU ARE DONE USING EVERNOTE! YOU'VE REACHED YOUR NOTEBOOK LIMIT!

WTF

I JUST FOUND OUT ABOUT THIS AND I AM FREAKING OUT !

I'm so angry right now. That is unacceptable!!!!! I have been a premium user for years now, I use Evernote for everything! I have my life in it literally. I never even go near one tenth of my monthly limit but now all of a sudden today Evernote gives me an error saying that I have too many notebooks???? What am I supposed to do about this? Delete them? Everything I have is organized perfectly, and I need all these notebooks. I created them for a reason. Why should I even have a notebook limit? How does it make any kind of sense? Data limit I can understand but notebook limit? WWHHHYYY? Seriously.

Evernote has been bragging about the more you use it the more you will want to use it since day one, and how it becomes your second brain. Well I guess my second brain is seriously limited. What am I supposed to do now? I have no desire to start using tags instead of notebooks as their support suggested.

I'm sure I should be using a nicer "tone" right now but I after having invested and trusted so much information into a program using the paying version, this little surprise really feels like a slap in the face.

PLEASE FIX THIS!

SOON!

Hi. Welcome to the forums!

I agree that it would be nice if we had no limits, but that isn't the case, and it has not been the case for a long time. The notebook limit (along with other ones) is nothing new.

https://support.evernote.com/link/portal/16051/16058/Article/614/How-many-notes-notebooks-and-tags-can-a-single-account-accommodate

Personally, I usually only have one or two notebooks at any given time, and generally don't use tags (http://www.princeton.edu/~cmayo/evernote-organization.html), but both are powerful tools that are designed to be used in conjunction with one another. That's just how the app works, so I'd recommend adapting yourself to the app that is, rather than to the app you want it to be.

Feature requests are great, of course, and I make them on a daily basis (any developers reading this can probably fill in the blanks here: v------- l--- v--w), but just because developers choose not to implement our ideas it doesn't mean the app is broken. It's just a difference of opinion. Maybe, if you could share your organizational system with us and make your case for more notebooks it might help to persuade the developers (they read the forums) :)

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No more than using the term "Folders", say -- you learn a new program, you need to learn the basic organizational tools/language. You learn GMail, you learn "labels". You learn Outlook, you learn "Categories". And so on...

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ALSO

What I would really like The Evernote Team to understand is that not everybody uses their program the same way. One person might only need 3 notebooks with 10000 notes . That's fine. I really do not care how people organize their notes. I personally NEED the subdivisions of notes, notebooks AND piles of notes. I even asked in the past that you allow us to create BOXES of piles. WHY? BECAUSE I NEED TO BE ABLE TO ORGANIZE THE NOTES IN A WAY I CAN EASILY SEE THAT ARCHITECTURE OF FILING. I have no interest in tags. It does nothing for me. I would have a never ending list of tags with no way of filing those tags, no levels of organization, no architecture. So it's really not helpful to read the tag users experiences because that does not fit my personal needs.

Seriously .

FIX THIS

If this is something you're absolutely convinced you need, then Evernote is not the right product for you. Your time will be better spent looking for a product that works for you rather than ragging on one that doesn't & may never implement what you need.

But really, I think if you calmed down & read some of the tags vs notebooks threads, you'd see you really can get by with 250 notebooks or less.

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your workflow adds a second step to the process of creating a note that I do not have in a multi stack/notebook system. Mine is, I add my note to the correct notebook and Boom, yer done.

That's not correct... You can add new notes to a selected Tag as well with a single step, it's just not a default behaviour in Windows.

On windows you can change registry setting "SetNewNoteTags" from 0 to 1.

On ios you can add notes directly to tags or notebooks, it's a default behaviour to begin with.

I almost always add new notes to the inbox Notebook and organise them later, so I personally prefer the default Windows behaviour.

To change it:

Quit Evernote completely by right-clicking the elephant icon in your system tray and choosing Quit.

Launch the Windows Registry Editor by clicking Start, Run and typing regedit.

Expand the HKEY_CURRENT_USER folder and browse to Software\Evernote\Evernote.

Change "SetNewNoteTags" from 0 to 1.

Nice to know, but oddly obscure. If EN is convinced that tags are the way to go, why isn't this the default setting. I think I will stick with the current setting.

The best thing working in favor of us Notebookers is the web clipper guessing (amazingly well) what notebook to put your clipped page or article into based on the topic of the clipped piece. That makes my workflow almost painless.

Hugh

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All in favor of raising the notebook limit for all our us 'old-school' thinkers who have faithfully paided our Evernote premium group membership ... :)  I am not having to change my entire scheme of organizing notes to accomodate this 'setting' change.  

 

Please let us choose :)   Thanks!  Erick

Not sure what setting change you are referring to -- the only change to number of notebooks that's occurred in the past couple of years is an increase from 100 to 250.

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It doesn't really matter how things are named but the problem is that new users tend to think that Notes should be organised in Notebooks, since this is how things work in real life, and Tags are just something additional. And then they run into issues and don't take the full advantage of Tags in Evernote. IMHO, of course.

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@BnF Re your "non-nesting IRL" comment:

 

Isn't this almost always the way...  Adopt a real life paradigm and then diverge from it as the user base gets used to it. The ability to tag things IRL would be a lovely one. In fact I've many times thought about how to do it but concluded it'd be unpopular (at least in MY house). :-) To be fair organisations' Asset Management techniques often DO lean heavily on naming assets - down to individual doors and beyond.

 

But I digress: I just think Notebooks / Folders are closer to the "real life" experience than tags. But I prefer tags as they allow multiple assignment to what we today call a note. But to me the online / digital life is just as much a part of real life as atom-based stuff is. :-)

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Better D,

 

I understand your frustration. For a product that wants to be the place to store all your notes, Evernote has a surprising number of limitations. If a competitor came along that didn't have these restrictions, I'd jump without hesitation. Instead, we get features like business chat and a presentation mode. Useful for some I'm sure, but worthless to me.

 

Sadly, I don't think complaining here does anything (except generate bad press for Evernote, and increase user frustration because we're ignored). You'll probably just get comments about how you're using Evernote wrong.

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If EN is convinced that tags are the way to go, why isn't this the default setting.

This is a straw man argument kind of.

Whether EN is convinced that Tags are the way to go or not is irrelevant in the case of this particular feature/setting.

"new note" kind of implies that you're creating a new note from scratch, clean, without any content. Tags are content. You can add some tags if you want, or not. But it makes sense to create a NEW note without Tags initially by default. You can't go wrong with that, that's why it's default.

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The bad news is that your comment is useless and doesn't help Better, the good news is there is probably multiple solutions which could help him to run his business with EN.

Wrong or right he hit the limit (a technical one, increase it will have costs) and have to find solutions.

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The best thing working in favor of us Notebookers is the web clipper guessing (amazingly well) what notebook to put your clipped page or article into based on the topic of the clipped piece. That makes my workflow almost painless.

The best thing about Tags is that each note can have multiple Tags. I usually tag notes with at least 2 tags, sometimes up to 12 tags. Can't do that with notebooks. That makes a workflow based on only notebooks kinda painful in my view.

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See, here's what I am hearing from Evernote since day one:

We want you to use the app to put ALL THE STUFF YOU WANT TO REMEMBER in it.

We want you to use our app FOR A LONG TIME.

The more people will have in it, the more likely they will be to stick to it because they will have invested so much important data in to. Basically, they will NEED it.

And that's exactly what I have done. Two years , thousands of hours of research filed in this app.

And I did this because I was under the impression, from listening to Phil Libin that this was an app that was dedicated to follow its users through many years, if not life.

So now , that Evernote is indeed crucial to my life because I have invested all this time and data in it, NOW it lets me down and tell me I can not keep on using it?

I seriously think I have a reason to be pissed here. Also this limit might be written somewhere but it surely is not advertised a lot. I never heard of it and I'v been keeping a very close eye on Evernote BECAUSE I have so much invested in it.

When you encourage users to commit so much into your app you have a responsibility towards them.

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And I'm not an alien.  Honest.

 

But isn't that what you'd say if you were an alien?  ;)

 

Ah but you see that's part of my master plan to take over the world..  If I say what you'd think I'd say if I were an alien,  you'd think that a being with a brain the size of the universe wouldn't make such a silly mistake,  so I must not be an alien,  but all the time I am an alien,  plotting World Domination mwahahahahah...

 

..What was the question again?

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Actually, they do need to be organized into notebooks, since every note belongs to exactly one notebook. :) And I'm guessing that a fair amount of people use notebooks as their only organizing facility (I'm sure Evernote has the stats on this sort of stuff). But for folks who need more organizing power, an Evernote user needs to learn to use tags.

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See, here's what I am hearing from Evernote since day one:

We want you to use the app to put ALL THE STUFF YOU WANT TO REMEMBER in it.

We want you to use our app FOR A LONG TIME.

The more people will have in it, the more likely they will be to stick to it because they will have invested so much important data in to. Basically, they will NEED it.

And that's exactly what I have done. Two years , thousands of hours of research filed in this app.

And I did this because I was under the impression, from listening to Phil Libin that this was an app that was dedicated to follow its users through many years, if not life.

So now , that Evernote is indeed crucial to my life because I have invested all this time and data in it, NOW it lets me down and tell me I can not keep on using it?

I seriously think I have a reason to be pissed here. Also this limit might be written somewhere but it surely is not advertised a lot. I never heard of it and I'v been keeping a very close eye on Evernote BECAUSE I have so much invested in it.

When you encourage users to commit so much into your app you have a responsibility towards them.

There's nothing that says you can't continue to keep adding stuff to Evernote for years to come. Evernote emphasizes using tags rather than relying upon so many notebooks or even subnotebooks (which don't exist in EN.) Like I said, if you read some of the tag vs notebooks threads and calm down a bit, I think you'll see you can very easily reduce the number of notebooks you have & with no loss of functionality. I've been using EN since 2008 & have over 52,000 notes. There's not a day that goes by that I don't add notes & most days I add probably at list 15 or more. I've never reached the 250 limit. Yeah, everyone works differently. But I have to say, IMO, the tag thing is brilliant. But it does require thinking a bit differently than one has in the past.

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See, here's what I am hearing from Evernote since day one:

We want you to use the app to put ALL THE STUFF YOU WANT TO REMEMBER in it.

We want you to use our app FOR A LONG TIME.

The more people will have in it, the more likely they will be to stick to it because they will have invested so much important data in to. Basically, they will NEED it.

And that's exactly what I have done. Two years , thousands of hours of research filed in this app.

And I did this because I was under the impression, from listening to Phil Libin that this was an app that was dedicated to follow its users through many years, if not life.

So now , that Evernote is indeed crucial to my life because I have invested all this time and data in it, NOW it lets me down and tell me I can not keep on using it?

I seriously think I have a reason to be pissed here. Also this limit might be written somewhere but it surely is not advertised a lot. I never heard of it and I'v been keeping a very close eye on Evernote BECAUSE I have so much invested in it.

When you encourage users to commit so much into your app you have a responsibility towards them.

It's mentioned on the Evernote website, in this forum, and in the Evernote podcasts. Others have commented on the web about the limits as well. I agree that the Evernote service is not documented well at all, with much of it years out of date, if it even exists at all. All the more reason, then, to dig around for it before setting up a system.

You are angry, but I am not sure how we would determine if you have a right or not to it. That thorny issue might be beyond the scope of the problem :) You are here now, so the best we can do as users is figure out how to overcome your problem and state your case to try and convince developers to change the app.

And, as BNF said, the limited notebooks does not necessarily limit you, IF you adopt a system that takes advantage of what Evernote has to offer. I've been with Evernote 4 years, I have thousands of notes, and I've got 5 notebooks (most shared). My main default notebook holds 99% of the notes. At this rate, I won't reach 250 until I am dead and gone :)

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I appreciate the responses.  You ask why I didn't research the limits ahead of time... My answer: because I was taught by someone else to use this for my business; and this person is an Ambassador for Evernote!  [don't worry, I've made my frustration known to that person]

 

But to piggy back that... I just got on Evernote's website to search for those limits, mainly to see how deep I would have to go to find it... All over the website, on every page that anyone would browse when entertaining the idea of downloading the app, it states how it will do anything your business or life requires.. one workspace no what form your writing takes.  When you explore all of Premium's features, it specifically states "Unlimit yourself... keep all work related files together without ever worrying about space."  Even in the comparison after you click learn more about Premium, in all CAPS it says UNLIMITED!  That's it; that's all it states.  There is no prominent tab directing you (or suggesting that you look into) a chart informing you about limits.  Not until one browses the "support" page or "Blog," is there anything this limit.  And people don't typically think they have to go to support to learn about such an important "heads up."

 

Furthermore, the mere existence of Notes and Notebooks implies that's how Evernote intends for you to use their product.  Then they came out with Stacks, further steering someone to use that particular organizational structure.  If they intended us to use tags to such an extent, the tags would have a much larger presence in the main display of your files when you open Evernote... at least to me, that makes more sense.

 

If someone from Evernote would simply say that to allow for more notebooks would take up too much space on their servers, I would say fair enough; just tell me how much more money you need... but then I would question the advertisement of something being UNLIMITED without any asterisks.

 

But for a company to have 51million users, one would think they could accompany everyone better.

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  • Level 5*
@keruchan:
Honestly, I don't think Evernote is a good tool for your use case.
EN has none of the key features I'd think you would want:
  1. Scalability
  2. Easy integration to subscribe online, and collect/manage payments.
  3. Notifications to subscribers of new/changed content
  4. Usage tracking
  5. Provision for easy feedback
  6. "Liking"
  7. Comments by subscribers
  8. More options for content display, like internal TOC, expand/collapsible sections, Video/YouTube viewing, etc.

I would think there are online solutions out there for your type of service.  But forum software comes to mind as a potential solution.

 

Good luck.

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Why are the number of notebooks limited at all?  I would like to see the limit removed or at least increased to some large number.

 

In my case, I separate my research notes by the resource they came from.  Each source is a separate notebook.  250 is not sufficient for my use.

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Well, as I said earlier, that's fine. We all use the app differently. That's my whole point. I only have 1700 notes but these notes deeply require more than 250 notebooks. It therefore is not surprising that you do not understand my frustration and fright if for you notebooks are not an essential feature of EN. But Please try to imagine, at the light of what I have said earlier regarding the amount of data and time I have trusted into EN, how this sudden impossibility to continue to create notebooks might be terrifying . What if in 3 years, after you have made EN a crucial tool for your work, it suddenly told you you could not create tags anymore hence no way to organize new data, hence transform EN into a dead but still indispensable thing for all you have put in it but with no possibility of adding to it and furthering your work in it. because as a researcher, new fields of information always keeps emerging. My life is not limited to 250 topics.

I am right now reading the Tag vs notebook threads in the hope to find a solution . Thank you for pointing me there. While I understand the advantages of metadata, I use it in FCPX, Capture One etc, There are also advantages to being able to physically sort your data. And that's what I truly need and loved so far with Evernote. I still find it hard to comprehend why such a restriction should even exist in the first place. My opinion is still that users should be able to choose how they want to sort their data.

On a sidenote. It looks to me, at least as far as I can tell that the restriction only applies to the server image of the program which I never, ever use. The error arrives when it tried to sync these additional notebooks to the server, because I am capable of creating them, just not syncing them. The notes in these additional notebooks get uploaded on the server but they go to the default notebook and the additional notebooks I create on the desktop client don't get created on the server , hence breaking the image symmetry .... I wonder how this works out because that means a specific note X is store at place A on my desktop and place B on the server image.

I would like to hear from EN on this, I have contacted the assistance and I really hope to hear something reassuring. It seems to make no sense to limit the number of notebooks when the data you can put in them is almost unlimited. Why?

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There is no more random or arbitrary here than in the prices you set or the budget you have.

This is by design.

 

EN has been designed - his limits and features - for an intended use. And they estimated 250 NB, 100k notes, 100k tags... were confortable limits for this use.

 

I'm not sure I get the point of your digits discussion, but there is nothing magic about the number 250 in the computer world.  It certainly does NOT represent any type of technical constraint.  The Evernote data is maintained in a SQLite database, and there is nothing about it that would prevent a larger number of Notebooks.

 

So, I can only conclude that for some unknown reason, back in the early days of Evernote, someone thought it would be better to limit Notebooks and promote the use of Tags.  Personally, I think this was flawed logic.  But, like a lot of decisions, once made it's hard to change (sometimes just for ego reasons).

 

I don't know if Evernote will ever change its basic model of limited, non-hierarchy, Notebooks.  It seems unlikely at this point.

But Evernote has announced they are hiring a new CEO, so who knows?

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Why are the number of notebooks limited at all? I would like to see the limit removed or at least increased to some large number.

In my case, I separate my research notes by the resource they came from. Each source is a separate notebook. 250 is not sufficient for my use.

The search function is your friend.

http://discussion.evernote.com/topic/28516-250-notebooks-is-not-enough/

http://discussion.evernote.com/topic/34434-if-not-more-than-250-notebooks-then/

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There are also advantages to being able to physically sort your data.

Since this data is all bits & bytes, there is no way to "physically" sort your data. However, sorting by notebooks is just as easily done with tags. Really.

But Please try to imagine, at the light of what I have said earlier regarding the amount of data and time I have trusted into EN, how this sudden impossibility to continue to create notebooks might be terrifying .

Sure. But at the same time, please try to see what others here are trying to convey to you. It's truly not the end of the world. I've yet to see a use case where tags didn't replicate notebooks, in the digital world.

It seems to make no sense to limit the number of notebooks when the data you can put in them is almost unlimited. Why?

I don't know. I do know EN has commented in the past that some restrictions are in play since they cover so many OS's. When you live on as many platforms as EN does, what's good for the goose is not necessarily good for the gander. They try to make their app work. Across all the platforms. And across all the various devices those platforms live on. I would guess that might be one of the things that attracted you to EN. But even if you only use it on one platform, that's still the niche that is Evernote & one of the (many) things that makes it great. Unless one is intimately involved with the issues encountered while doing such an undertaking, there's just simply no way to know.

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Good point. 500 notebooks for premium members might generate some more interest in premium membership :)

Incremental, at best, in my opinion. And It's dead certain that Evernote already has the stats on customer notebook usage.

Look, if the 250 number was just arbitrary, and if changing it were as easy as just setting a number somewhere, without some significant impact on performance and/or storage, do you think that they wouldn't have done it by now?

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The best thing about Tags is that each note can have multiple Tags. I usually tag notes with at least 2 tags, sometimes up to 12 tags. Can't do that with notebooks. That makes a workflow based on only notebooks kinda painful in my view.

I think that that's really my main motivation for preferring tags (or GMail labels, or Outlook categories) to Notebooks (or folders). Notebooks are not useless, but for most of my needs, tags are more flexible and powerful organizing tools.

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My comment about the evangelists expresses my concern that people who admit they do not officially speak for EN and who have their own points of view about how the program should be used could cause new users to limit their complaints about EN.

So...it's ok for people to regularly post what they want to see changed but not for other people to post workarounds, suggestions or even express *their* own point of view...??? As far as I know, ALL users are allowed to post their POV whether it's a complaint, praise, suggestion, workaround or even "yes, this has been discussed before."
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I can certainly imagine your scenario. As a researcher myself, and someone who has spent lots and lots of time fiddling around with organization / categorization of stuff, I can certainly see the appeal in notebooks.

Also, as I said, I am not a big fan of arbitrary limitations either. However, there is nothing to be surprised or frightened about. For many years now, people just like you have found a way to make it work for them.

I am on the minimalist side of things, but there is a huge range of possibilities. The more you share about your system, the better able experienced Evernote ninjas like BNF can help :)

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Well, as I said earlier, that's fine. We all use the app differently. That's my whole point. I only have 1700 notes but these notes deeply require more than 250 notebooks.

Only if you really don't believe that you can organize with tags. I think it's not as difficult as you may believe.

What if in 3 years, after you have made EN a crucial tool for your work, it suddenly told you you could not create tags anymore hence no way to organize new data, hence transform EN into a dead but still indispensable thing for all you have put in it but with no possibility of adding to it and furthering your work in it.

The 250 notebook limit is no sudden thing, and no secret; it actually was 100 not all that long ago. As it happens, the limit for numbers of tags is currently 10000, I think. I believe that the limitations are probably rooted in limitations of presentation in the UI, but that's just a guess.

because as a researcher, new fields of information always keeps emerging. My life is not limited to 250 topics.

Nor mine. Tags are perfect for topics. As a researcher you should know about keywords; that's just what tags are.

I am right now reading the Tag vs notebook threads in the hope to find a solution . Thank you for pointing me there. While I understand the advantages of metadata, I use it in FCPX, Capture One etc,

SImple:

Notebooks partition your set of notes: a note belongs to exactly one notebook.

Tags are labels that can be applied to any number of notes, while conversely, a note may have any number (may be limited, but it's a fair number) of tags. There's no reason that tags cannot partition your notes as notebooks do, but that seems kind of limiting, when you can get all kinds of good cross-classification using multiple tags.

There are also advantages to being able to physically sort your data. And that's what I truly need and loved so far with Evernote. I still find it hard to comprehend why such a restriction should even exist in the first place. My opinion is still that users should be able to choose how they want to sort their data.

Whatever "physically" sorting your data means, you can do it with tags about as easily.

I would like to hear from EN on this, I have contacted the assistance and I really hope to hear something reassuring. It seems to make no sense to limit the number of notebooks when the data you can put in them is almost unlimited. Why?

Good luck. As it goes, the limitation is just the way it is. It's fair game to request that the limit be raised, but if it's not, you'll need to rethink your strategy.

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there are many things that tags do not do as some users have mentioned above, you can not share a tag...

Also, it takes forever to apply metadata to each and every note to make sure it falls into the right place. I will need to add a separate entry of metadata for each filing level the note falls into and that to each note. Unless there is a way to do batch editing that I have not figure out. So not only will it take a lot of time in the future, I would also have to do it now to 1700 notes now just to replicate the architecture I already have right now with notebooks. With notebooks just just select the notebook you nee and add a new note, no need to enter any metadata for it to be organized.

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@chirmer Just as my 'to do' list won't be empty when I die :-) Evernote's 'development tasks' list won't ever be empty...

 

... And, as this thread has shown, it's highly debatable whether upping the limit would be a good thing.

 

And, as somewhat of a scalability expert, I know just changing the number doesn't necessarily lead to a satisfactory experience.

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there are many things that tags do not do as some users have mentioned above, you can not share a tag...

That part is true. How many notebooks are you sharing?

I will need to add a separate entry of metadata for each filing level the note falls into and that to each note. Unless there is a way to do batch editing that I have not figure out. So not only will it take a lot of time in the future, I would also have to do it now to 1700 notes now just to replicate the architecture I already have right now with notebooks. With notebooks just just select the notebook you nee and add a new note, no need to enter any metadata for it to be organized.

Please provide a specific example b/c I don't really see what you're saying. Let's say you are adding your insurance renewal for Car A & you scan it in as a PDF. You might have a notebook for Car A & that's where you'd add this PDF note, in your example. Instead, what I do is I have a notebooks "Auto info". All info for all cars (insurance, tags, maintenance, etc) goes into that notebook. Tags do the differentiation. So I add my note to the "Auto info" notebook & simply tag it "Car A". Boom, yer done. There is nothing in the note itself I would do differently if I had a separate "Car A" notebook.

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Thank you or your input.

I will wait and see what Evernote says.

While you have opened my mind to considering tags I still think It would make a lot more sense to let people choose how they want to organize their notes. I'm definitely not looking forward to re-organizing all my notes one by one. I'm considering starting a second paying account for future notes.

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Thank you or your input.

I will wait and see what Evernote says.

While you have opened my mind to considering tags I still think It would make a lot more sense to let people choose how they want to organize their notes. I'm definitely not looking forward to re-organizing all my notes one by one. I'm considering starting a second paying account for future notes.

First, it's doubtful you'll get a response from EN that appeases you. IF (IF!) they were considering increasing the limit, they don't publish this info. Additionally, if they increased it, it would most likely be an increase & not an unlimited thing. When I first started using EN, the limit was 100 notebooks. They did increase that to 250 about three years ago.

Second, it's not as time consuming as you make it out to be. Like I said, if you have a notebook named "Car A", just create a notebook "Cars", Then create a tag "Car A", Select all the notes in your "Car A" notebook & apply the "Car A" tag & then move them to the "Cars" notebook. Really, it's not that bad.

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Sure each note goes into some Notebook by default. So what? It might as well just go into "No notebook" by default, or to "unfiled/unorganised" section (which doesn't exist). :) whatever.

Here's one of my notes for example:

8192125450_05d9a41d23_b.jpg

It has 7 Tags which will help me to find it in future. Actually, the more Tags a Note has the better, as long as those Tags are really relevant, of course.

Things have their places, not a single place.

The problem with Notebooks is that, again, you can't apply multiple Notebooks to a Note which makes a workflow based on only notebooks kinda painful in my view.

If you put things only in a single place instead of as many relevant places as possible you're just making it harder for yourself to find it later on. And the more Notes you add the more painful it's going to get.

Every time you organize matters in one single way, you are disordering them in all others.

And I'm guessing that a fair amount of people use notebooks as their only organizing facility (I'm sure Evernote has the stats on this sort of stuff).

Again, that's just an example of poor/inefficient workflow, not a good point IMHO.

A quote from David Weinberger, Everything is Miscellaneous book:

"When we come across the paper photo from 2005 of Aunt Sally on a beach in Mexico at sunset celebrating cousin Jamie’s birthday, with the twins in the background playing badminton, we have to decide which one spot in one album we’re going to stick it into.

If it were a digital album, we wouldn’t have to make that choice. We could label it in as many ways as we could think of: Aunt Sally, Mexico, 2005, beach, birthday, twins, badminton, sunset, trips, foreign countries, fun times, relatives, places we want to go back to, days we got sunburned. "

In physical world we have to think carefully about which metadata we’ll capture because the physical world limits the amount of metadata we can make available.

In a digital world this is no longer a problem... Unless you rely on Notebooks in Evernote. I mean using mainly Notebooks to organise notes in Evernote is like taking the main organizational problem of a physical world and unnecessarily carrying it over to a digital world. It's just a poor practice.

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Isn't this almost always the way...  Adopt a real life paradigm and then diverge from it as the user base gets used to it. The ability to tag things IRL would be a lovely one.

I think that once everyone gets Google Glasses, this will be doable, and then we'll wonder how we ever got around without the capability, and by the way, what was all the ruckus about these stupid one-dimensional notebook/folder thingies anyways? :)

But I digress: I just think Notebooks / Folders are closer to the "real life" experience than tags.

No question there, but...

But I prefer tags as they allow multiple assignment to what we today call a note. But to me the online / digital life is just as much a part of real life as atom-based stuff is. :-)

...we certainly have the mental ability to apply more than one adjective to an object (e.g. those low-down, dirty, snake-in-the-grass tag freaks), and it's hard to argue that mental processes are not real, so, yeah, ultimately it all comes down to personal preference; not everyone likes Brussel Sprouts, or Dixieland jazz, or plaid.
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Good point. 500 notebooks for premium members might generate some more interest in premium membership :)

Incremental, at best, in my opinion. And It's dead certain that Evernote already has the stats on customer notebook usage.

Look, if the 250 number was just arbitrary, and if changing it were as easy as just setting a number somewhere, without some significant impact on performance and/or storage, do you think that they wouldn't have done it by now?

All the limits are arbitrary :)

But, of course, there is the question of why they imposed the limits. The developers probably would not do something like this unless they had a reason, otherwise, as you said, they would not have done it at all. It's fine to urge Evernote to increase the notebook limit, but it is worth asking if it is worth it, given the tools already available.

As users, I think it is best to ask ourselves what we want to do with notebooks, and if it turns out that tags will actually accomplish the same task (most cases), then I'd recommend just switching to tags, because Evernote is designed around them, and you'll be unlikely to hit the 10,000 tag limit anytime soon.

With the exception of sharing, I haven't seen a convincing case yet for someone to have hundreds of notebooks.

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The best thing about Tags is that each note can have multiple Tags. I usually tag notes with at least 2 tags, sometimes up to 12 tags. Can't do that with notebooks. That makes a workflow based on only notebooks kinda painful in my view.

Agreed... i use tags that way. I think what the notebook/tag discussion really comes down to is that initial creation of notes. My EN use is typically 20 - 30 images, diagrams or articles that I come across on the web or in emails in the course of a day. I like the speed and ease of just saving that item to the appropriate notebook without having to add tags at that time. When I have some free time I will go through these notes and add tags if they will help. I may not get time for two weeks and wading through so many notes is difficult. Most of my notes can not be searched because they are images with little or no text. This is why I find dropping them in the right notebook initially helps me find them whenever I need them. It just comes down to my perception of the easiest and fastest way to get notes into my database.

So I am a big fan of tags but as a supplement to my notebook organization. I don't need huge changes to EN and nothing should impact those who use tags as their primary organizer. I have given up hope that EN will extend it's notebook hierarchy beyond a stack and one level. All I want is a collapsible list of notebooks on my iPad like the one I have on my mac.

Hugh

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there are many things that tags do not do as some users have mentioned above, you can not share a tag...

That part is true. How many notebooks are you sharing?

I will need to add a separate entry of metadata for each filing level the note falls into and that to each note. Unless there is a way to do batch editing that I have not figure out. So not only will it take a lot of time in the future, I would also have to do it now to 1700 notes now just to replicate the architecture I already have right now with notebooks. With notebooks just just select the notebook you nee and add a new note, no need to enter any metadata for it to be organized.

Please provide a specific example b/c I don't really see what you're saying. Let's say you are adding your insurance renewal for Car A & you scan it in as a PDF. You might have a notebook for Car A & that's where you'd add this PDF note, in your example. Instead, what I do is I have a notebooks "Auto info". All info for all cars (insurance, tags, maintenance, etc) goes into that notebook. Tags do the differentiation. So I add my note to the "Auto info" notebook & simply tag it "Car A". Boom, yer done. There is nothing in the note itself I would do differently if I had a separate "Car A" notebook.

Sure but then to access the information on Car A you need first to select your Auto info notebook then go in a separate field to go and select your Car A tag to view all the notes related to said car. While this might work if you only have a few tags or few notebooks it becomes very annoying when you have hundreds.

What I need is to be able to easily see only the information I want to see while being able to choose from a "menu" of fields.

for example.

I use Piles of notebooks for General fields of Interest like Music, Contemporary Art, Cinema . The notebooks for say Articles on Cinema, Film Directors, DP. Then individual notes for each entry. I would not want to have to select in one field a notebook Cinema and then go in a different Field and look for the tag Articles on cinema...

Now if I were to use tags, I would want to ONLY use tags because it is important for me to be able to browse by opening and closing the content of my classifications . I do not want to have to navigate between notebooks and tags, I want all my organization in one place. And to properly file one Article I have to create the note then Tag it once Articles on Cinema and then Cinema which is two steps more than I originally had to do.

So it goes back to not being able to share tags and me having to enter multiple entries of metadata for 1700+ notes.

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Here's what I received...

Thank you for providing this feedback on Evernote.

Unfortunately, we cannot comment on the plans the developers have for changes to Evernote, such as allowing more notebooks than 250. We really appreciate you taking the time to send us your feedback. Your comments and suggestions will help us to enhance Evernote and serve you better.

We will be sure to pass on the information you've provided to the product development team for discussion.

Thank you

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Thank you or your input.

I will wait and see what Evernote says.

While you have opened my mind to considering tags I still think It would make a lot more sense to let people choose how they want to organize their notes. I'm definitely not looking forward to re-organizing all my notes one by one. I'm considering starting a second paying account for future notes.

First, it's doubtful you'll get a response from EN that appeases you. IF (IF!) they were considering increasing the limit, they don't publish this info. Additionally, if they increased it, it would most likely be an increase & not an unlimited thing. When I first started using EN, the limit was 100 notebooks. They did increase that to 250 about three years ago.

Second, it's not as time consuming as you make it out to be. Like I said, if you have a notebook named "Car A", just create a notebook "Cars", Then create a tag "Car A", Select all the notes in your "Car A" notebook & apply the "Car A" tag & then move them to the "Cars" notebook. Really, it's not that bad.

Mind you, Your Method COULD work for me if the tags available were specific to the selected notebook. For instance, if I selected Notebook A and the tag section updated to reveal only tags that are present in notebook A that could kind of work. But if I have to search in a long list of tags that mostly have nothing to do with notebook A to find the one I want , well that just doesn't work.

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Sure but then to access the information on Car A you need first to select your Auto info notebook then go in a separate field to go and select your Car A tag to view all the notes related to said car.

Actually, no. First, you don't have to specify a notebook. Second, I changed my "global search in EN" hotkey (in options) to F5. So I press F5 & then enter this into the search box:

tag:"Car A"

Boom, yer done.

What I need is to be able to easily see only the information I want to see while being able to choose from a "menu" of fields.

for example.

I use Piles of notebooks for General fields of Interest like Music, Contemporary Art, Cinema . The notebooks for say Articles on Cinema, Film Directors, DP. Then individual notes for each entry. I would not want to have to select in one field a notebook Cinema and then go in a different Field and look for the tag Articles on cinema...

Now if I were to use tags, I would want to ONLY use tags because it is important for me to be able to browse by opening and closing the content of my classifications . I do not want to have to navigate between notebooks and tags, I want all my organization in one place. And to properly file one Article I have to create the note then Tag it once Articles on Cinema and then Cinema which is two steps more than I originally had to do.

So it goes back to not being able to share tags and me having to enter multiple entries of metadata for 1700+ notes.

Like I said, please provide a specific example. B/C there is really no difference in a note itself if it's in a notebook called "Car A" or a notebook called "Cars" & tagged "Car A".

So it goes back to not being able to share tags and me having to enter multiple entries of metadata for 1700+ notes.

And like I said...

you can not share a tag...

That part is true. How many notebooks are you sharing?

and me having to enter multiple entries of metadata for 1700+ notes.

Again, please provide examples why...simply replacing a notebook with a tag name is as easy as selecting all the notes in a particular notebook & applying that tag. NBD. There is nothing different about the notes you have to change except the batch tagging & moving to a more generic/broad notebook.

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