Jump to content

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Lutherian

Google Keep - No Comparison

Recommended Posts

A few years ago there was a product called Google NoteBook and it was killed. I got burned, and I lost some work.

 

Then there was EverNote, and I was hesitant at first but as time went by I realized that this product was ... as I call it - an ExoCortex

(A secondary layer of memory that overlays my own) - a way of life.

 

Now Google returns with a "Google Keep" an ironic name, after having just slit the throat of Google Reader. (I got burned again)

People are drawing comparisons between "Google Keep" and Evernote - but they're misguided.

 

Evernote as a product speaks for itself, and it stands on it's own merits - but I don't want to see any erosion of EverNote user-base by Google because people come to the wrong conclusion that "Google Keep is kinda like EverNote"

 

As of today - I become "Evangelical" about EverNote because I want to see the best product get the recognition it deserves and I want Evernote to be around for the next 100 years [ and I plan to be around for a long time as you can gather ;) ]

 

These are the points I'm raising around the web

 

1) Evernote is here for the long haul - can we say the same for any Google Product?

2) Evernote desktop allows offline copies on the hard drive (YOU own the data) - is this true of Google Keep?

3) Keep all your eggs in one (cloud) basket? Is that ever a good idea? 

4) If your internet is down - can you still access your data - with EverNote? ... yes we can.

5) Let's say you get a great job offer in another country ...say China - but there's the huge big firewall (You've got 2 choices - 

5.1 Backup your [enex] database file take it with you

5.2 If you've PGP encrypted your sensitive data - you can upload parts of the EverNote Database to the Chinese based Evernote servers

6) Evernote 4.5x works *near-perfectly* under Ubuntu Linux via Wine (one issue with opening up pdfs requires a work-around)

 

Now let's be clear - Evernote certainly doesn't need my help, everyone knows it's an awesome product - but where people start drawing wrong comparisons between Evernote and product X, I'm going to show them my phone or computer, and people can come to their own (informed) conclusions.

 

Thanks to the Evernote Team - here's to the next 100 years.  :lol:

 

 

 

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post

A few years ago there was a product called Google NoteBook and it was killed. I got burned, and I lost some work.

 

Then there was EverNote, and I was hesitant at first but as time went by I realized that this product was ... as I call it - an ExoCortex

(A secondary layer of memory that overlays my own) - a way of life.

 

Now Google returns with a "Google Keep" an ironic name, after having just slit the throat of Google Reader. (I got burned again)

People are drawing comparisons between "Google Keep" and Evernote - but they're misguided.

 

Evernote as a product speaks for itself, and it stands on it's own merits - but I don't want to see any erosion of EverNote user-base by Google because people come to the wrong conclusion that "Google Keep is kinda like EverNote"

 

As of today - I become "Evangelical" about EverNote because I want to see the best product get the recognition it deserves and I want Evernote to be around for the next 100 years [ and I plan to be around for a long time as you can gather ;) ]

 

These are the points I'm raising around the web

 

1) Evernote is here for the long haul - can we say the same for any Google Product?

2) Evernote desktop allows offline copies on the hard drive (YOU own the data) - is this true of Google Keep?

3) Keep all your eggs in one (cloud) basket? Is that ever a good idea? 

4) If your internet is down - can you still access your data - with EverNote? ... yes we can.

5) Let's say you get a great job offer in another country ...say China - but there's the huge big firewall (You've got 2 choices - 

5.1 Backup your [enex] database file take it with you

5.2 If you've PGP encrypted your sensitive data - you can upload parts of the EverNote Database to the Chinese based Evernote servers

6) Evernote 4.5x works *near-perfectly* under Ubuntu Linux via Wine (one issue with opening up pdfs requires a work-around)

 

Now let's be clear - Evernote certainly doesn't need my help, everyone knows it's an awesome product - but where people start drawing wrong comparisons between Evernote and product X, I'm going to show them my phone or computer, and people can come to their own (informed) conclusions.

 

Thanks to the Evernote Team - here's to the next 100 years.  :lol:

 

 

Good points all. Although there's been a lot of chatter about Google Keep, I have not taken a look at it, yet.  I would suspect that even though Google has deeper pockets, EN's five year head start certainly gives them an advantage.  I pretty much live & die by EN these days.  And loyalty is one of my good traits.  I am not one to jump ship b/c something newer, shiner, cheaper comes along...unless the original gives me a reason to.  I *do* think competition is good & at this point, I've not yet seen anything I thought was a true competitor of EN.  If Google Keep evolves into that, then I'd guess that is a good thing.  But as you say, from your own experiences, it seems like Google is not really in some areas for the long haul. 

Share this post


Link to post

Well Keep's in its infancy.

Remember the first year of Evernote? I do.

Anyway I have hope for Keep, that it'll integrate many of its apps (contacts, maps, places, G+, Tasks, hierarchic note/notebook structure via Drive, shopper etc), creating strong Project managing capabilities as well as an interactive multimedia app...sorta like Springpad only hopefully better hopefully.

This is beyond the scope of Evernote I know, but no one but google could pull element like this together and make it work.

I like Evernote but really excited for Keep

Share this post


Link to post

But, the thing is that Keep is NOT in its infancy. Google had Notebooks (I loved that app when it came out), they abandoned it a few years later, and then finally put it out of its misery a while after that. I got myself out while it was on life support, but I was pretty annoyed that I had invested so much time in it.

Evernote actually came out AFTER Notebook. It is Google that had a head start (sorry, but I have to disagree with you here BNF), and it is Google that is playing catchup now (they are still far behind where they were in 2006 with Notebook). I won't kick around poor old Keep here, I wish them luck with it, and I think you can tell that the developers put some TLC into it. However, it is pretty clear to me (at least), that Google is not the place to put the stuff I want to "keep" (I could talk at length about my poor experiences with Gmail and Gdrive).

Google is a fantastic place for my browser, searching, and some other things, though. Maybe they'll turn Keep into something cool. I'll keep an eye on it. As the OP said, though, I'd think twice about moving from Evernote (or any notekeeping service) to it.

Share this post


Link to post

Another comparison (possibly unfair) -- Google Tasks is great for lightweight task management (I use it -- it's about my speed :)), but it doesn't come close to anything like a full-bore task management system. It's been around for years, and just hasn't progressed all that far. I'll make a judgment about whether Keep is worth worrying about when it actually starts being in the same ballpark as Evernote. At the moment, it's not even close.

Share this post


Link to post

Remember the first year of Evernote? I do.

 

Yes. I participated in the beta in April 2008.

Some of us used the pre cloud version. (I was using it in 2007, it was years older than that).

 

Google Keep does not appear to be a serious product intended to compete with Evernote- it's far too simple.  It's maybe intended to compete with Apple's build in iphone note apps rather than Evernote?

 

I played with it briefly, there's no tagging or anything like that, as far as I can tell.  Maybe Google intends to build it up, who knows, but right now it doesn't seem Evernote has anything to worry about yet and its mostly just journalists making the comparison to make their story more exciting.  

 

That said, I always thought Evernote was lucky that Google Notebook was shut down. (I guess Dropbox was lucky they decided to cance Google Drive before later changing their mind).  

Share this post


Link to post

Remember the first year of Evernote? I do.

Yes. I participated in the beta in April 2008.

Some of us used the pre cloud version. (I was using it in 2007, it was years older than that).
I know that. But the reality is that Windows only pay ware is a different animal from the Evernote cloud service of today. Comparing apples to oranges. Not to mention that horrid tape view. ;-)

Share this post


Link to post

 

Remember the first year of Evernote? I do.

 

Yes. I participated in the beta in April 2008.

Some of us used the pre cloud version. (I was using it in 2007, it was years older than that).

 

Google Keep does not appear to be a serious product intended to compete with Evernote- it's far too simple.  It's maybe intended to compete with Apple's build in iphone note apps rather than Evernote?

 

I played with it briefly, there's no tagging or anything like that, as far as I can tell.  Maybe Google intends to build it up, who knows, but right now it doesn't seem Evernote has anything to worry about yet and its mostly just journalists making the comparison to make their story more exciting.  

 

That said, I always thought Evernote was lucky that Google Notebook was shut down. (I guess Dropbox was lucky they decided to cance Google Drive before later changing their mind).  

 

All wrong on the original Evernote beta.

 

I started using Evernote way back in October 2004 when the very first beta version was offered for public testing. It was not a web app back then - I don't think there were many of those, if any, at that point in Internet history. I was a big fan of Evernote then.
 
However when the official release was made and payment was required I decided to stop using Evernote. The initial price for beta testers was kind of high IMO. I remember there was an email sent out by the "Evernote Powers That Be" stating that Evernote's primary market would be tablet users who needed the ability to enter handwritten notes and have them recognized as text; thus the pricing was a bit high. Since I didn't fall into that demographic I sadly ended my relationship with Evernote. However it wasn't long before the price dropped - probably a promotional discount that was lower than the original offering to beta testers - and so I jumped on it. I have been an Evernote user ever since!
 
Jim

Share this post


Link to post

Just thought I would post this original Evernote release announcement.

 

Jim

 

EverNote 1.0 beta for Windows
Sunnyvale, CA – Oct. 20, 2004 – EverNote Corporation today announced the release of EverNote 1.0 beta for Windows, an easy to use, yet powerful note-taking solution. EverNote gives users a single place for all types of notes and information and makes them instantly accessible at any time, in any place.
With EverNote, users can now capture and instantly find: typed or handwritten memos; excerpts from Web pages, documents and emails; passwords, phone messages, to do’s; brainstorms, sketches, camera phone snapshots of documents and more.
EverNote innovates by storing content on an endless, virtual, time-stamped roll of paper. With this approach, users can quickly jump to any date and scroll chronologically through their notes, without having to open them individually. This release will be followed by upcoming client versions for smartphones, camera phones and PDAs with synchronization over the Internet.
“Having all of my notes available when I am at home, in my office, on the airplane or in a restaurant has always been a dream of mine," said Dr. Stepan Pachikov, CEO and President of EverNote Corp. “With this EverNote release, I am excited to bring our vision for a complete note management solution to market – and this is just the beginning.”

EverNote Corp. was selected last month out of 250 companies to present EverNote 1.0 at DEMOmobile. Since its introduction, the product has garnered much industry interest, with thousands of visitors to the EverNote Web site already registering to receive the upcoming release.

Key features:
• Multiple note formats: Text, Web, email, handwriting, image clips and digital snapshots. • Powerful SmartSearch: Multiple methods for finding notes: visually, by time, categories, automatic labeling and keywords, complete with matching note count.
• Intelligent, multiple categories: Assigns multiple categories to notes automatically or manually, using drag and drop for easy organization and retrieval.
•Advanced handwriting recognition: Recognizes and searches through handwritten notes. Automatically perfects freehand shapes and charts. Recognizes handwritten page layouts and formatting. • To do’s and other note templates: Allows users to easily enter and monitor to do lists, expenses and other common note templates.
• Intuitive UI: All notes placed on an endless, virtual roll of paper.

 
Availability
A free version of the EverNote beta for Windows is available at www.evernote.com.
A commercial launch of EverNote with device synchronization over the Internet and smartphone support is planned for 1Q2005, with a number of additional features. Other OS and hardware platform support is scheduled for 2005.

Share this post


Link to post

Just thought I would post this original Evernote release announcement.

 

Jim

 

 

EverNote 1.0 beta for Windows
Sunnyvale, CA – Oct. 20, 2004 – EverNote Corporation today announced the release of EverNote 1.0 beta for Windows, an easy to use, yet powerful note-taking solution. EverNote gives users a single place for all types of notes and information and makes them instantly accessible at any time, in any place.

With EverNote, users can now capture and instantly find: typed or handwritten memos; excerpts from Web pages, documents and emails; passwords, phone messages, to do’s; brainstorms, sketches, camera phone snapshots of documents and more.

EverNote innovates by storing content on an endless, virtual, time-stamped roll of paper. With this approach, users can quickly jump to any date and scroll chronologically through their notes, without having to open them individually. This release will be followed by upcoming client versions for smartphones, camera phones and PDAs with synchronization over the Internet.

“Having all of my notes available when I am at home, in my office, on the airplane or in a restaurant has always been a dream of mine," said Dr. Stepan Pachikov, CEO and President of EverNote Corp. “With this EverNote release, I am excited to bring our vision for a complete note management solution to market – and this is just the beginning.”

EverNote Corp. was selected last month out of 250 companies to present EverNote 1.0 at DEMOmobile. Since its introduction, the product has garnered much industry interest, with thousands of visitors to the EverNote Web site already registering to receive the upcoming release.

Key features:

• Multiple note formats: Text, Web, email, handwriting, image clips and digital snapshots. • Powerful SmartSearch: Multiple methods for finding notes: visually, by time, categories, automatic labeling and keywords, complete with matching note count.

• Intelligent, multiple categories: Assigns multiple categories to notes automatically or manually, using drag and drop for easy organization and retrieval.

•Advanced handwriting recognition: Recognizes and searches through handwritten notes. Automatically perfects freehand shapes and charts. Recognizes handwritten page layouts and formatting. • To do’s and other note templates: Allows users to easily enter and monitor to do lists, expenses and other common note templates.

• Intuitive UI: All notes placed on an endless, virtual roll of paper.

 

Availability

A free version of the EverNote beta for Windows is available at www.evernote.com.

A commercial launch of EverNote with device synchronization over the Internet and smartphone support is planned for 1Q2005, with a number of additional features. Other OS and hardware platform support is scheduled for 2005.

 

 

That's pretty cool. Thanks!

Share this post


Link to post

All wrong on the original Evernote beta.

 

I started using Evernote way back in October 2004 when the very first beta version was offered for public testing. It was not a web app back then - I don't think there were many of those, if any, at that point in Internet history. I was a big fan of Evernote then.

 

However when the official release was made and payment was required I decided to stop using Evernote. The initial price for beta testers was kind of high IMO. I remember there was an email sent out by the "Evernote Powers That Be" stating that Evernote's primary market would be tablet users who needed the ability to enter handwritten notes and have them recognized as text; thus the pricing was a bit high. Since I didn't fall into that demographic I sadly ended my relationship with Evernote. However it wasn't long before the price dropped - probably a promotional discount that was lower than the original offering to beta testers - and so I jumped on it. I have been an Evernote user ever since!

 

Jim

 

 I'm not sure what you're thinking is "all wrong". 

 

 

 

Remember the first year of Evernote? I do.

Yes. I participated in the beta in April 2008.

 

Some of us used the pre cloud version. (I was using it in 2007, it was years older than that).

 

I know that. But the reality is that Windows only pay ware is a different animal from the Evernote cloud service of today. Comparing apples to oranges. Not to mention that horrid tape view. ;-)

Share this post


Link to post

I'd like to prefer Evernote, but I don't. 

 

 

The pro of Evernote, as the original post says, it's that I have the software on the computer.

The cons of Evernote though:

 

1) it's heavier than Google keep, even the widget on the phone is slower.

2) it saves the photos you take in the gallery, which is a complete non sequitur in my opinion. If I wanted to use a photo for my notes I'd take the photo and then add it into the note, but the way it is configured, every time I have to take the note and then go and delete the photo from the gallery. Pain in the ass 10/10.

3) audio notes are better on Google keep. They start immediately whereas Evernote has a little gap and the aesthetic of the player on Evernote seems to come from the 80s.

 

I say that because I hope to use a better version of Evernote.

Share this post


Link to post

I'd like to prefer Evernote, but I don't. 

 

 

The pro of Evernote, as the original post says, it's that I have the software on the computer.

The cons of Evernote though:

 

1) it's heavier than Google keep, even the widget on the phone is slower.

2) it saves the photos you take in the gallery, which is a complete non sequitur in my opinion. If I wanted to use a photo for my notes I'd take the photo and then add it into the note, but the way it is configured, every time I have to take the note and then go and delete the photo from the gallery. Pain in the ass 10/10.

3) audio notes are better on Google keep. They start immediately whereas Evernote has a little gap and the aesthetic of the player on Evernote seems to come from the 80s.

 

I say that because I hope to use a better version of Evernote.

With respect to #2, if you make a photo note and the sync fails or the note is bungled, you'll be very happy that that image still exists on your phone's storage so you can easily recreate the note! 

Also, in iOS, you can turn this behaviour OFF so that photos taken in Evernote are NOT saved to the camera roll. Some day that may appear in Android too...?

Share this post


Link to post

 

I'd like to prefer Evernote, but I don't. 

 

 

The pro of Evernote, as the original post says, it's that I have the software on the computer.

The cons of Evernote though:

 

1) it's heavier than Google keep, even the widget on the phone is slower.

2) it saves the photos you take in the gallery, which is a complete non sequitur in my opinion. If I wanted to use a photo for my notes I'd take the photo and then add it into the note, but the way it is configured, every time I have to take the note and then go and delete the photo from the gallery. Pain in the ass 10/10.

3) audio notes are better on Google keep. They start immediately whereas Evernote has a little gap and the aesthetic of the player on Evernote seems to come from the 80s.

 

I say that because I hope to use a better version of Evernote.

With respect to #2, if you make a photo note and the sync fails or the note is bungled, you'll be very happy that that image still exists on your phone's storage so you can easily recreate the note! 

Also, in iOS, you can turn this behaviour OFF so that photos taken in Evernote are NOT saved to the camera roll. Some day that may appear in Android too...?

 

 

Thank you for your response. 

 

Hopefully this option will be available on Android too, but I disagree with the sync problem. If I take a note on Google keep while there is no internet at all, the photo is still saved (I don't know where) and when the internet connection is established it synchronizes it automatically, without messing with my gallery. It'd be easy, I suppose, to just save the photos in an hidden folder.  

Share this post


Link to post

Evernote's no different in that respect, but there have been RARE cases of notes being "lost" when sync gets screwed up. In that case having a secondary source (if temporary) for that image to recreate the note isn't so bad. 

 

 

But yes, regardless of any of that, the OPTION for android users would be very nice indeed.

Share this post


Link to post

These are the points I'm raising around the web

 

1) Evernote is here for the long haul - can we say the same for any Google Product?

2) Evernote desktop allows offline copies on the hard drive (YOU own the data) - is this true of Google Keep?

3) Keep all your eggs in one (cloud) basket? Is that ever a good idea? 

4) If your internet is down - can you still access your data - with EverNote? ... yes we can.

 

I, too, painfully recall Google cutting the cord on Notebook and Reader. Apart from Gmail, my approach to Google products is that of DeNiro's character in Heat:

"Don't let yourself get attached to anything you are not willing to walk out on in 30 seconds flat if you feel the heat around the corner." 

 

Not allowing for local-only storage (for at least some user data) is a fatal flaw in my opinion, in an era of relentless hacking, widespread government surveillance, etc.

 

Dependency on online access to get data is another weakness. Governments have tried to cut off internet access before and even the US is working on an internet 'kill switch' - given how long after the fact we discover their capabilities, I would hardly be surprised if they already have the ability to make the internet go dark in this country within hours or even minutes.

Share this post


Link to post

 

These are the points I'm raising around the web

 

1) Evernote is here for the long haul - can we say the same for any Google Product?

2) Evernote desktop allows offline copies on the hard drive (YOU own the data) - is this true of Google Keep?

3) Keep all your eggs in one (cloud) basket? Is that ever a good idea? 

4) If your internet is down - can you still access your data - with EverNote? ... yes we can.

 

I, too, painfully recall Google cutting the cord on Notebook and Reader. Apart from Gmail, my approach to Google products is that of DeNiro's character in Heat:

"Don't let yourself get attached to anything you are not willing to walk out on in 30 seconds flat if you feel the heat around the corner." 

 

Not allowing for local-only storage (for at least some user data) is a fatal flaw in my opinion, in an era of relentless hacking, widespread government surveillance, etc.

 

Dependency on online access to get data is another weakness. Governments have tried to cut off internet access before and even the US is working on an internet 'kill switch' - given how long after the fact we discover their capabilities, I would hardly be surprised if they already have the ability to make the internet go dark in this country within hours or even minutes.

 

 

I have made similar comments about Google Notebooks and Google Keep, though not with the wonderful line from **Heat**!

 

I'd also like to add (or reiterate) that Keep is something like a bicycle compared to a luxury vehicle. Sure, they both get you from point A to point B, and they are both modes of transportation that share similar features (tires, brakes, and gears), but that is where the comparison ends. Yes, it is faster to get on your bike and go down the street to your friend's house, but these are very limited, simple use cases. Evernote has a bunch of stuff, so it will be a bit slower than basic apps like Keep, but it can also handle tens of thousands of notes across every major platform with offline access. Wow. That is no small feat. Plus, you don't have to worry about Evernote mining your data.

 

For users that need speed, make sure to check out Evernote's third-party integrations. For example, I've found Fastever to be a great experience.

https://appcenter.evernote.com/

Share this post


Link to post

Let me say a couple of things in defense of Keep - I use both Keep and Evernote, mostly on Android, but also on OS X.

 

First, Keep works offline just fine on Android. All notes are stored locally. For free.

 

Second, as GrumpyMonkey points out, Keep doesn't try to do as much as Evernote. I think of it as Google's better version of Notes on IOS, but for Android. It is a more capable note taker, not a less capable version of Evernote.

 

Third, what Keep does that overlaps with Evernote, it often does better. In particular, for taking quick notes, Keep doesn't require a separate title line, or have separate view and edit modes, or get confused about fonts or any of the other annoyances I often see when using Evernote on Android. And Keep allows you to have draggable check box items inside a note, a feature I would love to have in Evernote. And unlike Evernote, Keep lets you manually order your notes by dragging.

 

Fourth, there are few if any third party integrations for Evernote on Android. You pretty much have to use Evernote as it is.

 

Fifth, while Keep is really an Android app, there is an online version that works anywhere a web browser does. So I can use Keep on OS X or Windows just fine, though it is pretty impractical on an iPad or iPhone. 

 

My point isn't that everyone should switch to Keep. It has no web clipping, or notebooks, and you can't email a document to it. But don't underestimate it, either. It is very good at what it does, which is taking notes. 

Share this post


Link to post

Re the Android app thing: here's the Evernote 3rd-party app area: https://appcenter.evernote.com/platform/android. I'm pretty much an Evernote purist, so I can't vouch for any of these.

 

Also, services like IFTTT and Napier are ways of getting content into any Evernote client, and triggering off of changes.

 

Evernote of course has a web-only version and has for a long time.

 

If I was unhappy with Evernote, I'd probably look more closely at Keep.

Share this post


Link to post

Let me say a couple of things in defense of Keep - I use both Keep and Evernote, mostly on Android, but also on OS X.

 

First, Keep works offline just fine on Android. All notes are stored locally. For free.

 

Second, as GrumpyMonkey points out, Keep doesn't try to do as much as Evernote. I think of it as Google's better version of Notes on IOS, but for Android. It is a more capable note taker, not a less capable version of Evernote.

 

Third, what Keep does that overlaps with Evernote, it often does better. In particular, for taking quick notes, Keep doesn't require a separate title line, or have separate view and edit modes, or get confused about fonts or any of the other annoyances I often see when using Evernote on Android. And Keep allows you to have draggable check box items inside a note, a feature I would love to have in Evernote. And unlike Evernote, Keep lets you manually order your notes by dragging.

 

Fourth, there are few if any third party integrations for Evernote on Android. You pretty much have to use Evernote as it is.

 

Fifth, while Keep is really an Android app, there is an online version that works anywhere a web browser does. So I can use Keep on OS X or Windows just fine, though it is pretty impractical on an iPad or iPhone. 

 

My point isn't that everyone should switch to Keep. It has no web clipping, or notebooks, and you can't email a document to it. But don't underestimate it, either. It is very good at what it does, which is taking notes. 

 

Great points! Thanks for making them. 

Share this post


Link to post

×
×
  • Create New...