Personal finance control into Evernote. Suggestion: Set-up new specific labels for this matter "Financial Label" or "Budget Label"

[gustavo zimmermann sachser 0]

Hello Evernote Development Team and General Feature Requests Forum users,

 

I had been using Evernote since 2014. It is a fantastic tool for personal organisation (passcodes, tips, trips, movies, .... and so on).

However I tried already different ways to control my personal finance data (budget, month budget, annual budget bills, taxes, investiments, ...)

I saw one example of template at Evernote Trainning (see attached). But it is not ergonomic at my point of view.

In my opinion this kind of template should allow user to input data (like a restaurant bill or hotel bill) in few seconds... Taking a photo or via print screen. After store this bill (by PDF) the user classify the kind of payment (travel, house, car, maintenance, taxes, ... and so on).

Moreover, I think that this template should have a specific list of accounting classes (e.g.: tax, investiment, maintenance, travel, house, cinema, market, car, restaurant, .... ) that each user could set-up... and after some monhts adding the bills, this template would show-up, easily the expenses stratification. It could sum-up by % of each account class.

Could you help-me to find-out some PERSONAL FINANCE CONTROL template?

I am sure that it exists.

I repeat. I tried to do this control n time via Excel Spreashhets but the bottlenek is the procedure of inserting data. I mean, the bills were not added at the Excel Spreadscheet.

Evernote is very easy to use, you are at the hotel reception,... you receive the hotel bill... and you can add this bill n few seconds to Evernote (by taking photo, by adding it already in PDF file).

My difficulty is to sum-up after several months the amount of each expense class.

 

I put the question above at Evernote Forum. I got some answers that propose specif finantial apps as defenitive solution.

Some users responded to me that Evernote does not have maths functions... however has hiper powerfull tools (e.g. OCR based on photos).

 

CONCLUSION: I noticed that there are other users there are looking for easy and EFFICIENT ways to control their budget.

I would like to suggest to Evernote to setup specific labels to Buget/Finantial purposes. For instance, the name of this label coudl be: "Finantial Label".

So the user setup the "Finantial Labels" following his finantial accounting labels (everyone has his own way to estratify the expenses and eveone is correct):

  - Transportation: Uber
  - Transportation: Car
  - Transportation: Airline tikets
  - Food: Restaurant
  - Food: Supermarket
  - Entertainement: Travel
  - Entertainement: Streaming
  - Investiment: stock market
  - Investiment: Private pension
  - House: Rent 
  - House: Internet bill
  - House: Electricity bill
  - House: Water bill
  - House: Electricity bill
  - Clothes
  - Laundry
  - Petshop
  - Tax: income tax
  - Tax: car
  - Tax: house
  - Tax: boat
  - Bank loan
  - Bank Fees
  - ...

So whenever the user pay something... he would take a picture or via WebClipper add the PDF at Evernote.... At this time the user would set-up the "Finantial Label" and the value accordingly.

I am not asking to Evernote gather that appears on the bill automatically. This would be so difficult because each country has its specifi standards of bills.

My suggestion is that Evernote open automatically, at the bottom of the screen (for instance...) the field "total amount $": _____,__
So the user type it, for instance 55.00.

So Evernote could sum-up all the "Finantial Labels" showing an report: Date from : _____    Date to: ______
To generate the financial report to the user.

I do know that there are several financial apps on the market. 
But these kind of apps do not have the ergonomics that Evernote has.
I am sure that a lot of users that tried to use "boring and non-ergonimic" budget app / finantial app would love to have their buget control also in Evernote.

So this is my suggetion to Evernote. In my opinon it would be used for several users around the World.
I repeat. The "Save money" template that Evernote suggest to Financial control (see attached) is not efficient.

 

Best regards,
Gustavo Zimmermann Sachser

 ps.
orry about my english. I am writing from Brazil. I am graduated in Mechanical Engineering, I worked to automobile industry for 20 years. I used to negotiate with supplier around the world in english and french. I lived in France also... however my english is "getting older" without daily pratice 😬. I quit automobile industry in 2016.

SaveMoney__Template__MonthlyBasis.pdf

[AlbertR 689]

I use EN for personal organisation including finance data - but I would never expect a specialized information gathering and management tool (like EN) to control calculations...

 

My workflow is (simplified) as following:

• gather information all around the day
  • most often by scanning documents
  • or making photos on mobile
  • or clipping from screen
• rework new notes every evening
  • adjust titles of new notes
  • comment attachments (scans, photos, clips) in note text
  • add tags to define further steps [1] and|or classify note content [2]
  • add a first reminder date
  • move to destination notebooks
• rework notes depending on next steps or classification if you have more time
  • i.e. merge new notes with others (depending on your workflow)
  • extract financial information and copy it to simple Excel sheets [3]
  • rework tags to reflect your findings or decisions
• Use Saved Searches to keep track of next steps and projects
  • Every search presents a result list of notes that can be sorted easily by reminder times or tags...

Three steps are important and refer to your needs:

• [1] tagging for next steps (workflow)
  • here I follow what has been described in Using tags to implement dynamic ToDo lists long time ago
  • many other EN users use tags with a special character in from of tag names to group tags
  • my workflow-related tags are (>... for when to do and _... for who has to do something)
• [2] tagging for note content
  • regarding financial needs, my "type"-tags are =offer, =invoice and =overview (beside some others...). Some examples:
    • "=invoice" together with ">1-to-pay" means that I have to pay something (by "reminder date")
    • "=invoice" without ">1-to-pay" means that payment is done (by "reminder done time")
    • "=overview" contains overview information on projects (i.e. links to other notes or ...)
• [3] ... simple Excel sheets attached to notes
  • there will never be a document management tool available that will cover calculation features of spreadsheet apps
  • but your calculation sheets are stored within you document management tool!

 

During all the years I work this way, I had no need for note templates. Templates are only useful to create a nice note outfit. But they cannot held any (even initial) tags! So if you rely on tags (and a well defined workflow to use them), you will never ask for templates 😉

 

[Sidekick to your job - sorry:] If you are a financial manager you cannot work without spreadsheets. If you have to teach others to use it, you have to keep it simple. If it is simple, even younger people will accept it 😁

[PinkElephant 8,723]

You can define everything yourself.

Maybe somebody with EN will do it one day for all users. But currently the way to go is to do it yourself.

Beside this I don‘t think it really makes sense natively in EN. EN lacks even basic math functions, which makes all number oriented data collection laborious to process, at best. A spreadsheet or a dedicated app is the better approach.

[gustavo zimmermann sachser 0]

37 minutos atrás, PinkElephant disse:

You can define everything yourself.

Maybe somebody with EN will do it one day for all users. But currently the way to go is to do it yourself.

Beside this I don‘t think it really makes sense natively in EN. EN lacks even basic math functions, which makes all number oriented data collection laborious to process, at best. A spreadsheet or a dedicated app is the better approach.

Thanks again for your prompt response. But the richness of this suggestion is precisely in serving millions of users who simply hate Excel. For example, I am the Financial Manager of a law firm. I have to teach lawyers basic functions because they come here at 23, 25 or 27 years old and they tell me they've never used Excel and don't like Excel. My suggestion for Evernote is dedicated to this type of user: the user who enjoys using personal organization systems (Evernote and OneNote) but hates very complicated applications such as spreadsheets full of formulas that they don't know how to use, or financial apps that they can't even use 1% of the available functions.

[DTLow 5,744]

19 hours ago, gustavo zimmermann sachser said:

personal organisation including finance data 

I've always stored financial transaction data (income/expense) along side my other personal data
I even use monthly transaction files from the bank to ensure every transaction is included    

>So the user setup the "Finantial Labels" following his finantial accounting labels

I use tags; Budget-aaaaaaaa with something similar to your set of names   
   
>My difficulty is to sum-up after several months the amount of each expense class....hates very complicated applications such as spreadsheets   

I enjoy using spreadsheets for my budget/expense reports   
It gives me freedom from the restrictions imposed by dedicated financial apps    
  
Back when Evernote supported integrated scripting, I used an Applescript to export my financial data to a spreadsheet

[gustavo zimmermann sachser 0]

36 minutos atrás, AlbertR disse:

I use EN for personal organisation including finance data - but I would never expect a specialized information gathering and management tool (like EN) to control calculations...

 

My workflow is (simplified) as following:

• gather information all around the day
  • most often by scanning documents
  • or making photos on mobile
  • or clipping from screen
• rework new notes every evening
  • adjust titles of new notes
  • comment attachments (scans, photos, clips) in note text
  • add tags to define further steps [1] and|or classify note content [2]
  • add a first reminder date
  • move to destination notebooks
• rework notes depending on next steps or classification if you have more time
  • i.e. merge new notes with others (depending on your workflow)
  • extract financial information and copy it to simple Excel sheets [3]
  • rework tags to reflect your findings or decisions
• Use Saved Searches to keep track of next steps and projects
  • Every search presents a result list of notes that can be sorted easily by reminder times or tags...

Three steps are important and refer to your needs:

• [1] tagging for next steps (workflow)
  • here I follow what has been described in Using tags to implement dynamic ToDo lists long time ago
  • many other EN users use tags with a special character in from of tag names to group tags
  • my workflow-related tags are (>... for when to do and _... for who has to do something)
• [2] tagging for note content
  • regarding financial needs, my "type"-tags are =offer, =invoice and =overview (beside some others...). Some examples:
    • "=invoice" together with ">1-to-pay" means that I have to pay something (by "reminder date")
    • "=invoice" without ">1-to-pay" means that payment is done (by "reminder done time")
    • "=overview" contains overview information on projects (i.e. links to other notes or ...)
• [3] ... simple Excel sheets attached to notes
  • there will never be a document management tool available that will cover calculation features of spreadsheet apps
  • but your calculation sheets are stored within you document management tool!

 

During all the years I work this way, I had no need for note templates. Templates are only useful to create a nice note outfit. But they cannot held any (even initial) tags! So if you rely on tags (and a well defined workflow to use them), you will never ask for templates 😉

 

[Sidekick to your job - sorry:] If you are a financial manager you cannot work without spreadsheets. If you have to teach others to use it, you have to keep it simple. If it is simple, even younger people will accept it 😁

Thank you for your complete answer. I will take a look in detail. Thank you so much!!!

I need to follow some trainning program/videos from Evernote to undertand how export Notes to Excel Spreadsheets. I am using Evernote since 2014 and I had never exported anithing to Excel. 

I can tell you that I use Excel everyday since I started to work. I use Excel at daily baisis since 1998 when I was trainee at Volvo.

Since 1998 ate Volvo I use Excel everyday in my work to manage database (at Industry it was inventory and MRP parameters at Citroën, Renault and New Holland) and I use Excel at weekkly basis, since 2016 at my Law Firm, to launch KPIs and some reports (wich ERP supplier did not develop yet).

 

Talking now about my suggestion wich concerns: PERSONAL BUDGET CONTROL INTO EVERNOTE: I tried several times to use Excel to budget control. However the spreadsheets were not up-date because it is no value add task to type data in spreadsheets. So it explains why I just abandoned to use Excel to my personal budget control. 

I cannot open a spreadsheet at the airport, for instance, to up-date it with 30 USD that I just spent in a sandwich + beer. It is non-ergonomic to open a spreadshhet at the mobile phone - it is a nightmare. If I pay this 30USD I new to imput it via photo, for example, into Evernote, and set-up de account label. I think the MAIN POINT here... is to do at daily basis, the up-date of your budget, if you leave it to "next monday" it will never be done... It explains why I think Evernote wolud be very heplfull to users because it is easy and ergonomic to up-date. Ii takes few secondes to add onte note. (e.g. 30USD; budget-label: fod: restaurant) followinf this example of the beer at the airport using my smartphone.

If it is not done right at the time of the expense... it will not be up-date never (and the bill disapear from my wallet....).

I do know that it is possible to up-date bank and credit card diretly from the internet banking to finance systems. Like Microsoft Money... But when you start to understand how it works and all the automatic tools inside... they change de systema features and you (at least me...) get bored and just abandon.

Using this Microsoft Money example.... Another software that is complete, with several features, but "almost impssosible" to work is the Microsoft Project. It explains why 99% of people does not use MS Project and construct manually their project/gant spreadsheets to follow their projetcts. 

This specific tools (like MS Money and MS Project) are perfect. But they are so difficult to use... you need to spent 200 hours in trainning sessions to be able to use 1% of functions. It explains why 99% use simple spreadsheets (in my point of view) instead of the specifc softwares.

This explains why I just suggested here at this forum Evernote as one possible tool to control finance/budget to THE PEOPLE WHO ALREADY TRIED FOR SEVERAL YEARS to control by Excel and just abandonned it.

 

I always repeat to I.T. guys:

• I WILL NOT USE EXCEL if I am paying some specif system licence at monthly ou anual basis:
  For instance, I just changed my ERP system (it is little Law Firm - just 11 employee...): MY GOAL IS to not use AT ALL Excel.
  We've discussed even (hot discussion) with some users who are EXCEL DEPENDENT to desinstall Excel form their Desktops... to avoid WASTE OF TIME, konwing taht they are "trying" to do somenthing manually that the ERP does automatically, via standard reports (using data that ALL user up-dated into the ERP).
   
• Excel could be affected by some malware (virus, ...) and suddenly you lose years of data. Managind int Excel you SHOULD control EVERYTHING by yourselve.
   
• Excel could be affected by some worng formula, or worng purge manipulation, If you input new formula with an error it will generat false information. If your bak-up it not turnning properly. 🤢
   
• Excel "accepts everything: talking about data insertion". I do known that you can work with "validation fields". However you can input 2 or 4 times the same data (it would accept). And I do konw that apps and specif softwares would advise (ther are duplicated data). I do konw that you can develop it into Excel (as I said I use Excel everyday IN MY JOB since 1998);
   
• Excel "accepts everything: talking about data purge". I do know that you can create some block cells. However it takes time and it is NON VALUE ADDED TASK. Knowing that you are using a buget tool. You are not an I.T. guy that is devellpoing a software.
   
• Excel is not ergonomic att all at smartphones. In my opinion... it something does not works at your cell phone it is not good. Nowadays you are doing everything at your smatphone, you can share with your smart tv.... and so on... It explains why I am trying to suggest to Evernote to devellop the bufget control into Evernote maigc app.
   
• If Excel is cool, if Excel is easy to use, if Excel is the solution for everything... Try to teach your wife to use it. Consider that your wife is a doctor, a lawyer, an artist, a personal trainner THAT NEVER USED Excel at their lives. If you acchive to convince them, your wife to use Excel to control her job. I will agree with you that Excel is the solution.

 

I repeat, at my Law Firm, at my work, we do not use Excel for 99% of reports (***). The reports are done and printed directly by the software. I pay 200USD/month to use my ERP system. We pay 500USD/month to use our GED (M-Files - from Finland).

So it is not intelligent to control my team tasks via Excel or Trello (even if I do know it is possible) know that my ERP does automatically;

So it is not intelligent to monitor documents by Excel spreasheets (even if I do konw if it is possible to do via Excel) if my GED M-Files does automatically;

So it is not intelligent to build documents by Excel spreasheets (even if I do konw if it is possible to do via Excel) if my GED M-Files does automatically and link them directly to DocuSing (contracts that my customers sign in 2s at their smartphones;

I repeat: In my opinon set-up Excel spreadsheets to do something that apps do automatically is a NON ADDED VALUE TASK.

We need to reduce NON VALUE ADDED TASKES from our lives. 

 

 

In my point of view... the app that undertand the users necessity and their difficulty...and develop something to solve it... this app will be used BY MILLIONS of users, even BILLIONS of users.

 

Thank you again for your complete answer. I will double check yout method.

 

Best regards,

Gustavo Zimmermann Sachser 

 

 

(***)

We are just using one spreadsheet wch is very very very specifc to pay dividends to my 3 partners (other 2 lawyers...) to split the dividends because ohterLaw Firms that uses the same system (around 6.000) does not follow their budget into the system.... Because 99,9% are doing it via Excel... so I cannot use the ERP because the lack of some parameters (linked to taxes and laws) that I am forced to do via Excel) because I am the only user (among 6.000 users) asking to the ERP supplier to develop into the system.

 

 

[agsteele 3,056]

If you are unable to use Office you have the option of a package such as Libre office which is an open source package but will read and create Excel sheets.

https://www.libreoffice.org/

[PinkElephant 8,723]

There are apps to grab expenses on the fly. I just do it while traveling, so I use an app developed by a guy who is traveling & blogging all the time. It’s called Trail Wallet, you can rapidly grab expenses, scan receipts, convert currency and compare to a budget.

To make sense out of it all it has some build in graphics. For deeper analysis, it exports into a csv file - which usually is then loaded into a spreadsheet. Be it Excel, Libre Office or in my case Apple Numbers.

There are other apps that will do better on being used day by day. The export to csv for analyzing with other apps is practically a standard these days.

If one likes Excel is another question. Nobody is forced to use it, and if security is a concern, OS and apps from Microsoft should be avoided, wherever possible. Not because they are necessarily insecure, but because they are used all over, making them the primary target for hackers.

[Martinoz 2]

On 25.04.2023 at 21:21, gustavo zimmermann sachser said:

Thank you for your complete answer. I will take a look in detail. Thank you so much!!!

I need to follow some trainning program/videos from Evernote to undertand how export Notes to Excel Spreadsheets. I am using Evernote since 2014 and I had never exported anithing to Excel. 

I can tell you that I use Excel everyday since I started to work. I use Excel at daily baisis since 1998 when I was trainee at Volvo.

Since 1998 ate Volvo I use Excel everyday in my work to manage database (at Industry it was inventory and MRP parameters at Citroën, Renault and New Holland) and I use Excel at weekkly basis, since 2016 at my Law Firm, to launch KPIs and some reports (wich ERP supplier did not develop yet).

 

Talking now about my suggestion wich concerns: PERSONAL BUDGET CONTROL INTO EVERNOTE: I tried several times to use Excel to budget control. However the spreadsheets were not up-date because it is no value add task to type data in spreadsheets. So it explains why I just abandoned to use Excel to my personal budget control. 

I cannot open a spreadsheet at the airport, for instance, to up-date it with 30 USD that I just spent in a sandwich + beer. It is non-ergonomic to open a spreadshhet at the mobile phone - it is a nightmare. If I pay this 30USD I new to imput it via photo, for example, into Evernote, and set-up de account label. I think the MAIN POINT here... is to do at daily basis, the up-date of your budget, if you leave it to "next monday" it will never be done... It explains why I think Evernote wolud be very heplfull to users because it is easy and ergonomic to up-date. Ii takes few secondes to add onte note. (e.g. 30USD; budget-label: fod: restaurant) followinf this example of the beer at the airport using my smartphone.

If it is not done right at the time of the expense... it will not be up-date never (and the bill disapear from my wallet....).

I do know that it is possible to up-date bank and credit card diretly from the internet banking to finance systems. Like Microsoft Money... But when you start to understand how it works and all the automatic tools inside... they change de systema features and you (at least me...) get bored and just abandon.

Using this Microsoft Money example.... Another software that is complete, with several features, but "almost impssosible" to work is the Microsoft Project. It explains why 99% of people does not use MS Project and construct manually their project/gant spreadsheets to follow their projetcts. 

This specific tools (like MS Money and MS Project) are perfect. But they are so difficult to use... you need to spent 200 hours in trainning sessions to be able to use 1% of functions. It explains why 99% use simple spreadsheets (in my point of view) instead of the specifc softwares.

This explains why I just suggested here at this forum Evernote as one possible tool to control finance/budget to THE PEOPLE WHO ALREADY TRIED FOR SEVERAL YEARS to control by Excel and just abandonned it.

 

I always repeat to I.T. guys:

• I WILL NOT USE EXCEL if I am paying some specif system licence at monthly ou anual basis:
  For instance, I just changed my ERP system (it is little Law Firm - just 11 employee...): MY GOAL IS to not use AT ALL Excel.
  We've discussed even (hot discussion) with some users who are EXCEL DEPENDENT to desinstall Excel form their Desktops... to avoid WASTE OF TIME, konwing taht they are "trying" to do somenthing manually that the ERP does automatically, via standard reports (using data that ALL user up-dated into the ERP).
   
• Excel could be affected by some malware (virus, ...) and suddenly you lose years of data. Managind int Excel you SHOULD control EVERYTHING by yourselve.
   
• Excel could be affected by some worng formula, or worng purge manipulation, If you input new formula with an error it will generat false information. If your bak-up it not turnning properly. 🤢
   
• Excel "accepts everything: talking about data insertion". I do known that you can work with "validation fields". However you can input 2 or 4 times the same data (it would accept). And I do konw that apps and specif softwares would advise (ther are duplicated data). I do konw that you can develop it into Excel (as I said I use Excel everyday IN MY JOB since 1998);
   
• Excel "accepts everything: talking about data purge". I do know that you can create some block cells. However it takes time and it is NON VALUE ADDED TASK. Knowing that you are using a buget tool. You are not an I.T. guy that is devellpoing a software.
   
• Excel is not ergonomic att all at smartphones. In my opinion... it something does not works at your cell phone it is not good. Nowadays you are doing everything at your smatphone, you can share with your smart tv.... and so on... It explains why I am trying to suggest to Evernote to devellop the bufget control into Evernote maigc app.
   
• If Excel is cool, if Excel is easy to use, if Excel is the solution for everything... Try to teach your wife to use it. Consider that your wife is a doctor, a lawyer, an artist, a personal trainner THAT NEVER USED Excel at their lives. If you acchive to convince them, your wife to use Excel to control her job. I will agree with you that Excel is the solution.

 

I repeat, at my Law Firm, at my work, we do not use Excel for 99% of reports (***). The reports are done and printed directly by the software. I pay 200USD/month to use my ERP system. We pay 500USD/month to use our GED (M-Files - from Finland).

So it is not intelligent to control my team tasks via Excel or Trello (even if I do know it is possible) know that my ERP does automatically;

So it is not intelligent to monitor documents by Excel spreasheets (even if I do konw if it is possible to do via Excel) if my GED M-Files does automatically;

So it is not intelligent to build documents by Excel spreasheets (even if I do konw if it is possible to do via Excel) if my GED M-Files does automatically and link them directly to DocuSing (contracts that my customers sign in 2s at their smartphones;

I repeat: In my opinon set-up Excel spreadsheets to do something that apps do automatically is a NON ADDED VALUE TASK.

We need to reduce NON VALUE ADDED TASKES from our lives. I recently delved into the finance section of Taftie.org and found a treasure trove of valuable resources this finance section covers a wide array of finance-related topics, including budgeting, investing, retirement planning, and more. With articles written by experts in the field, this finance section provides practical advice, insightful tips, and actionable strategies to help readers navigate their financial journey with confidence and success.

 

 

In my point of view... the app that undertand the users necessity and their difficulty...and develop something to solve it... this app will be used BY MILLIONS of users, even BILLIONS of users.

 

Thank you again for your complete answer. I will double check yout method.

 

Best regards,

Gustavo Zimmermann Sachser 

 

 

(***)

We are just using one spreadsheet wch is very very very specifc to pay dividends to my 3 partners (other 2 lawyers...) to split the dividends because ohterLaw Firms that uses the same system (around 6.000) does not follow their budget into the system.... Because 99,9% are doing it via Excel... so I cannot use the ERP because the lack of some parameters (linked to taxes and laws) that I am forced to do via Excel) because I am the only user (among 6.000 users) asking to the ERP supplier to develop into the system.

 

 

I agree with you, I too have been using Excel for decades for such calculations and it is the most convenient thing available today. 

[PinkElephant 8,723]

I would agree if you said „spreadsheet“. Excel is just a piece of bloated, paid software.

A free alternative is LibreOffice, for example.