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Evernote backlinks


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On 1/19/2023 at 11:44 AM, PinkElephant said:

As I understand it, the local search index of v10 is a virtual twin of the server search index. The index is created and maintained on the server. The clients receive an update.

Client copies are not complete - at least on mobile clients search does not cover attachments content, AFAIK.
If the index gets corrupted, it seems to be the only solution to replace the entire local database.

Isn't this a contadiction? If the index is calculated on server site and replicated to clients, it should cover the same data - or does the server hold two index tables (one complete and one for the mobiles)?

If the index gets corrupted - does it make sense to replace the entire local database? If a client replicates the server index, there should be internal mechanisms available to grant completeness on client site. And if any lacks are seen, a reload should be done in the background.

But @Scott T. explained that V10 runs a local index service (makes sense for performance reasons if net connectivity is poor and local computing power is high). It this case the index databases might hold different content (like in Legacy). Maybe we'll get back local notebooks and CTRL-Help in V10? 😉

PS (somewhat later): We already have CTRL-Help and a submenue "Problemlösung" ("Solve problems" in English UI?) 💥. Here you can find possibilities to start/stop activity traces, reload notes and log cpu and network load...

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  • Evernote Staff*

Again, I caveat this with not being an expert on search...

But basically, your local v10 client runs a lighter version of the server-based indexing service. It won't do any resource-intensive indexing like attachment processing (i.e. OCR), but it does do its own indexing and not just getting a copy from the server (though I believe this happens as well).

So as I noted, something like backlinks indexing can be implemented locally.

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  • 2 weeks later...

OK.  This has turned into a highly technical discussion which is probably beyond the paygrade for most of us.  In practical terms, I'll describe in a little more detail my "Itinerary" usage of this feature.  

I make itineraries of all of my trips.  I can turn each item of the itinerary into a hyperlink eg: "Car rental" now becomes a link to the car rental agency voucher.  In the past, I would often lose myself in the various links and then need to navigate back to that main "Itinerary" note or a related item on that list.  Now if I'm done examining the car rental voucher but want to go to the Hotel note I click the backlink and it takes me back to the itinerary.  I then hit the linked Hotel text which takes me to the note dealing with my hotel.  On that hotel note I linked to another note which has a special deal close to the hotel.  I can go to that deal through the link, then back to the original hotel note with backlinks, and then back to the itinerary through another backlink.  In essence, I now have a pathway around the various elements of my trip including a way to always come back to the "Home" page of that trip without being tripped up by the rest of my 8000 notes.  It's like finding a tiny room at the National Public Library where only your favorite books exist.

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What would be great enhancement to this new Backlinks feature is to have another drop-down list at the top each note (just like the Backlinks drop-down list), but this one would list all out going links from the note you are on... both internal links as well as links pointing to external sources. Evernote already shows the clip link up at the top, if the evernote was clipped from the web. That clip link could be part of this new "Outlinks" drop-down tab that I am suggesting.

Hopefully I described that in a way that makes sense.

And since I am already in "Wishlist" mode :) ... the next development I would love to see is to have some sort of visual or graphical representation page/interface that gives you a 30 thousand foot view of all the notes in your database and how they connect to each other. Obsidian does this really well with their dynamic representation of a neurally connected network... like having a digital 3rd brain where all the nodes are clickable (true bi-directional linking).

image.png

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1 hour ago, DougLietz said:

What would be great enhancement to this new Backlinks feature is to have another drop-down list at the top each note (just like the Backlinks drop-down list), but this one would list all out going links from the note you are on... both internal links as well as links pointing to external sources. Evernote already shows the clip link up at the top, if the evernote was clipped from the web. That clip link could be part of this new "Outlinks" drop-down tab that I am suggesting.

Hopefully I described that in a way that makes sense.

And since I am already in "Wishlist" mode :) ... the next development I would love to see is to have some sort of visual or graphical representation page/interface that gives you a 30 thousand foot view of all the notes in your database and how they connect to each other. Obsidian does this really well with their dynamic representation of a neurally connected network... like having a digital 3rd brain where all the nodes are clickable (true bi-directional linking).

Nice ideas, especially the first one, especially for a longer note. I guarantee you if I had the second one I would never get anything done beyond clicking around among all those note links. :D

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3 hours ago, DougLietz said:

What would be great enhancement to this new Backlinks feature is to have another drop-down list at the top each note (just like the Backlinks drop-down list), but this one would list all out going links from the note you are on

I like this idea.

 

3 hours ago, DougLietz said:

the next development I would love to see is to have some sort of visual or graphical representation page/interface that gives you a 30 thousand foot view of all the notes in your database and how they connect to each other. Obsidian does this really well

Is this actually useful or does it just make a pretty picture? I've seen these visual representations many times, and people gush about how cool they are (and they do look cool), but I've never seen someone actually demonstrate how they used it to accomplish something they couldn't do just as easily another way. I've also used software in the past which created similar graphs (network software, for example) and didn't find it very useful then, either.

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1 hour ago, Paul A. said:

I like this idea.

 

Is this actually useful or does it just make a pretty picture? I've seen these visual representations many times, and people gush about how cool they are (and they do look cool), but I've never seen someone actually demonstrate how they used it to accomplish something they couldn't do just as easily another way. I've also used software in the past which created similar graphs (network software, for example) and didn't find it very useful then, either.

That is a very "flat" image example of the neural network I showed. A tool like that provides a ton of useful functionality (imo). For example...

  • The size of the dots and linked clusters identify emphasis on topical areas that you may be researching... kind of like how word cluster infographics show what concepts or keywords are most important or most used. You can also use color coding of the notes to help you visually hone in on where you have the most amount of connections between notes. Then you can zoom in on the tool, and/or use filters, to upscale your node clusters. With zoomed in views, you can choose to have your note title text displayed below each dot, or maybe you just want to use the hover title display feature. When you find the note that you may be looking for, you can click to open it... or click to have a popup excerpt show... all the time being able to seamlessly back out to the neural network again, so you can continue on with your quest. Basically, this takes relational databases to a whole new level of functionality that goes way past just having a traditional keyword search tool. Not saying that this would replace keyword search, especially the Evernote search which is second to none.
  • Also, those mostly-single, un-linked dots around the outer perimeter of the the neural network, represent nodes that are for the most part orphaned ideas. As you revisit these notes over time, it can become apparent that certain ones should be linked into specific cluster that you are working on elsewhere in your database. You can simply drag then onto another node to form the link connection which would then automatically populate into those Backlink and Outlink dropdown box I suggested in my first wishlist entry.

I'm sure other members here could add some more use cases... would love to hear them!

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Mohio-Map did it …

Bubble Browser did it …

Maybe others did it, before. If you search for Mohiomap you find this in the EN Appcenter:

BF98C2B5-BDAA-4D46-BBEE-60A540B38F70.thumb.jpeg.53cbb6b311c26bf5897d2f123e3e0853.jpeg


and this if you try to contact the developer:

A8058005-43EF-4C2B-B0EF-1E897211D6A2.thumb.jpeg.1850c203e7abc85a469874f2d8638121.jpeg

Bubble Browser is similar, you can’t reach the dev, it didn’t get any new release in years, and trying crashed my MacBook Pro. Not the app, the whole Mac was brought down.

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So at least 2 developers tried to build a visual search, and both of them failed (at least economically).

There are possible conclusions, one is that it is now the time has come … the other is it is fascinating initially, but then users find out it does not really add enough value to buy.

I tend to the second explanation.

Why should EN themselves add a feature similar to others that already went belly up, at least twice ?

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9 minutes ago, PinkElephant said:

So at least 2 developers tried to build a visual search, and both of them failed (at least economically).

There are possible conclusions, one is that it is now the time has come … the other is it is fascinating initially, but then users find out it does not really add enough value to buy.

I tend to the second explanation.

Why should EN themselves add a feature similar to others that already went belly up, at least twice ?

Besides Roam and Obsidian doing well with their neural network functionality, another tool is TheBrain, which has been around since 2009.

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I think the math is pretty simple:

From all users, most are on Free. They are not able or willing to pay at all, so why should they pay for anything in addition ?

This leaves the much smaller group of paying users. Since EN is highly flexible in the supported use cases, this is a pretty mixed target group. You need a solid enough added value to make them open their purse.

And then - if it is an external service - you must be willing to grant full access to your personal cloud data, all of it. Otherwise the service will not work.

Personally I am pretty visual as well, and I loved these tools when they were still alive. Bubble Browser got killed by a MacOS update, Mohiomap simply folded and went offline. I think I have to accept they failed for a reason.

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