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Need way to force a synch


Patrick Holmes

Idea

I don't understand why Evernote removed the Synch icon, but it needs to be restored.  Users like me are wasting time trying to force a synch when we can clearly see changes on one computer that have not been synched to other devices. I WILL CONTINUE TO USE THE "EVERNOTE LEGACY" VERSION TO FORCE SYNCHS UNTIL EVERNOTE FIXES THIS DEFECT.

There are other threads on this topic, but some or all of them show "solved" but this is not solved until manual synching is restored. In the meantime, here is where you can find the Evernote Legacy version here:  https://help.evernote.com/hc/en-us/articles/360052560314-Install-an-older-version-of-Evernote

Here's hoping...

pat holmes

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I'm on two Macs and on Windows 10 Pro computer, and an iPhone. I don't see "sync", "synch", "manual synch" options anywhere. I'm on the latest version on all devices.

In the older (legacy) versions, it was at the top of the main window.  Where do you think it is now?  I just chatted with Evernote support, and this is what the support person told me in the chat:

The Manual sync button is not yet available on the new Evernote app. The new Evernote app automatically syncs across your devices.
We haven’t built this feature into the new Evernote app. This is one of a handful of  features we are still considering. Thanks for letting us know this feature is important to you. I will share this information with our product team.
In the meantime, the workaround that you might want to try is to go back to using the older version of Evernote, where the manual sync button is available. While we encourage everyone to give the new Evernote app a try, we recognize that there are some scenarios where using an older version is necessary or desired.
You can download the Evernote Legacy app by following the instructions in this Help & Learning article: Install an older version of Evernote (https://help.evernote.com/hc/articles/360052560314).

Note: I replied with this:

The new Evernote app does an inadequate job of automatically synching. Just about every day I have a problem where I can see changes on one device that have not yet synched on other devices. I have been using the Evernote Legacy version, but that's silly. Please tell your developers that any user who uses MORE THAN ONE DEVICE needs the manual synch option restored to the app.

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Desktop: Hold down the opt/alt key before clicking on Help. Choose Troubleshooting, select Reload from the submenu. Keyboard shortcut is ctrl/strg-R (on a Mac cmd-R).

For severe cases, there is Force Reload as well.

Mobile: App settings, Synchronisation, sync now. Or pull down the notes list with a finger, and let go.

All clients in general sync by themselves. On Desktop the sync status shows at the bottom right of the app window, in a grey text, easy to overlook. On mobile when there are notes that still need to sync, they show a green triangle in the notes list. This does not mean the sync is ongoing, it means they still need to sync.

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Ah, very interesting!  I had no idea about the secret troubleshooting menu on the desktop app!  So, will "Reload" also synch by sending changes up to the web server *BEFORE* reloading?  It would defeat the purpose of forcing a synch if it reloaded without first sending changes up to the web server.

(I will try to test that question, but because synch is automatic, I would have to test repeatedly to see if changes are lost or always synched. i.e. An automatic synch could happen just before my Reload, which would then invalidate my "does Reload ALWAYS synch first" test.)

pat

 

 

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re Mobile: I was doing pull-down, and had forgotten they had added "Sync now" back to the app. My wife and I share a note, and we just had another duplicate note issue which we probably could have avoided by forcing synchs manually. So, I'll keep that in mind.

re Reload: In the past, reload caused note changes to be lost, although that was also when my databases would get corrupted so it's hard to know if the reload lost the changes or if it was due to the DB corruption. (I've had to learn how to rebuild my local databases since the new version of the App was released...)  I'll just keep using the Evernote Legacy for synching when in a hurry, until the developers add a manual synch back to the desktop app.  Given that it has been nearly two years since they removed the feature, it's clearly not a high priority for them. 

Thanks for trying to help!

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Personally I doubt that Reload will cause a corruption. I had corrupted local data as well, not often, but it happened. Rebuilding it always worked, and Reload had nothing to do with it. In fact I hardly use it, no need.

To see what is going on just open Desktop client and web client side by side. It is amazing how fast changes sync to the server (just remember you need to refresh the browser as well to see them).

Actually the hyped legacy client has its depths as well. When v10 started, I had different note counts on practically all devices. I extensively use the database tools of the legacy clients - most of the differences were rooted in mistakes in the local legacy database. You usually just don’t see them because we trust the local database more than the server copy.

But in fact it is just the other way.

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No, I am not saying that "Reload" causes corruption.  What I'm saying is, when I've been prompted to reload, I've come to learn that means my local databases are corrupted.  What happens sometimes is:  a note hangs while loading, and after a while I am given the options to keep waiting or reload.  At that point, reload would of course "reload" and changes were lost, but they might have been lost already due to the corruption. (Now, if I have that problem again, I just automatically rebuild local databases.)

The problem I have is I use multiple devices. So getting the changes to go from Desktop to web server is only half of what's needed. Then I need to synch from web server to 2nd (or 3rd or 4th) device. So if I'm in a hurry, I get impatient waiting for the change to migrate from one device to another device. (For example, I might need to copy information from Mac to Windows. I could use email for that, and I sometimes do simply because I don't have time to wait for Evernote.) Now if I had a manual synch on the desktop, I would just press it once *one each device*. once on the first device to upload from first device to web server, then on the second device to download from web server.

Yes, I suspected that the web server is more robust than the local database. The first time I learned about it, the support person said he rebuilt my DB on the web server also. But since then I've only rebuilt the local DB once or twice (or more?) and each time my issue was resolved. 

pat

 

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I too went through the trouble of contacting Evernote about synch issues and I got the same message as Patrick Holmes.  It was only after PinkElephant helped me out (several months ago) that I discovered the secret.  Is there a reason why EN is not openly suggesting this option even though users are asking?  Is the Ctrl-R or Ctrl-Shift-R option just as good as pressing "Sync" on the Legacy client? I do not even see this shortcut on the EN Keyboard shortcuts help page.

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Maybe ask support why they don't recommend this option to users ...

Personally I found the Troubleshooting menu more or less by accident. I like the developer tools, sometimes it is interesting to take a look behind the scenes.

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I suppose that support will tell you that a manual sync is not, normally, necessary because Legacy and v10 sync in entirely different ways. The Ctrl+R method is only needed when things get stuck. Hence it is buried in the troubleshooting menu. You shouldn't need it. I've only used it once in anger. 

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8 hours ago, agsteele said:

I suppose that support will tell you that a manual sync is not, normally, necessary because Legacy and v10 sync in entirely different ways. The Ctrl+R method is only needed when things get stuck. Hence it is buried in the troubleshooting menu. You shouldn't need it. I've only used it once in anger. 

There are certain emails that I forward to EN but need to be absolutely sure that they entered correctly.  I've had the experience that some emails don't show up properly, so I like to see how they showed up.  I can't really feel comfortable about this kind of transfer unless I can sync a few times and verify that they came through OK.  There are many other times when I've used the sync between going from phone to PC to different PC etc.  

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I think you're saying you don't feel you can trust the sync to deliver. I guess you'll never be at ease with Evernote v10. The sync isn't, perhaps, sufficiently instant for you.

I'm more than happy to wait for a few moments while I get on with things. If I have any challenges, the mobile app is a tad slower to sync but nothing I can't live with ;)

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I’m really struggling with sync, I’m trying out a few other apps as I consider transitioning away (my year ends towards end of September) but I had three tasks in EN that I completed today. So on pc I tick them off, all good, I open the mobile app later, three tasks remain, I did some stuff, three tasks remain. I go to sync now in settings, it just keeps spinning. Finally after about 15 mins of trying to force a sync the three tasks show as completed. This isn’t new for tasks either. 
I just wish the app worked - EN is perfect for me in features but the sync is just bust, broken, it’s a real shame. 

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49 minutes ago, agsteele said:

I think you're saying you don't feel you can trust the sync to deliver. I guess you'll never be at ease with Evernote v10. The sync isn't, perhaps, sufficiently instant for you.

I'm more than happy to wait for a few moments while I get on with things. If I have any challenges, the mobile app is a tad slower to sync but nothing I can't live with ;)

It's not a matter of patience.  Here is an actual incident.  A few weeks ago I was at the office but leaving for the airport.   I brought up the boarding pass on Gmail and sent it via email to EN.  I sat staring at my v10 for a while but since it had not arrived I decided to just get going and check it later.  Sure enough, at the airport I noticed that the boarding pass had not transferred properly and was missing information.  In Legacy you can send an email and just press sync a few times until the email pops up in your inbox.  If it's missing some info you can deal with it better.  I deal with an iphone, an ipad and 2-3 PC's and I move around from home, office and mobile.  There are many times when I need to make absolutely sure that something that I just put into one device will appear properly in the other.  Granted, it usually does but if there is a glitch on my phone, my wifi etc the transition may not have occurred as expected.  Also, when I share a notebook with my employee it is very helpful for me to sync my version and then to ask her to synch hers.  In short, lots of reasons why people like the synch button.

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I fully agree the importance of a manual sync button. Furthermore, a sync button with the progression status and the way to configure the frequency for background sync is needed. It should also be prominently displayed!

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Since the sync button seems to be THE most important missing feature, I have designed one to make it easier for the EN devs.

Properties: Easy to find, not to be missed, even when in anger about something not syncing, prominently displayed. I think I have covered it all. It slightly reduces the available screen real estate for displaying information, but you can’t have it all, can you ?

 

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3 hours ago, idoc said:

It's not a matter of patience.  Here is an actual incident.  A few weeks ago I was at the office but leaving for the airport.   I brought up the boarding pass on Gmail and sent it via email to EN.  I sat staring at my v10 for a while but since it had not arrived I decided to just get going and check it later.  Sure enough, at the airport I noticed that the boarding pass had not transferred properly and was missing information.  In Legacy you can send an email and just press sync a few times until the email pops up in your inbox.  If it's missing some info you can deal with it better.  I deal with an iphone, an ipad and 2-3 PC's and I move around from home, office and mobile.  There are many times when I need to make absolutely sure that something that I just put into one device will appear properly in the other.  Granted, it usually does but if there is a glitch on my phone, my wifi etc the transition may not have occurred as expected.  Also, when I share a notebook with my employee it is very helpful for me to sync my version and then to ask her to synch hers.  In short, lots of reasons why people like the synch button.

I've forced a sync any number of times on the old Evernote v. 6 for Windows (where it is practically mandatory), and many times on Evernote for Android (still the old version there too), often for just the reasons you cite. I've never had to do it with v. 10 on my Windows laptop--unless I was in a real hurry to get something to show up there from my phone or other computer.

However, there have been enough situations like the airport one reported in these forums, in which actual damage was done by a sync failure (one could ask for details about what device the Gmail was sent from and how quickly it was turned off on the way out the door, but that's not necessary)--enough such situations reported that there is a clear risk. We hear that Evernote is working on an improved syncing process, and I'm looking forward to it. But truthfully I think most (not all, but most) of the times that we feel the need to force a sync in Evernote 10 are due to being in a hurry or wanting to be absolutely, 1,000% certain of syncing. And those are our internal processes, not Evernote's.

And that is exactly the reason why Evernote should quickly implement some sort of easily accessed manual sync. (Was there ever actually a button in the Android app?) The customer, however fidgety, impatient, or over-anxious, is always right. At any rate, they are always the customer, and a little psychological pacification, even a little placebo effect, does no harm. Even if the button didn't actually do anything it would probably serve a purpose. Even if its main reason to exist were to give the user something to do that would occupy the .7395 seconds while the automatic sync took place, so that they could say, "There! That's done it!", it would be company resources will spent. Belt, suspenders, and blackout underwear, I say.

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OK, here's something weird.  I try to synch EN on my iphone and the icon just spins endlessly and never stops.  So I go to my PC desktop v10 and create a test note.  Less than 1 minute later I see the note appear in my phone even though the synch icon is still spinning like a dervish.  I then close EN on the iphone,  re-open and synch again.  Instantly I see a "sync complete".   This means that it was working perfectly well but the synch button was not willing to produce the much beloved "synch complete" without refreshing the program.

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It may have been stuck - probably only the UI, not the sync in itself.

To know if there was any activity, you need a network traffic viewer, an independent app. Not sure if we as users should enter that deep into the syncing rabbit hole.

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To All

I have been having similar issues with the iPhone client.  I have over 10k notes and switch between an iPad, iPhone plus multiple computers.   I have been frustrated since I write long notes, sync doesn’t finish after waiting 15 minutes then I lose the text if I my iPhone goes into sleep mode or lock the screen.   I love EN but the syncing issue is troubling.   I have ended up taking screen shots if the text the retyping it later.   If anyone has a solution for the iPhone app, that would be great.    
 

i have contacted support and reinstalled my EN. Next is wiping my phone, but that may be overkill.

Thanks 

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The only thing that has worked reliably for me on my iphone is to swipe the EN app upwards (thus closing it) and then to re-open it and resynch.   I've noticed that the iphone often indicates that it is still synching even when it has finished.  Yesterday the iphone EN kept indicating that it was synching but upon comparing the iphone and the EN web I found that everything I had put into the iphone EN had shown up perfectly on the EN web despite the endlessly spinning synch icon.  Upon closing and re-starting the app, the synch completed within a few seconds.   Bottom line is that overall synch is working on all the platforms but it is not yet absolutely seamless.

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Thanks for this info about the "Secret" trouble shooting menu, which by the way seems like a really really mean thing to do. But please help me----where is this "help" menu to which you refer? I can't find it in the desktop app or on the web evernote.

And how does one "open a support ticket"? As far as I can tell, there's no way to get support with Evernote except from forum folks. 

Thanks much..

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On 9/16/2022 at 8:23 AM, Bonnie Hayes said:

Thanks for this info about the "Secret" trouble shooting menu, which by the way seems like a really really mean thing to do. But please help me----where is this "help" menu to which you refer? I can't find it in the desktop app or on the web evernote.

In the desktop client, you have a menu bar. In Windows on top of the app windows, on a Mac on top of the screen, to the left.

The help menu is in both cases the rightmost menu of all dropdown menus, and it is named „Help“ or the translated equivalent.

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