Thoughts of a v. 10 skeptic/convert

[Dave-in-Decatur 3,958]

Loooong post here; grab a beverage, or just skip it.

Like many, when Evernote v. 10 for Windows first came out (I can't speak to Mac issues), I was appalled at the loss of features as compared with the existing v. 6, with the decision to release such a subpar product in that condition, and with the lack of communication about the whole process. Since then, I've continued using the legacy v. 6 on a Windows 7 computer. But I began using the v. 10 Web client on occasion for specific purposes, esp. being able to edit HTML text imported from the Web. That one function was a game changer for me, and I began to see other advantages too, such as greater control over text highlighting and standardized headers.

I have a Windows 10 laptop, and I've been using the Web client as my only Evernote on it for some time, growing more and more comfortable with what it can do, and accepting its limitations. So this week I finally downloaded the v. 10 app (from Evernote, not the ☠️ Windows Store). The speed with which my notes became available astonished me, and I've begun using it in earnest. (I can't install it on the Win7 desktop, of course, which is still my main computer.) At the same time, I upgraded my account from Personal to Professional; whether that's worth the money is a separate discussion which I'd rather not get into here. I wanted to reflect a bit on the experience, and invite comment from others who have switched over to v. 10 or are still using v. 6, or have left EN for a different program. No judgement either way!

One issue is the general differences in the new UI. Frankly, I consider discussion of that a dead end. It's just a matter of getting used to a new UI, as one would have to do with a different program--and as one did when first starting to use the "old" Evernote. Where to put something in a UI is an extremely subjective choice, and the decisions will always make more sense to some than to others. I did like the greater control over which parts of the UI were visible and over the toolbars in v. 6, but for me, it's not a deal-breaker.

To keep things organized, I put together this table of what was lost between v. 6 and v. 10, including what's come back and what hasn't. It's probably not complete. X = still missing, O = OK in v. 10.37.

	Issue	X/O
1	Presentation mode, ScanSnap, Outlook Clipper	X
2	Local (unsynced) notebooks	X
3	Spell check	X (already gone in v 6)
4	Use of system fonts, many font colors	X
5	Customizable default font/size	X
6	Customizable notebook colors & styles	X
7	Enscript	X
8	Customizable UI	X/O
9	Manual sync	O (= Help > Troubleshooting > Reload?)
10	Local synced notebooks database	O
11	Import folders	O
12	Global & customizable KB shortcuts	O

In all of the following, of course, IMHO is understood!

Of the items that are gone for good (#1, #2, #7), most are things I didn't use & likely never would, so, to put it bluntly: not my circus, not my monkeys. #3 was already gone, unfortunately. 

#4 & #5 are definite losses, both esthetically (which is not nothing) and for purposes of easily recognizing information. OTOH, the new system of fonts and styles guarantees consistency of appearance across devices. That's also beneficial esthetically, and eventually I can likely systematize it to help make info recognizable. Similarly, I liked #6, since it helped in visually identifying the purposes of notebooks in an alphabetical list. But it never synced beyond each particular Windows device, which greatly reduced its usefulness. Nevertheless, I will miss it. #8 (resizing UI parts, hiding one or more panels, arranging toolbar items) was also handy for customizing information to one's personal needs. It's also a loss, though a less drastic one for me; but it's not entirely gone, since it's still possible to resize the panels to some extent.

#9 seems unnecessary on a good Internet connection in the new constant-sync architecture; but not everyone has that all the time. It seems to be available as Reload and Force reload, but I haven't figured out what those are for yet. #10: having the database download locally is good, but it's separated into various obscure parts in AppData\Roaming\Evernote\ now, and IAC the real "backup" is the Evernote servers. #11 is very good to have back; many had found it a deal-breaking loss. For me, #12 is the sweetest thing to regain, making many functions readily available both within and outside the Evernote app itself, even if there's a bit of a learning curve for some of them.

So for me, significant features have returned, what is gone was mostly not central to my purposes, and the new features of v. 10 are enough of a gain that I've decided to keep on using it, without installing the legacy v. 6 beside it (given  the inevitable confusion, and the likelihood that enhanced font styling from v. 6 would clash at some point with v. 10 font styling). The biggest gains in v. 10 for me are the ability to edit HTML Web clips, a far more functional Reminder dialogue, and the new search and filter functions (including the Boolean and other functions that caused me to upgrade to Professional). I esp. look forward to really diving into the Home page, which may eventually prove to be the starting point for a day's work that EN seems to want it to be. The standard headings, cross-platform font consistency, more functional highlighting, and access to things like super- and subscript on all platforms make the editor a net gain. I also like the enhanced options when multiple notes are selected and when notes are merged (a relatively recent development, I think). As I become fluent with all this, I expect to see that overall, v. 10 is worth the pain of what's been lost and of its learning curve.

The one show-stopper bug is the random multiple note duplication I've read about (and experienced in the Web client), but that seems so unpredictable that I decided not to let the possibility of it keep me away. Bugs like inability to copy bulleted lists into or images out of Evernote are a problem, but are on the fix list; and of course dear old v. 6 does have its issues, none of which is going to be fixed.

So that's my long-drawn-out year-and-a-half thought process. If anybody's still reading, I'd love your comments.

[eric99 980]

Point 3: spell check seems to work properly in my V10 windows client

[gazumped 11,664]

Thanks @Dave-in-Decatur for the thoughts.  I'm a (very) old-fashioned unrepentant dinosaur in that I'm still using 'legacy' (actually the last public version of Windows 6.25) mainly because I know how that works.

There are plenty of drawbacks,  but at least I know where they are.  Plus I was limited by my hardware:  a 5+ year old Dell laptop as the primary tool,  and a 4+ year old Asus -now running Linux- as a secondary.  Neither one is what you might call 'nimble',  or able - I would imagine - to give me a reasonable performance running a resource-hungry app-within-an-app.

I've now acquired (Heaven help me) a new top of the line Dell Desktop running (gulp) Windows 11 which is in process of being connected to my workspace peripherals - various displays, scanners,  external hard drives etc.  There's going to be (I suspect) a smidgeon of Learning Curve in my near future and some of that is going to be Evernote v10. 

I'll still have the laptop for backups and any other occasional bumps in the road,  but I figure I have to make the attempt.

As it happens,  and because - all due respect to Evernote - I'm here to get my stuff done,  not support one particular app regardless of its performance,  I already have an exit strategy planned.  If v10 is (still) as big a House Fire as some say (and this will be on primo hardware) I will be OUT.  End of.  Back to free user status,  read-only notes and a new home somewhere else.

Because - as I said somewhere else recently - if an app works for me,  I'll keep on using it.  Until I find something better. (Rasczak's rule...)  

Would you like to know more?...

[DTLow 5,736]

1 hour ago, Dave-in-Decatur said:

table of what was lost between v. 6 and v. 10, including what's come back and what hasn't.

I'm a Mac user, and the corresponding feature to Enscript is Applescript; also still missing in v10   
This is a required feature for me; my show stopper

The first v10 release included the note    
But please be aware that there are a handful of features—such as AppleScript, import folders, and the ability to edit note creation dates—that are not yet available.   
Count me as skeptic

[PinkElephant 8,103]

Import folders couldn’t be returned to v10, because they never existed in legacy for the Mac. They were introduced with v10 on the Mac, closing a long standing gap compared to Windows. Before on the Mac it was necessary to employ 3rd party apps like Hazel, or a Script to do what Import folders now do from the EN settings directly.

About scripting: I have voiced very early my doubt about scripting to even be possible at all. My reason then was that on checking a bunch of other Electron apps, I had found none that would support scripting. From what I learned since, Electron as a framework is sort of a virtual machine. I think it effectively shields any script from outside to interact with the EN app running inside of the framework / VM.

I would like to be proven wrong, but it had not happened yet. Who relies on scripting for his use cases seems to be out of luck with v10.

Currently the only way to code something for use with EN seems to be to write an external program that interacts through the API directly with the EN server.

[Dave-in-Decatur 3,958]

1 hour ago, PinkElephant said:

About scripting: I have voiced very early my doubt about scripting to even be possible at all. My reason then was that on checking a bunch of other Electron apps, I had found none that would support scripting. From what I learned since, Electron as a framework is sort of a virtual machine. I think it effectively shields any script from outside to interact with the EN app running inside of the framework / VM.

Ah ha! This may explain the inability for a desktop shortcut to open a note in a window if its own, instead of in the main program window--that would probably require "script-like" activity.

[Dave-in-Decatur 3,958]

3 hours ago, gazumped said:

I've now acquired (Heaven help me) a new top of the line Dell Desktop running (gulp) Windows 11 which is in process of being connected to my workspace peripherals - various displays, scanners,  external hard drives etc.  There's going to be (I suspect) a smidgeon of Learning Curve in my near future and some of that is going to be Evernote v10.

I'm in somewhat the same situation, moving slowly from a Win7 desktop to a Win10 (soon to be 11) laptop, with two other heavily used programs in very updated versions to be installed and learned. Hopefully I will not end up too curved myself! Personally, I like EN 10, but YMMV.

[Dave-in-Decatur 3,958]

4 hours ago, eric99 said:

Point 3: spell check seems to work properly in my V10 windows client

Ah ... I'm referring to kind of a golden oldie. Spell check works for me, in the sense that misspelled words have red squiggles under them, and you can go back and fix them with the right-click context menu. Long, long ago the Evernote Windows program had a function like a word processor's that, on command, went through an entire note and paused on each misspelled word to allow correction or addition to a dictionary. That was phased out about 4 years ago, to the horror and dismay of multitudes, and still isn't back, and likely isn't coming back.