Evernote Local Notebook

[AngelQH 11]

Hello,

for the longest time, I have been using Evernote and have loved it...until the latest update. I have read that the latest Evernote v10 had removed the local notebook feature. I was so devastated to find out. Luckily for me, I downloaded the Evernote Legacy and realised that I am still able to make local notebook even after I have reached my monthly upload limit.

I definitely prefer the older version of Evernote now. I probably will continue to use it, but I am afraid that they will suddenly shut down the Evernote Legacy (which may result me losing all my local notes). Anyone know if they will provide an announcement message when they decide to close down Evernote Legacy?

P.S. How I wished that they didn't take down the local notebook feature in v10.

[Milo78 6]

Evernote owes me for the heart attack I had when I couldn't find my precious local notebooks in this new version.  At no point was this clearly communicated to me.  I filed tickets, and thought I had lost very important information.  I've been a paying member since 2008 but this experience has shaken my faith in Evernote.  I managed to download the legacy product and get access to (and backup) my local notebooks after several days of extreme worry.  But this was the final push I needed to go from Evernote advocate to dissatisfied long time customer who wants to jump ship.

[Terry E 5]

On 10/25/2020 at 10:49 PM, AngelQH said:

Hello,

for the longest time, I have been using Evernote and have loved it...until the latest update. I have read that the latest Evernote v10 had removed the local notebook feature. I was so devastated to find out. Luckily for me, I downloaded the Evernote Legacy and realised that I am still able to make local notebook even after I have reached my monthly upload limit.

I definitely prefer the older version of Evernote now. I probably will continue to use it, but I am afraid that they will suddenly shut down the Evernote Legacy (which may result me losing all my local notes). Anyone know if they will provide an announcement message when they decide to close down Evernote Legacy?

P.S. How I wished that they didn't take down the local notebook feature in v10.

It is indeed shocking that Evernote would discontinue local notebooks. This latest version removes local notebook functionality without any warning! I only happened to find out about this loss while reading "What's new in Evernote for Windows" after installation. Good thing I didn't install the new version on my other, secure, computer. 

For local notebook content, I'm going to investigate Joplin (https://joplinapp.org/), an open-source alternative to Evernote. It imports enex Evernote files and does not force use of cloud storage. It is available for Windows, Linux, macOS, Android and iOS.  A review of Joplin from PC Magazine is to be found at https://www.pcmag.com/reviews/joplin. It is a PC Editor's choice.

[catydone 1]

4 hours ago, PinkElephant said:

You don’t need a „warning“ - there are release notes to read.

You can install the legacy client offered by EN side by side to the new client and continue to use your local notebooks.

https://help.evernote.com/hc/en-us/articles/360052560314-Install-an-older-version-of-Evernote

Legacy will be discontinued one day, with enough lead time to switch things over. So you can take your time to try alternatives.

For a Mac I could name you at least 2 good alternatives with local storage, no idea for Windows.

Thank you for the solution. I'm relieved to rediscover the notebooks I thought I had lost.

Re. "You don't need a warning, there are release notes": I don't have time to read the release notes of all the apps I use, and I doubt most other people do either. Evernote is not the center of my universe.

I work for a software company. We never do anything that would affect customers' data without sending them other special communications in addition to release notes, for exactly this reason.

[gazumped 9,536]

5 hours ago, AngelQH said:

Anyone know if they will provide an announcement message when they decide to close down Evernote Legacy?

Hi.  Quite a few of us are still using the old / legacy version,  so I'd expect that once they've dealt with a few more bugs and missing features we'll come under some pressure to move to the new version.  You'll certainly hear if they decide to shut it down.

[s2sailor 1,097]

10 hours ago, AngelQH said:

I am afraid that they will suddenly shut down the Evernote Legacy (which may result me losing all my local notes)

Local notebooks will not be coming back.  I suggest you should start making a plan now on what you want to do with those in case support for the legacy versions drops without advanced notice.

[DTLow 5,679]

10 hours ago, AngelQH said:

I am afraid that they will suddenly shut down the Evernote Legacy (which may result me losing all my local notes).

You have the app installed on your device - no one can shut it down (don't sign out)

You need to back up your data - particularly local notebooks
Since they're not uploaded to the server, Evernote is not backing up local notebook data

[PinkElephant 5,130]

It is unlikely an installed software will stop working for local content just because somebody discontinues it.

IMHO no reason to panic. Prepare an alternative, test, confirm, move.

If all Cloud-based services are taken out of the race (even those that offer end-to-end encryption), there is not much left. Probably the simplest solution is folder based on the own desktop, or on a NAS. Make sure the documents are OCRrd, to make local search possible.

Locally installed is DEVONthink, an option for Mac users. The large NAS companies offer their local solutions, like NoteStation that runs on Synology disk stations. A NAS offers good local backup as well.

[DTLow 5,679]

37 minutes ago, Milo78 said:

Evernote owes me for the heart attack I had when I couldn't find my precious local notebooks

Evernote Legacy still supports Local Notebooks but make sure you've implemented data backups     
By definition, Evernote doesn't provide backup support for Local Notebooks

[Nubben 0]

Hi all, I have the legacy ed v 7.14.

I was looking at the option to create a local notebook to store what data I do not want to upload to the EN servers.

It turns out I can only create Private or Shared notebooks.

I always create Private notebooks but all of them are available in iOS etc.

What am I missing?

Thanks!

 

[Garyhels 1]

Had the same problem as Milo78. This is an unacceptable way to treat customers.

On 10/29/2020 at 1:22 PM, Milo78 said:

Evernote owes me for the heart attack I had when I couldn't find my precious local notebooks in this new version.  At no point was this clearly communicated to me.  I filed tickets, and thought I had lost very important information.  I've been a paying member since 2008 but this experience has shaken my faith in Evernote.  I managed to download the legacy product and get access to (and backup) my local notebooks after several days of extreme worry.  But this was the final push I needed to go from Evernote advocate to dissatisfied long time customer who wants to jump ship.

 

[PinkElephant 5,130]

Private just controls whether you share a notebook with another person, or not. If set to Private, there is no share. The other option is to publish a notebook, to anybody who receives a link. All three will sync to the server, and from there to other devices.

[DTLow 5,679]

On 10/31/2020 at 7:09 AM, Nubben said:

I was looking at the option to create a local notebook to store what data I do not want to upload to the EN servers.

It turns out I can only create Private or Shared notebooks.

Hold down the option key. click the File menu

[Nubben 0]

6 hours ago, DTLow said:

Hold down the option key. click the File menu

Thanks DTLow. Ah, maybe I do not have the legacy version after all.  Does it have to read "Legacy" in the menu?  I have v 7.14 but no the new v 10.  

 

 

[AngelQH 11]

2 hours ago, Nubben said:

Does it have to read "Legacy" in the menu?

Yes, it is clearly and distinctly labelled as "Evernote Legacy" instead of "Evernote". Oh, and the icon for Evernote Legacy is grey in colour instead of green.

[DTLow 5,679]

2 hours ago, Nubben said:

Ah, maybe I do not have the legacy version after all.  Does it have to read "Legacy" in the menu?  I have v 7.1 4 but no the new v 10.  

v7.14 is fine 

To create a Local Notebook, hold down the option key and click the Help menu

[DTLow 5,679]

On 10/25/2020 at 9:49 PM, AngelQH said:

Evernote v10 had removed the local notebook feature.

This was posted as a feature request and I added my vote

In the meantime, we need a solution for our Local notebooks so we don't lose the notes
Here's my work-around

With a legacy version, I used the Save Attachments to Folder feature on my Mac 
This copied the attachments (mostly pdfs) to a local OS file folder
For each note, I removed the attachment file and replaced it with a file link
I then moved the notes to an online notebook

[topeerz 5]

I have some work-related data I don't need or want to have online. I have used evernote as it allowed me to combine (and search in unified way, yay!) online-folders for "public" data and "local folders" for not-so-public data (like private and public code snippets). Having one tool to search them all was a great deal. The removal of local notebooks means I would need to use two different tools - and this is The deal breaker for me ... While I understand I can keep using "legacy" a little longer sooner or later it will be gone - hence it would seem it is a time to move. I don't understand why great tools needs to "evolve" instead of "adapt" while staying great tools ...

It is worth to note that while evernote starts to enforce using the cloud of some sort I am still not seeing any way to secure data in this cloud (like RSA encryption for notes). Also the "updated" interface seems to be colourful and "cool" but - is it really more useful? Probably the evernote is just switching target group ...

[gazumped 9,536]

16 minutes ago, topeerz said:

The removal of local notebooks means I would need to use two different tools

If you read the previous post,  it is possible to move the offline notes anywhere - an external hard drive folder is an obvious option - and keep an index in Evernote with local file links so that the necessary notes can be opened directly in whatever app originally created them.

[topeerz 5]

44 minutes ago, gazumped said:

If you read the previous post,  it is possible to move the offline notes anywhere - an external hard drive folder is an obvious option - and keep an index in Evernote with local file links so that the necessary notes can be opened directly in whatever app originally created them.

I am not sure if I follow. Let's assume I am taking notes in evernote during daily work meetings. I don't want these notes to be online at any point (as I don't know how secure the cloud is plus I am not able to encrypt them unless I will use another tool for this). Also I want to be able to search through current and recent notes. What workflow are you suggesting?

[gazumped 9,536]

1 minute ago, topeerz said:

Also I want to be able to search through current and recent notes.

Given that restriction I'd suggest you stick to the legacy version for as long as possible.  In general my proposal was that you save your files to a hard drive or memory stick and create a note in Evernote that has links to the local storage location.  That will open files,  but not allow you to search the content. 

If an 'executive summary' with each link will not suffice - "budget meeting with <name> on <date>" or some such,  then you'd need some third party document management software to index the contents of the files.  At the moment Evernote Local Notebooks does that job rather well.

[GBurnett 4]

I have used (and paid for) Evernote since 2012.  I have a mix of regular notebooks (ones I want to access on the go) and local notebooks (ones I do not).  I am flabbergasted that Evernote has discontinued local notebook support since this is the feature that I use the most.  I am not uploading nine years of tax and financial data on any cloud, whether on not their encryption meets "industry standards".  Those standards have been breached often, and I am not comfortable entrusting financial data to them. 

I have downloaded the legacy version and will have to make due until they discontinue support, after which I will have to find a replacement.  I am not renewing my subscription without local notebooks.

WTF is going on here?  Why did they ditch local notebooks?  What software should I use if they discontinue support for Evernote Legacy?

[PinkElephant 5,130]

The question about he why is probably simple to answer: The new EN is based on a framework (think of it as a browser). This type of software is made for online platforms, and in general not build to support local storage. 

Since you don’t tell about the OS you are using, sort of hard to give advise on this one.

Alternatives with local options are simple to find on a Mac and iOS, less on Windows.

[topeerz 5]

1 hour ago, gazumped said:

Given that restriction I'd suggest you stick to the legacy version for as long as possible.  In general my proposal was that you save your files to a hard drive or memory stick and create a note in Evernote that has links to the local storage location.  That will open files,  but not allow you to search the content. 

If an 'executive summary' with each link will not suffice - "budget meeting with <name> on <date>" or some such,  then you'd need some third party document management software to index the contents of the files.  At the moment Evernote Local Notebooks does that job rather well.

Thanks for answers @gazumped! I guess I will be forced to look for another tool ... The joke on me is that actually "offline" was my bread and butter while online features like sync, presentations, or web clipping features were just "nice to have".

I am not fully understanding removal of offline notebooks. We don't even get setting like "don't sync at all" (filtering on firewall is not a sane solution  ). How hard could it be to keep a flag on each folder excluding items from sync? I am not buying "new framework" argument mentioned in this thread - the app still needs to be able to cache notes locally until they are upsynced otherwise any crash (or just running out of battery) would result in data loss. Unless the ultimate goal is to dump offline completely - probably dump even standalone client and move towards browser-hosted solution so you don't have to maintain apps on several systems. Not cool

[GBurnett 4]

Looks like I need an offline replacement for Evernote for Windows 10.  Any ideas?

 

[DTLow 5,679]

1 hour ago, topeerz said:

Unless the ultimate goal is to dump offline completely

The discussion is on Local notebooks      
Offline notebooks are a different subject, and still supported

>>the app still needs to be able to cache notes locally until they are upsynced 

Confirmed, offline access and cache is still supported

[topeerz 5]

6 minutes ago, DTLow said:

The discussion is on Local notebooks 

Offline notebooks are a different subject, and still supported

>>the app still needs to be able to cache notes locally until they are upsynced 

Confirmed, offline access and cache is still supported

Regardless of naming the goal is to create notebooks which are not getting synced to the cloud (ever). As far as I see this is not possible with v10 - you are creating folder which eventually gets synced no-matter-what. I have mentioned "local cache" only to state I don't fully understand what would be technical reason of forcing sync-everything policy _unless_ the ultimate goal is to dump local client completely. And yes, this remark was off-topic.

[PinkElephant 5,130]

As officially told in the release notes of the new clients, local notebooks are gone. This feature will (when I take the companies communication as it is) not return to the v10 generation of EN software.

Which means all storage of the v10-versions is cloud based, be it for a local client (desktop/mobile) or when using the web client through a browser. Existing local notebooks are only supported locally as long as the legacy clients (PC & Mac) continue to work.

Whether this is for technical reasons (which I assume) or plain company strategy only EN can explain. I take it as it is, like it or not.

For Mac users I know of 2 alternatives to EN featuring local storage as an option. These are DEVONThink and Apple Notes. Both are solid from their market standing, and offer their own set of features. DT is feature rich, but more complex, AN reduced, but easy to use, so it depends on what a user really needs.

For the PC maybe somebody else has ideas that go beyond a folder & file structure, and stay below a full document management system, which may be sort of an overkill for EN users. Another option are apps offered by NAS companies. Personally I know the Synology Note Station, which of course is entirely based on local storage (what is the idea behind a NAS anyhow), but quite reduced in features compared to EN.

[GBurnett 4]

I will check out Synology Note Station.  Thanks!

 

[PinkElephant 5,130]

You will probably find it pretty much reduced. Make sure your stuff does come with OCR embedded into the files, and have Universal search switched on in DSM to get them indexed. No native OCR capabilities !

[GBurnett 4]

I will, thanks.  I have OCR on by default in my scanner, so I should be ok.  Right now I am having trouble figuring out how to buy it! 

[PinkElephant 5,130]

Get Note Station or a Synology ?

A Synology can be bought from many sources,  for example from Amazon (not my choice ...).

Note Station is part of the Synology operating System DSM, for free. The apps / clients are free as well. Make sure you get a Synology that has the power (OCR, previews, indexing) - should be from the „+“ Series.

Having one means you operate your own server at home. You should be able to do this. This is even more important when you want to access it from outside of your home network. Access from the outside exposes your home network to the web - can be done, but must be safeguarded.

Note Station can not be used without a Synology.

[GBurnett 4]

Ah, I see.  I'm not really looking for a NAS system, although I could do that.  I'm looking for something to replace local notebooks on my PC.

[catydone 1]

I just discovered my two local and VERY CRUCIAL notebooks are missing. I'm not sure when I "upgraded" to the Evernote version that doesn't include local notebooks. Can someone point me to instructions for recovering them??

What kind of software company disappears your data like this??? If I had realized what was going to happen to those notebooks, it would have been simple to move the notes.

Edited March 11, 2021 by catydone
minor repetition

[PinkElephant 5,130]

You don’t need a „warning“ - there are release notes to read.

You can install the legacy client offered by EN side by side to the new client and continue to use your local notebooks.

https://help.evernote.com/hc/en-us/articles/360052560314-Install-an-older-version-of-Evernote

Legacy will be discontinued one day, with enough lead time to switch things over. So you can take your time to try alternatives.

For a Mac I could name you at least 2 good alternatives with local storage, no idea for Windows.

[topeerz 5]

25 minutes ago, PinkElephant said:

You don’t need a „warning“ - there are release notes to read.

The local notebooks were core feature which allowed me to use evernote for keeping any important data in evernote. I am talking about anything work-related, anything containing personal data (like documents scans) and many more. Regardless of encryption which _may_ be used for data transfer or storage I don't want to commit some of my data to any cloud. In other words - dropping local store ejects from system most of professionals or people who were using it for storing anything important. For me - THIS is shocking regardless if it was in release notes or not ... This also undermines basic trust in company  And while I am still using legacy I have no guarantee it will still work after macOS update ...

@PinkElephant Problem with finding replacement is that evernote did really great job. It had vast amount of features - I would guess that average user (like me) has not been utilising even a half of them. However the sheer number of possibilities allowed people to use elephant in different, custom workflows. That's why it is sooo hard to find a viable replacement. Personally I give a quick look at a few potential replacements like Nimbus, Apple Notes, Devon) ... no one has charmed me at first glance. Right now I am looking towards the Bear (with which I have been flirting for some time due to its _great_ tagging system). Yet this is still not "it" - I am constantly hitting issues like - not so great web clipping, no image resizing, no jump to ... There are times I am considering switching to vim with some ascii art plugin  

[PinkElephant 5,130]

IMHO for full features it would be DEVONThink, for a lean solution Apple Notes.

Under European law for professional use one should sign a data processing agreement with the provider. Then the use for business data is legal.

This is legally even safer than keeping the data at home - if you have a breach, at home it will be quite difficult to prove everything was ok.

[topeerz 5]

10 minutes ago, PinkElephant said:

This is legally even safer than keeping the data at home - if you have a breach, at home it will be quite difficult to prove everything was ok.

Trusting any 3-rd party provider is not solving problem of local security - you are just adding an extra point of failure not removing one - you local machine _has_ to be secure regardless. If your local machine is breached all your 3-rd party accounts and storages are vunerable as well (you may to some extent mitigate this by using 2-way factor etc. but this is just mitigation not solution). Also - usually you are forced to have some local data anyway - especially when offline or fast processing is required. Using local tool for processing/storing data is acceptable - even if frown upon - while using tool enforcing cloud usage would be strictly forbidden by most corpos.

[PinkElephant 5,130]

Local is better ? - it is probably not that simple.

First large companies are not the typical EN users. So I don’t care about this group - although many of them are moving to cloud services now.

Second with a solution like EN you work on a local copy of the data, but the master file is on the server. Thus it takes a lot of safeguarding away that you need to implement and maintain on a strictly local platform. In a small business this IT housekeeping takes time away from the customers and adds to the overhead.

This even more if you need to work on the move, or from your clients premises. It can be really difficult to reach your home data base through a clients firewall and your own connectivity solution.

Third I think that keeping your data in a service like EN does protect it against ransomware. Any ransom attack on an EN client would corrupt the local data, by this stop syncing and protect the server data. 

In general I think things are tipping over to cloud storage and service on demand. „At home“ is not by default safer than „in the cloud“. I doubt that a notebook is better protected just because it is defined as local notebook.

[topeerz 5]

@PinkElephant I think we are talking about different topics - you are talking about not loosing data - and main solution here is "do backups". You may do backups yourself or you may be relying on 3-rd party to do it for you. I am talking about data leakage prevention - first line of defence here would be - don't share it unless you have to aka. "keep it secret, keep it safe".  The "In the cloud" or "master file on the (3-rd party) server" is NOT safer regarding data retention than local-only. Let's note that you can also have "full online" model when you are accessing remote data only during session and once session is done all local data is wiped (i.e. accessing bank account online) however security of such approach depends upon service provider security and connection security.

Please note that while local processing of some work data is acceptable - uploading it to 3-rd party is NOT. To use non EN example: you may want to open excel locally but not necessarily upload it to one drive - especially if your company doesn't use o365 or if this is customer-of-customer data.

The problem is that "full online" (or enforced "master online") model using EN servers (of unknown security) would NOT be acceptable for users keeping any sensitive data in evernote. It means all pro users as well as all non-pro users storing data like documents scans will have to move elsewhere. That's why loosing "local folders" is HUGE.

[DTLow 5,679]

9 minutes ago, topeerz said:

It means all pro users as well as all non-pro users storing data like documents scans will have to move elsewhere.

It certainly means that sensitive data will have to be stored "elsewhere"
I will need to store this data, along with the other data that needs to be accessible within the file system

I can continue to access this data from within my Evernote account via file links replacing the embedded data

[Terry E 5]

Evernote is not being straightforward with users. Here's their answer (from https://help.evernote.com/hc/en-us/articles/209005107) as to why they've stripped out local notebook functionality:

Why are local notebooks no longer supported?

One of the primary benefits of Evernote is the ability for customers to capture ideas and information in multiple ways and then access that information from anywhere, anytime. This requires secure syncing of content in Evernote.

**************

The above is a non-answer. Evernote users have always been able to avoid sharing some notes. Now all notes must be shared with the cloud and with all our devices with Evernote installed. Do many Evernote users have data they don't want shared in the cloud and on their phone? The answer is surely Yes. 

This change was not made in response to user wishes. It was made for other reasons that are being hidden from us. 

 

[topeerz 5]

@DTLow you are right, I may store data elsewhere in the file system. Yet this mean EN is reduced to indexing tool. Also - will the search work for such data? Am I going to be able to tag this data?

Use case 1: I have multiple tasks of things I need to do (let's call them UserStories ) and each of these may have subtasks. Probably for some of these I will have some related screenshots and other attachments as well. In "legacy" I am having note for each of these tasks with inline screenshots neatly combined with text comments and other files added as attachments if needed. I am able to search through such "stories" for keywords or tags. Obviously I musn't upload any of this to the cloud. What can I do to mimic this setup in v10?

Use case 2: I want to make some quick notes while interviewing candidates. Once done I want to reformat these and upload to company system (and eradicate any local data) ... I think v10 means EN is no longer viable to handle this UC?

[PinkElephant 5,130]

@Terry E Ooooooh - THEY (whoever THEY are) are hiding something from us ! Must be a bad thing, like the NSA now wants to read our most hidden secrets. Or there must be a conspiracy that is today not allowing local notebooks, and will tomorrow try to rule the world.

Why not take it as it is ? Local notebooks are no longer supported, period, end of line, done, gone. Probably if you fine tune a software that is build around syncing and server support, not syncing is simply a PITA, costly and hard to support when developing the software. In a myriad of places in the code you have to ask „Am I allowed to take this and sync it, or do I keep it local only“. So for simplicity it may well be in the interest of most users to quit local notebooks, although it will do harm to some hardcore users. Or it is just in the interest of the company to make more money, whatever. Gone, done, period.

If local storage is important for you, use legacy, and go looking where you find another place to host your valuables. Or you make a new evaluation, decide your stuff is not really that critical, move it to the server, and that is it. What you do is completely up to you, but please: If you wish to spread conspiracy talk, do it in another place.

[topeerz 5]

@catydone I would try installing evernote legacy - in my case I was able to see all my old notebooks as I used to when elephant was still green (in fact on macOS I have both legacy and regular in parallel). Here is link to article which also contains link to legacy installer: https://help.evernote.com/hc/en-us/articles/360052560314 

Also if you don't have any sensitive data you can try to use tools->check for local notebooks and follow https://help.evernote.com/hc/en-us/articles/209005107 (honestly never did this so I don't know how accurate is this guide).

[PinkElephant 5,130]

@topeerz Use case 1: There may be no need to upload that stuff, but there is no need NOT to upload it either. With v10 you don’t need to bother: It is uploaded, your neatly arranged notes are safe, be happy.

Use case 2: If your candidate notes are in your personal account, it is you and only you who can access it. No reason not to upload. If it is in a business account, and you are employed to keep your files there, a local copy would anyhow be against the rules. I assume that you put notes with relevant content (like HR related stuff) only into notebooks that are restricted in access to people who are legally allowed to see these notes. When you just tap some words, and want to polish it later, put a DRAFT remark at the beginning.

Sometimes I wrote a draft of an e-mail I wanted to send later. I did it in Outlook, filed it on the Exchange server, even when an admin or my assistant could go there and find it. So WTF ? If it is THAT critical, I write it on a piece of paper, or I file it on my phone. There are enough ways to keep things where they should be kept - local notebooks are not mission critical.

[PinkElephant 5,130]

When there is a major update (like this one, jumping from rel. 6.x or 7.x to 10.x) it is maybe better to read the release notes first. I do, and I am not in the software industry.

Anyhow, EN did nothing bad to local notebooks. They did not upload them, and they did not discard them. They left them in place, and offered the legacy clients for (among other uses) local access to that part of the users data. 

So I really ask what sort of warning you would expect.

„Update - do you really want to update - UpDate - don‘t you want to rethink again - UPDATE -  it may do .... - UPDATE NOW - ok, but don’t come complaining ... look, I put a sticker here, red and yellow, reading „poisonous update - swallow at own risk“. Better now ?

If you would have wanted to warn users about everything in v10, we are back to release notes nobody is reading anyhow, when I take your words. One user has local notebooks, another likes printing or scanning, I really miss the Apple Watch App that disappeared the moment I updated the iOS client, etc.

[topeerz 5]

@PinkElephant

3 minutes ago, PinkElephant said:

Use case 1: There may be no need to upload that stuff, but there is no need NOT to upload it either. With v10 you don’t need to bother: It is uploaded, your neatly arranged notes are safe, be happy.

No way. The basic security strategy is you do not share anything except you have to. Uploading anything means you are putting this data at risk.
As to the second use case - uploading any data which may be tight to particular person to 3-rd party server most likely means you are violating EU GDPR/RODO.

The exchange example doesn't fit there. If you want send the email (which is base premise of outlook app) it means you _need_ at some point to share it with exchange server (this is not same case as creating note in EN - or at least it wasn't before v10). You assistant won't be able to access any emails unless you give him your password (which would be security violation on your side) or delegate rights. In fact the same goes for the admin - in general he shan't be able to access your email anonymously (not sure if we want to go in to details about admin role in general and admin role in MS environment in particular ...). Also it is worth notice that email systems may have separate layer of encryption you can use like GPG/PGP or SMIME.

11 minutes ago, PinkElephant said:

Probably if you fine tune a software that is build around syncing

Is it? Problem is that EN _used to_ be build around local data processing. So, after update to v10 we have to face "this is my way or highway" ... And sure this is their company they have right to do this ... except it may rise some questions about long term trust ...

 

9 minutes ago, PinkElephant said:

In a myriad of places in the code you have to ask „Am I allowed to take this and sync it, or do I keep it local only“.

Oh, boy they must do little code review then ...

 

8 minutes ago, PinkElephant said:

If you wish to spread conspiracy talk, do it in another place.

The conspiracy talk doesn't equal to the bad communication and making poor excuses  

[PinkElephant 5,130]

It simply boils down to: Local notebooks are gone, please choose your exit.

One leads to the life boats, the other to the ball room. Maybe one never knows what he has missed by taking the other exit.

In the end it is a question of trust: I think my data is pretty safe on the EN server, where it is stored in a million of little fragments, among other billions of little fragments. To access it there, one needs the big bad server software, and must convince it that he is me. I have everything in place that EN offers for account security. The rest I regard as life risk, and yes, ***** happens.

If you see it more critical, it is not about local notebooks, it is about not using such a service at all. Maybe take a look at DEVONThink then - their strategy is to install and run everything local, and the user decides if and what to upload to a cloud server, eventually.

[Terry E 5]

54 minutes ago, PinkElephant said:

@Terry E Ooooooh - THEY (whoever THEY are) are hiding something from us ! Must be a bad thing, like the NSA now wants to read our most hidden secrets. Or there must be a conspiracy that is today not allowing local notebooks, and will tomorrow try to rule the world.

Why not take it as it is ? Local notebooks are no longer supported, period, end of line, done, gone. Probably if you fine tune a software that is build around syncing and server support, not syncing is simply a PITA, costly and hard to support when developing the software. In a myriad of places in the code you have to ask „Am I allowed to take this and sync it, or do I keep it local only“. So for simplicity it may well be in the interest of most users to quit local notebooks, although it will do harm to some hardcore users. Or it is just in the interest of the company to make more money, whatever. Gone, done, period.

If local storage is important for you, use legacy, and go looking where you find another place to host your valuables. Or you make a new evaluation, decide your stuff is not really that critical, move it to the server, and that is it. What you do is completely up to you, but please: If you wish to spread conspiracy talk, do it in another place.

No need to be nasty, "PinkElephant". It is a fact that Evernote has offered no justification for the decision to strip this functionality from their software. That is a fact, not a conspiracy theory. You don't care about sharing all your Evernote data? Fine. But some of us care a lot. 

[GBurnett 4]

6 hours ago, Terry E said:

It is indeed shocking that Evernote would discontinue local notebooks. This latest version removes local notebook functionality without any warning! I only happened to find out about this loss while reading "What's new in Evernote for Windows" after installation. Good thing I didn't install the new version on my other, secure, computer. 

For local notebook content, I'm going to investigate Joplin (https://joplinapp.org/), an open-source alternative to Evernote. It imports enex Evernote files and does not force use of cloud storage. It is available for Windows, Linux, macOS, Android and iOS.  A review of Joplin from PC Magazine is to be found at https://www.pcmag.com/reviews/joplin. It is a PC Editor's choice.

Thanks for the tip!  I will take a look.  Whether or not EN is justified in removing local notebooks, at the end of the day they have done so, and so I will not be renewing my subscription.  There are some things (like tax records) that I am not going to upload to anywhere. 

EN should take a look at this and ask themselves if it is worth it to cripple their product in order to streamline the experience or whatever BS they fed us.

[PinkElephant 5,130]

Then you have 2 options: Share your data with EN servers, or move them out of EN.

As long as legacy is available you have time to think about it.

For me the simple explanation is that the new clients are based on a framework, that practically is a browser without a browsers GUI. Browsers are build to get their content from a server, and write it back to a server. Local notebooks do not really combine with this basic design concept. So they decided not to implement a local-only storage solution. Maybe they see tomorrow that this was a bad decision, and reverse it. But I would not count on this to happen.

P.S. Why is everybody here so shy about his tax stuff ? Any Donald here ? Or is everybody cheating on his tax return ? Yes, I prefer that it is treated as confidential. But what is the personal account on an EN server other than that - confidential ?

[topeerz 5]

8 hours ago, PinkElephant said:

P.S. Why is everybody here so shy about his tax stuff ?

@PinkElephant This is not just about the tax data - it is about most of work or personal data. To answer directly your question - the tax data may contain a lot of sensitive information including names, addresses, security numbers, documents ids, account numbers and others. There is a lot of bad things which may happen when this kind of data gets leaked - i.e. you may find one day you are owner of a loan you never took.

[PinkElephant 5,130]

Personally I don’t think you should live your life in fear of what could be, nor in ignorance of real risk. Somewhere in the middle shines the sun. 

The data on a local storage is not by default safer or less safe than in a cloud storage - the risks are different, but existent. At home there are more physical risks, and maybe network issues, in the cloud it is more about access safety.

EN has decided to stop supporting local storage, that is the situation. The life span of legacy is defining the transition period. If you feel you need local storage for what you use EN (I don’t), you need another solution.

[KGU 3]

i have used EN for a few years and liked it very much. But in our company there is a rule that no customer related data can be stored in a cloud. And with that EN is out... too bad! I have cancelled my subscription. 

Sorry, but this decision was really stupid, especially in this times. I don't need local notebooks to be included in the basic version, I'm willing to pay for it. But I'll look for something new now.

[Gazebo 30]

IMHO the Cloud is now a safer place for data resilience than your own hard drives.

The business I work for now keeps all data in the cloud using Citrix for reasons of business continuity and risk management, but we are encouraged (but not forced) to use Onenote for our  personal work records,  this keeps the data within the domains paid for by the company.

I still use Evernote for a lot of meeting notes and document scans as it is quicker to access than Onenote generally, but that is stuff that back in the day I would have written in a notebook and kept in my desk, so it has no real security risk attached to it.

  

[topeerz 5]

It is worth noting that when it comes to privacy and security even some IT big whales recognise importance of on-device processing and giving user control over the data.
For example "Build trust through better privacy" https://developer.apple.com/videos/play/wwdc2020/10676/ ...

[KGU 3]

this discussion leads to nothing. It doesn't matter what I think or what you think. Many companies are very conservative when it comes to data and you can't force them to see it differently. Local notebooks are not a new feature, they have worked before. It's stupid to disable something that already works when it's used by a lot of customers. Leads to less subscriptions ... the question remains is it worth it?
 

[DTLow 5,679]

29 minutes ago, KGU said:

this discussion leads to nothing

Agreed; the discussion posts are a worthless
To indicate support for the request, use the vote button at the top left corner of the discussion

The Version 10 product has no support for Local Notebooks   
If necessary for your workflow, use a different product (I use the Evernote Legacy product)

[Dab1 4]

I have thousands of local notebooks for tax records and other personal information.

I am extremely upset about he decision to stop the use of local notebooks as it allowed me to store the exb files in a Veracrypt vault locally plus back them up using spider oak.

I want to continue using Evernote so is there an easy way to convert local notebooks to online notebooks?

[DTLow 5,679]

15 minutes ago, Dab1 said:

is there an easy way to convert local notebooks to online notebooks?

https://help.evernote.com/hc/en-us/articles/209005107-Convert-local-notebooks

[PinkElephant 5,130]

23 minutes ago, Dab1 said:

I have thousands of local notebooks for …

I am pretty sure you may have thousands of notes, but not thousands of notebooks. The Basic Account is limited to 250 notebooks.

When switching to online (and synced) notebooks, do the migration one notebook after the other. The ENEX file does not transmit the information in which notebook a note is located. If you want to keep up your structure, create a twin notebook to each local one in the online account, export one notebook to ENEX and import it into the corresponding online notebook. 

[Dab1 4]

3 hours ago, PinkElephant said:

I am pretty sure you may have thousands of notes, but not thousands of notebooks. The Basic Account is limited to 250 notebooks.

When switching to online (and synced) notebooks, do the migration one notebook after the other. The ENEX file does not transmit the information in which notebook a note is located. If you want to keep up your structure, create a twin notebook to each local one in the online account, export one notebook to ENEX and import it into the corresponding online notebook. 

True I don't have 1000s of notebooks but I have several accounts and in one of my accounts I have 498 notebooks.

How long do you estimate it will take me to port these across 1 at a time ? 

 

[PinkElephant 5,130]

Long …

If you want to keep that notebook structure, I’m afraid there is no other way.

An option might be to add a tag per notebook to all notes, and import using the tag instead of the notebook.

Not less effort before, but maybe easier to handle after.

Even for Premium accounts there is a cap of 1.000 notebooks.

[Dab1 4]

This is all very sad. I have used Evernote from its early days and it has been a fantastic product.

Before I commit to Long... I want to understand if any of the other functionality has been removed.

Do you know if version 10 still has a detailed options box, for example how do you  set the shortcut keys preferences?

[PinkElephant 5,130]

You can view the shortcuts available in the v10 desktop client, bottom left or help menu. You can change the shortcuts in the global section.

Most of the changes are listed here:

https://help.evernote.com/hc/en-us/articles/360047889234-What-s-new-in-Evernote-for-Windows

[CalS 5,013]

6 hours ago, Dab1 said:

I have thousands of local notebooks for tax records and other personal information.

I am extremely upset about he decision to stop the use of local notebooks as it allowed me to store the exb files in a Veracrypt vault locally plus back them up using spider oak.

I want to continue using Evernote so is there an easy way to convert local notebooks to online notebooks?

Easiest way is to just move them to a synced notebook.  Though your data is not secure at that point.

I had a similar issue, just under 9000 local notes most of which contain a PDF.  I moved the notes to a OneDrive folder using Boxcryptor for encryption.  I use Windows  and Directory Opus for indexing/searching and access respectively.  My experience to date is that this new set up is as fast as EN, a pleasant surprise.  Just entered the numbers of my current street address and got back 1681 notes immediately.  And with a file list and a preview window it looks a lot like the EN Window.  Works well for me as most of this data is static history.  FWIW.

I'm still using 6.25.1 so I continue to access the notes via EN. Downside will be when 6.25.1 sunsets as I will have to search in two places from time to time.  But I'm set when that happens,

[PinkElephant 5,130]

From my view the main issue is not what to do with the existing notes, but how to proceed for the future.

Once this is decided, it is easier to plan something for the existing notes.

I have never used local notebooks. I believe that most definitions of what must be protected at any (high) cost is excessive. Most of what we regard as critical information would probably not care anybody else.

This is not the same as protection against ransom encryption or loss - but even if I would not like to loose the pictures from the last family reunion, there is rather anything in it I would only store behind an AES256 key.

So for me it was simple to decide to proceed with v10, currently with legacy as a stopgap for missing features.

But this decision anybody can only take for himself.

[CalS 5,013]

17 minutes ago, PinkElephant said:

From my view the main issue is not what to do with the existing notes, but how to proceed for the future.

Once this is decided, it is easier to plan something for the existing notes.

I've used local notebooks for tax stuff, financial statements and the like since I went paperless with EN some years back.  Stuff that does not need to see the light of day on the Internet.  So existing notes become problematic when EN says no more local notebooks.  Past and future get blended into a single need for a safe storage/retrieval process for confidential data.  It is what it is for me.

Rougher bit I may need to address could be what happens if EN does not fix the existing performance issues, the process slowdown  and overall slower app performance.   For example, it takes less than five minutes for me to review my tasks and tracking with 6.25.1.  I mostly use reminders with saved searches and a couple special tags.  It takes 15 minutes or more with V10.  The bulk of the issue is process, very little is fast or easily accessible with V10.  App performance has improved but is still slower than it once was.  The issues are probably particular to my use case or ones like it.  Don't want to be all whiny about it, but again, it is what it is for me.

[PinkElephant 5,130]

In general the help documents are pretty up to date. You find a lot of step by step advise in the help center of the EN website.

About dark mode:

https://help.evernote.com/hc/en-us/articles/360002061928

About navigation options:

https://help.evernote.com/hc/en-us/articles/218702547

[PinkElephant 5,130]

They can’t decrypt text portions you encrypted yourself using the special tool (or you say they have a backdoor, which you can say about any service, unfounded …).

The encryption on the server must be open to EN itself: All server based services as syncing, building the search index, OCRing of files etc. only work when the content is not encrypted for the bots performing these services.

There is nothing new in your „scandal“. You can save your allcaps hysteria for other places.