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Anyone Else Thinking of Switching?


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As a life-long programmer, software architecht and former CEO of a Nasdaq traded technology company...it is crystal clear to me what's wrong with the latest release of Evernote. They're trying to "syn

Hmmn.  I agree with half that statement.  My frustration with everyone's negative reaction so far has been that early adopters,  who had an option,  (with the exception of iOS) still chose to update t

Am switching, canceling my sub, but keeping existing notes around on EN till I’ve safely migrated and gotten used to my new workflows. Someone said earlier that EN broke his heart. It broke mine

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9 minutes ago, davidtderrick said:

Some missing images (and possibly pdfs). They are listed, but are inaccessible. Other people have posted screenshots. I can still access them via the Mac client.

Yes, I also lost images and PDFs by using the new iOS client. I uninstalled the iOS client from my iPad. Currently, I am only using the Mac client (old version) and the Web client which also works in Safari on my iPad. I have absolutely no trust in the new versions. If this is not getting better soon I will switch to Notion.

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49 minutes ago, eric99 said:

Have you, and what where the circumstances?

Took handwritten notes, during meeting lasting 2 hours. After hitting "Done", I saw the spinning wheel. For several minutes. Closed Evernote, opened the note again, ... proposed to restore the previous note (as it detected there were unsaved changes; so far so good). My handwritten notes appeared back again and I tried to save the note. Again the spinning wheel. For several minutes. Tried that process once again. Fourth time: empty note. Nothing to recover.

Dropping features: OK; losing data: very, very bad.

No feedback from the support team on this issue.

So Noteshelf it is now (at least on iPad).

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6 hours ago, Alvin C said:

Joplin is okay for me, but on MacOS it can't work. Will follow their updates and see. Standard Notes are great to have end-to-end encryption, but not sure if it is good for me (need to pay for more functions). Finally came between Bear and Apple Notes.

out of curiousity and trying to learn: what's wrong with joplin on mac? worked for me, even as I have finally settled for Devonthink and am very happy so far. Did you look at that and if so, why did you decide against it? thanks...

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I'm not considering switching, but I did revert to the pre-10 version after trying version 10 on my Windows desktop a couple of days ago. Tagging was glitchy (start typing a tag, EN predicts and presents the tag, click on the tag and nothing), the delete key on my keyboard would no longer work to delete a note and the control function to delete a note was glitchy, sometimes it worked and other times it did not. But most important was the dramatic reduction in the response rate. A deleted message (if it worked) would take up to 15 seconds to delete and again, sometimes it did not work. Dragging and dropping the note into Trash was also very slow, deleting with the Delete key use to be almost instant. The preview of a note was also substantially slower. Overall, much slower throughout. 

I'm going to stay with the older version for a few months and try 10 again in the future. I may reach out to EN for ideas as well. I'd be curious to hear if anyone else is having slowdown issues. 

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40 minutes ago, Benny Wydooghe said:

Took handwritten notes, during meeting lasting 2 hours. After hitting "Done", I saw the spinning wheel. For several minutes. Closed Evernote, opened the note again, ... proposed to restore the previous note (as it detected there were unsaved changes; so far so good). My handwritten notes appeared back again and I tried to save the note. Again the spinning wheel. For several minutes. Tried that process once again. Fourth time: empty note. Nothing to recover.

Dropping features: OK; losing data: very, very bad.

No feedback from the support team on this issue.

So Noteshelf it is now (at least on iPad).

I fully agree, losing data is completely unacceptable!

Luckily I haven't experienced this on my windows version. After I just installed version 10, I noticed a stale note, without content for a longer time, but that was while building the database in background. Since then, it is extremely stable.

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20 hours ago, eric99 said:

I don't understand what all the fuzz is about but that's probably because I use EN as it was initially intended...

I think a different way of saying this is that you don't have a workflow that is impacted by the limitations of v10.  Many of us do.

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41 minutes ago, s2sailor said:

I think a different way of saying this is that you don't have a workflow that is impacted by the limitations of v10.  Many of us do.

Exactly 🙂 

I'm not going to elaborate too much, but to summarize, I don't expect EN to be a word processor or spreadsheet or painting program or ...

Apart from my quick notes, which are completely edited in the EN editor, my more sophisticated content is created in specialized tools, Word, Exel  etc  

The remaining text in the note then glues all included documents together. This  (meta)data can also be searched  in case the included documents are encrypted.

I was also a big fan of the Top List view, but now that I'm forced to use the left pane, I suddenly realize that this is a very good alternative and perhaps even more intuitive: at the left side, the list can be longer, and it fits nicely next the editor pane on a 16:9 monitor. 

 

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8 hours ago, Mountainside said:

Our time is too valuable to be spend waiting for network traffic on our desktops. It wasn't necessary to make the desktop version dependent on the cloud ... if that's what we wanted, we could have simply run evernote in our web browsers. Everyone is entitled to their opinion of course but the way I see it, most of what made evernote great was the speed available with the desktop version while being able to occasionally log in from a browser if necessary.

Yesterday I tested performance while editing (I pasted a 150 pages document into a single note) and noticed no lag while typing. I disconnected the network and was able to proceed without any problem. Search is possible while disconnected. After reconnect, it syncs nicely. All my data is stored in a local database. Is this different from version 6 ?

Sometimes I have the impression that there is a lot of complaining without testing the actual product...

Are we talking about the same product? I'm on EN for windows...

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13 minutes ago, eric99 said:

I'm not going to elaborate too much, but to summarize, I don't expect EN to be a word processor or spreadsheet or painting program or ...

You are missing the point.  We have been using workflows based on what Evernote is (or was). v10 breaks many of those workflows.  It is not a case where we are trying to use Evernote as not intended.

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51 minutes ago, eric99 said:

Yesterday I tested performance while editing (150 pages document) and noticed no lag while typing.

It's not about lag while typing. It's about network lag when adding new records, updating old records, and from what I can tell, more or less anything that modifies the evernote database...all of those processes are hitting the cloud database in real time, in the foreground--instead of syncing in the background, as they did before, thus dramatically slowing down the responsiveness of the desktop app.

Needless to say, not a fan.

I understand that new versions of software are generally met with protest from users who need to re-learn and adapt to the new way of doing things. Experienced many "user base revolts" over the years in my career while designing upgrades to software products. However the point is, once the users *do* learn how to adapt to the new system, it should be better in some way..."syncing" the desktop UI with the cloud in real time is a laudable goal--I'd imagine the team is working towards real time collaboration at some point in the future which would admittedly be awesome--but the reality is public networks are just too darn slow in terms of latency, still, to make it a wonderful experience for desktop users.

If we were all sitting 1ms away from the cloud with no network interruptions, ever, on gigabit connection, it would probably be different. We're not there yet.

At least for the desktop version, processes that depend on network traffic should be relegated to the background, where they were. At least for now. They can be made to run in the background a few hundred milliseconds behind the desktop user and update on the fly...but the desktop interface should not freeze/hang while waiting for traffic. Ever.

The hit to performance on the new desktop version is painful ... seriously painful. I'm not whining here for no reason...the hanging and experience-wide slowdowns are not a good thing.

A disappointment indeed because EN has been great to work with until now.

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9 hours ago, Alvin C said:

I have already finished switching.

Personally, I'm not participating in this switching frenzy; to version 10, to apple notes, to ...
I am happily using the legacy version with no issues  

btw  You might find it difficult to switch data out of apple notes

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54 minutes ago, s2sailor said:

You are missing the point.  We have been using workflows based on what Evernote is (or was). v10 breaks many of those workflows.  It is not a case where we are trying to use Evernote as not intended.

I said "as initially intended". During the last ten years, also on request by power users, EN has been extended with a lot of extra features.

Of course I realize there are  missing features, but this shouldn't be a surprise: it was already announced a couple of months ago, the first release wouldn't contain all features. So this was planned and  I'm confident that many features will return. That said, I've experienced myself that sometimes a small adaptation of your way of work(flow), may lead to surprisingly new insights: as I already explained, I was used to the Top List view and now I realize that the left list is probably superior, at least for me.

I also had to adapt my scanner workflow, but I can live with it until they re-implement it (Ian mentioned this in his last interview).

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I'm mainly an iOS and iPadOS user with occasional forays into the Windows and Web clients. 

Yes, there are features missing which we loved and used before, but Evernote was up front about that and that they have confirmed they're bringing features back once they have migrated the code base for those functions.

The only things I am really missing are Apple Watch support and iOS/iPadOS 14 shortcuts API support.

There are also features we have never had before which Ian Small and the team have said will be coming in the next 6 months. This is good news as we can agree there has been no innovative new feature for a good 2 years now. The new code base is allow the developers to actually develop instead of patching and transposing.

For me, I'm seeing the new Evernote apps as the first step on a new journey. Some of the 'places' on the way will be familiar features as they return to the app and some of them will be brand new features.

If the latest Mac/WIndows version doesn't do it for you, they still have the older 'legacy' versions available. This is the same as they have done with the web client for over 12 months. The functionality is still there if you require it.

For iOS/iPadOS users, the legacy version isn't available because Apple doesn't allow developers to have older app versions available in the App Store if your OS can take the latest version. So a lack of 'rollback' on that platform isn't the fault of Evernote.

V10 is a work in progress building from a new stronger and more flexible foundation. Stick with it.

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15 minutes ago, DTLow said:

btw  You might find it difficult to switch data out of apple notes

Yeah, this is one of the things which lets Apple Notes down a bit. It can be done, but it is a case of copying and pasting each item of text and each file one at a time...a heck of a faff frankly.

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21 minutes ago, eric99 said:

I said "as initially intended". During the last ten years, also on request by power users, EN has been extended with a lot of extra features.

That's correct and we have built workflows based on how Evernote evolved and ones we hope to eventually use on v10.  I'm not debating the direction Evernote is taking, I actually agree with it.  The surprise is that they released v10 too early.  It was too stripped down to be useful for many of us.

Very little was communicated prior to the release of v10.  The permanent removal of local notebooks, a key feature for me, was not early announced, though I suspected it was coming.

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35 minutes ago, s2sailor said:

 It was too stripped down to be useful for many of us.

I think it is probably useful for 95% of the users, except... EN management forgets that they are paid by the remaining 5%

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Evernote also broke tags in another way, that breaks my workflow. This is very disappointing.

If you want to browse your notes in a hierarchy, the only way past a 2 deep level is to use a hierarchy of tags. This is due to Evernote's poor decision to not allow nested notebooks.

So I organized my hundreds of notes that way.

Now, it is broken. Any note in the hierarchy that is next to another level of the hierarchy is now invisible to browsing!

Specifically:

  • Tag 1 - top of hierarchy
    • Note 1 with tag 1
    • Tag 1.1 - next level of hierarchy
      • Note 1.1 with tag 1.1

Note 1 is invisible when you browse through tags. Needless to say, I now have a bunch of notes I cannot access directly, and which will have to be re-organized.
But worse (and this is how I discovered this) - if you have a bunch of notes at a level in the hierarchy, and then you add another level at that point, all those notes disappear from browsing where you could see them before.

This is *not* an improvement. It may be the last straw for me. Considering Joplin as an alternative (and it is also free).

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They should have never forced the rollout of the new version until it was functionally complete. 

They are trying to fix the plane while it is flying.  It is not working well for them.

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Just now, davidtderrick said:

Plus most of the guys who do reviews don’t notice any of these bugs. They just rehash the press releases.

I thought they did extensive beta testing.

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On 10/14/2020 at 8:59 AM, dagbo said:

So far so good for me. I have had zero problems with the new Windows versions, and while I would like the Import Folder, ability to manage Tags as previous, and miss the ability to set Styles and view options for individual views, I'm pretty happy. I still find having to see "Shared With Me" in the left panel annoying - I do not share Evernote files with anyone, and would like to turn that off.

However, I really like the new Editor, and am especially happy with the way that Reminders are implemented, notably the functionality when setting them in individual notes. I think the merge feature is greatly improved too.

The new version feels stable and as I'm using the Android Beta the user experience feels, for the first time, consistent across these two platforms - or as consistent as they can be given the screen size difference.

My verdict is - those of us using the new release are absolutely beta testers, but I have faith in the company to improve the release and add back in the features that are missing. And the improvements in the editor and reminders outweigh any negatives for me.

My two cents...

Couldn't have put it better  - no problems for me on Windows 10 app, benefits outweith the negative by a country mile.

I flirted with Notion and imported all my trello and en into it thinking one tool was the answer. Couldn't find anything, but hey, it looked really pretty. Now moving my notes back to EN.

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On 10/14/2020 at 3:15 AM, aviaryan said:

Went back to v7 for now. Will stay there for few months at-least, then decide.

IMHO, one of the bigger features of Evernote was its light footprint and snappiness. Part of it could be because it was a native app.

I am not sure that if it is worth sticking to Evernote if they want to switch to web technologies. There are more feature-rich alternatives like Notion or Roam Research in that case.

 

I wish I knew how to go back to my earlier version. I naively updated today...what a mistake.

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7 hours ago, eric99 said:

I said "as initially intended". During the last ten years, also on request by power users, EN has been extended with a lot of extra features.

Initially intended is a moot point of sorts.  EN morphed and use cases morphed with it.  No better or worse, more fitted or less fitted, just use cases that took advantage of the capabilities of EN across time.  EN's option to reformat the product for sure, the how has been what's aggravated those using the features that were gutted.  To the point a lot of its uniqueness in my view.   🤷‍♂️

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Yes! I am now considering changing. I have been an avid Evernote user for many years. I use it on Windows, Web and Android. Periodically, as other competitors make improvements, I review and consider changing. Now, with this latest upgrade, I will take another serious look.

It has only been a couple of days, but the issues I am having with the version 10 are looking for be show-stoppers.

  1. Auto-start on Windows startup is now missing. I submitted a ticket, and the response was to upgrade to the latest version (version 10.2.24). This did nothing.. .maybe caused the below issue:
  2. Clicking on the minimized tray Evernote icon now brings up a scratch pad. This could be useful, but I prefer to pull up the note list like before. Now, I must right click on the icon, and select Open Evernote.
  3. In Windows, the main screen displays the sidebar, note list, AND a view of the note on the far right. I do not want that note view on the far right. I like having a very small note list window.

I will be looking at alternatives.

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On 10/27/2020 at 10:35 AM, eric99 said:

I fully agree, I really like the new version, especially because it is very stable and robust, which is exceptional for a first release. I don't understand what all the fuzz is about but that's probably because I use EN as it was initially intended...

"Initially intended" may have upset some folks, but I understand your meaning
I'm not in agreement with "stable and robust", but I'm sure issues will get resolved
Yes, it's a "first release" and I fully expect to see issues, missing features, ...
For this reason, my primary devices are still running legacy versions

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8 minutes ago, tony10000 said:

Why did the fix what wasn't broke?  Why give us a less feature rich alternative?  Why force folks to use it (web version)?

No answers from Evernote!

I thought Evernote was very clear about redeveloping the product to use a common framework

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1 minute ago, DTLow said:

I thought Evernote was very clear about redeveloping the product to use a common framework

That is fine, but sticking paying customer with an inferior, unstable, and unfinished product is not cool!

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3 minutes ago, tony10000 said:

That is fine, but sticking paying customer with an inferior, unstable, and unfinished product is not cool!

Mac and Window users are not stuck; Legacy version at https://help.evernote.com/hc/en-us/articles/360052560314?fbclid=IwAR2TNqp-eGRH3Ds8Vfu-CiKPjYolJzZ_keR9eWQaDahJ2GN-7hwn595zI8w&__s=bsetfdgzirbvqtopurph

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2 minutes ago, DTLow said:

Yeah, but I found incompatibilities.  When the web switched over, I just got the spinning disc on the web and it locked up Chrome.  I could only fix it by upgrading the Windows version.  Other folks are having issues with the iOS version.  

 

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I've been an enthusiastic EN user since 2012, I'm happy to pay for a product I like and want to support even I don't really need to, but this new features, which have disturbed the way I enjoyed this program (win 10 user, french version), make me totally rethink this relationship - so unless I'm blind, this is what has become really irritating to the point of giving it up

- clicking on lower right taskbar icon now opens a note, not the program, no matter how many times I click - I haven't seen any way to change this behavior. I consult more EN than I create notes, ok, i can right click but it's irritating to change something I've used tens of time daily for the last years

- no more top bar where I can add shortcuts, really? as if EN gave a lots of options before so users could customize its use for their ergonomic needs. I used only marginally the left menu shortcuts. Now I have to. 

- this is probably the only software I have when I can't get a decent options/ preferences tab with all the things I can tinker with, it's just not there any longer (Where the heck can I decide if I want EN to launch on windows startup or  not?) I'm pushed (or pulled) to the online version of my account, which asks for my password 2 or three times but doesn't give me this option 

EN problem has always been for me the lack of customization, now they're scaling down users options even more. I'm not game with this trend at all, and unless I have a very buggy version, it smells like sanoraya to me

Now, I'll have to look for a previous version that hopefully this new update/ downgrade won't make it impossible to get back to 

 

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Thanks Gazumped but I'm not sure I understand (and want to) what this legacy version entails, I was perfectly happy with previous version which I found and reinstalled. Won't check any update for a loooong while and will preciously keep my 6.25.1.9091 safe. Oh goodie lookie, I find an option menu which lets me choose, NOT TO check for udaptes, unchecked  - 

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„Legacy“ is just another word for the last stable release of EN before v10 was rushed on us.

It can be downloaded and installed, and it can even run side by side with a v10 client on PC and Mac. Just be aware that each of the clients has its own database, which means double memory usage by the two installed versions.

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All the talk about "using as intended" is funny. Here's how this crazy power user with a custom workflow loses data:

  1. Open iOS app
  2. Type in some text or create an audio note
  3. Save and close the note

When the data loss happens (quite frequently to me before I stopped using the app), all of the data is gone, with no history or recourse. I just have a blank note left.

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1 hour ago, TheWorldJoker said:

All the talk about "using as intended" is funny. Here's how this crazy power user with a custom workflow loses data:

  1. Open iOS app
  2. Type in some text or create an audio note
  3. Save and close the note

When the data loss happens (quite frequently to me before I stopped using the app), all of the data is gone, with no history or recourse. I just have a blank note left.

Opposite universe here.  Last night I edited a note on V10 on my iPhone and ended up with two versions of the note on my desktop in the morning.  Nice.  Thankfully my iPad is still old school.

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My oldest note in EN is from January 2010; I've been a paid user for most of that time. I am definitely looking into switching away; sure, I can keep using EN 7.something on my Mac, but I can't roll back the IOS clients from the sluggish unusability of EN10 and "capturing random thoughts quickly on my phone" is a lot of what I've used EN for.

I am currently working on a note in EN with my opinions on other note apps. It may be the last thing I write in Evernote. Perhaps if your needs align with mine (no Electron apps allowed, needs to have Mac/iOS/Windows/Android clients, needs to deal gracefully with PDFs and images placed in notes, needs to be able to collaborate with other people) it will be helpful: https://www.evernote.com/shard/s46/sh/16bf3b4b-7603-4828-aa7c-52db8cb95c8d/87e98644d8050f5ccfaacf089c07e2a7

Also I have found a post on the Evernote subreddit with an evolving list of EN alternatives, with some kind of attempt made to list which particular EN features various apps have: 

 

Current Evernote migration status: watching the OneNote EN importer preview ssssslllllooooowwwwlllllyyyyy import my 1487 notes, if you have a ton of notes then look elsewhere IMHO!

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3 minutes ago, egypturnash said:

My oldest note in EN is from January 2010; I've been a paid user for most of that time. I am definitely looking into switching away; sure, I can keep using EN 7.something on my Mac, but I can't roll back the IOS clients from the sluggish unusability of EN10 and "capturing random thoughts quickly on my phone" is a lot of what I've used EN for.

I am currently working on a note in EN with my opinions on other note apps. It may be the last thing I write in Evernote. Perhaps if your needs align with mine (no Electron apps allowed, needs to have Mac/iOS/Windows/Android clients, needs to deal gracefully with PDFs and images placed in notes, needs to be able to collaborate with other people) it will be helpful: https://www.evernote.com/shard/s46/sh/16bf3b4b-7603-4828-aa7c-52db8cb95c8d/87e98644d8050f5ccfaacf089c07e2a7

Also I have found a post on the Evernote subreddit with an evolving list of EN alternatives, with some kind of attempt made to list which particular EN features various apps have: 

 

Current Evernote migration status: watching the OneNote EN importer preview ssssslllllooooowwwwlllllyyyyy import my 1487 notes, if you have a ton of notes then look elsewhere IMHO!

I'm doing the same thing in Evernote but haven't much more to conclude right now.

That Reddit thread is great isn't it?

I'm interested in Nimbus but don't care for the limited data cap.

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10 minutes ago, avevers said:

I'm interested in Nimbus but don't care for the limited data cap.

Nimbus has a lot of features but it sure is failing the "aaargh I hate Electron apps and their utter disregard for normal conventions of OSX keyboard shortcuts" test for me, and that's one of the things that's making me look into switching. :)

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1 minute ago, egypturnash said:

Nimbus has a lot of features but it sure is failing the "aaargh I hate Electron apps and their utter disregard for normal conventions of OSX keyboard shortcuts" test for me, and that's one of the things that's making me look into switching. :)

It seems like the whole world is going Electron these days because it is multi-platform and web compliant.  I wish more folks would use Qt Framework.

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40 minutes ago, tony10000 said:

It seems like the whole world is going Electron these days because it is multi-platform and web compliant.  I wish more folks would use Qt Framework.

Why Qt, @tony10000? Genuine question; not familiar with either framework...

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1 hour ago, egypturnash said:

I am currently working on a note in EN with my opinions on other note apps. It may be the last thing I write in Evernote. Perhaps if your needs align with mine (no Electron apps allowed, needs to have Mac/iOS/Windows/Android clients, needs to deal gracefully with PDFs and images placed in notes, needs to be able to collaborate with other people) it will be helpful: https://www.evernote.com/shard/s46/sh/16bf3b4b-7603-4828-aa7c-52db8cb95c8d/87e98644d8050f5ccfaacf089c07e2a7

Not a particularly optimistic outlook is it?  :(

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I did notice a significant performance improvement on 10.2 compared to 10 and 10.1 on my computers. Still nowhere near as fast as native, but unfortunately it seems like the only native multiplatform option is OneNote and I have many other reasons to hate it

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1 hour ago, Vstk said:

I did notice a significant performance improvement on 10.2 compared to 10 and 10.1 on my computers. Still nowhere near as fast as native, but unfortunately it seems like the only native multiplatform option is OneNote and I have many other reasons to hate it

Evernote V6, which is perceived as a performant implementation, is written in javascript running on CEF3 (chromium framework).  Electron  is based on CEF as well.

Therefore, a good performance should be possible in electron too. There is still hope 🙂

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It is sad that we see so many people who are very loyal to the Evernote platform and really don't want to leave.  Yet, they are forced to make a difficult decision because the company is tone deaf to their needs and does not clearly communicate its intentions. 

As Evernote is privately owned and funded by VC, I fear for its survival.

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25 minutes ago, tony10000 said:

It is sad that we see so many people who are very loyal to the Evernote platform and really don't want to leave.  Yet, they are forced to make a difficult decision ...

I am a user of the Evernote services, and really don't want to leave   
Still using the Legacy software   
I'm not being "forced to make a difficult decision"

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3 minutes ago, DTLow said:

I am a user of the Evernote services, and really don't want to leave   
Still using the Legacy software   
I'm not "forced to make a difficult decision"

Yeah, but the legacy version is a dead end and who knows how long it will continue to work?

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Just now, tony10000 said:

Yeah, but the legacy version is a dead end and who knows how long it will continue to work?

So, someday in the future I will be "forced to make a decision"   
I expect by then the Evernote v10 will be completed, and will be an option

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@tony10000Oh, I need to worry about this, and be afraid of that ?

Not my thing: Legacy works, v10 improves, maybe the two developments meet nicely at some point in the future. And maybe not - this is something to take care of when the time has come to do so.

Until then: Don't worry, be happy 😎 !

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1 minute ago, DTLow said:

So, someday in the future I will be "forced to make a decision"   
I expect by then the Evernote v10 will be completed, and will be an option

That will only happen if the company is still in existence.  Given what I read in their Wiki, I am wondering if they can survive if they suffer a mass exodus of paying users. 

See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evernote

That is why I am looking at other options.  YMMV...

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... and maybe a big stone falls from the sky, right on their heads !

Then maybe there is something to worry about for me.

Maybe the stone does not fall on them, but on me ...

Then I need not worry any more - and I will regret every second spend worrying instead of living !

 

P.S. A few month ago, the forum was full of doubts "EN does not innovate, they will fold". Now it is "Whoops, they released, and I don't like it, so they will drown". Let me assume that next year, we will have another crisis, and another, and ...

At least they are privately hold and not forced to live by quarterly reports to the vultures.

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10 minutes ago, PinkElephant said:

... and maybe a big stone falls from the sky, right on their heads !

Then maybe there is something to worry about for me.

Maybe the stone does not fall on them, but on me ...

Then I need not worry any more - and I will regret every second spend worrying instead of living !

 

P.S. A few month ago, the forum was full of doubts "EN does not innovate, they will fold". Now it is "Whoops, they released, and I don't like it, so they will drown". Let me assume that next year, we will have another crisis, and another, and ...

At least they are privately hold and not forced to live by quarterly reports to the vultures.

It is funded by VC...and VC firms look for profits.  If profits aren't there, the funding disappears.  Looks like they are currently debt funded: https://pitchbook.com/profiles/company/42706-63#overview

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1 hour ago, tony10000 said:

It is funded by VC...and VC firms look for profits.  If profits aren't there, the funding disappears.  Looks like they are currently debt funded: https://pitchbook.com/profiles/company/42706-63#overview

If this forum keeps spreading nothing but this kind of messages and negativity as we have seen last month, it will be a self fulling prophecy for sure...

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1 minute ago, eric99 said:

If this forum keeps spreading nothing but this kind of messages and negativity, it will be a self fulling prophecy for sure...

I am just waiting for Evernote to throw us a bone.  They have been very tight-lipped lately about the new release, stability issues, and missing features.

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1 minute ago, tony10000 said:

I am just waiting for Evernote to throw us a bone.  They have been very tight-lipped lately about the new release, stability issues, and missing features.

Agreed, I have the same feeling

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3 hours ago, michaelsalk said:

I am switching over to FREE OneNote. Can anyone think of a reason why I shouldn't?

You should try it for a while. In my experience, sync is terribly slow and buggy. I've dealt with all kinds of problems trying to migrate my notes and sync them to all my devices.

Some really basic features and options that should be part of the program require macros. I realized I would probably end up paying for Onetastic. For example, you can't sort your notes automatically (by date, name,...). There is no option for new notes to be added on top of the list of notes as is the case in Evernote. So you always end up with your newest note being burried all the way down. There is no note preview / thumbnail, neither a text extract nor an image. So you actually have to fill in a proper title for every single note to have something you can work with. OneNote web clipper doesn't allow you to clip a complete webpage. It will take a screenshot, which is inferior to an html clipping where you can readily follow links, select and copy text, etc

You should look into the options you have when/if you want to move your notes out from OneNote. It does not look good at all. You will probably end up with a bunch of PDFs

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4 hours ago, michaelsalk said:

I am switching over to FREE OneNote. Can anyone think of a reason why I shouldn't?

If you're on Mac you may want to try it before you switch completely. OneNote is not the same on the Mac platform as it is on Windows. It is missing key features that I used for years on OneNote on Windows before switching. I have brought this up numerous times to their team and get the "well then buy a Windows machine answer". There's also NO clipper for Safari. They can't be bothered to update it like thousands of users have asked them to do. (It's a hot topic in their forums). You also can't save notebooks wherever you want on Mac, you are stuck with OneDrive.

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What about Google Keep? 

I used to use it but found the web version somewhat unreliable and there is no offline version. 

It is integrated into Gmail and Google Docs which is nice.

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I have moved to Click-Up. Does not have the clean interface and ease of finding notes but has everything else I have been asking Evernote to add for years.  The final straw was support. Super quick response from  Click-up. Evernote support on the other hand, did not respond to me when I went back to the free version and I gave my frustrations in the feedback.

I work in Software Development so I understand about not publicly announcing what may in a future releases etc. But I feel that silence is part of a bigger communication issue. EN should have communicated a year ago that the new windows client still had alot of work to be done and the initial release would be missing alot of key features that would be be brought back over time. Instead the expectation through silence was that the re-write was going great, a bit off track but going to bring it into line with what key competitors have in the market. 

There is no Evernote to Click-Up migration tool so I will keep my old notes in Evernote, but after 9 years as a premium user they are not getting one more cent from me.

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I am seriously looking at Nimbus Note.   It is the closest product that I have found to EN and the pricing is much lower.  Has anyone switched to it and what have your experiences been.  Just curious.

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1 hour ago, tony10000 said:

I am seriously looking at Nimbus Note.   It is the closest product that I have found to EN and the pricing is much lower.  Has anyone switched to it and what have your experiences been.  Just curious.

It's the closest but still feels rough. 

Importer does not import 100% of enex in some cases. Its kinda minor but there has been some major instances. 

Sometimes slow performance than even new Evernote. 

Non-hierarchical tags means a long list of tags. 

New Evernote dark theme beats Nimbus's. 

A lot of tools support Evernote import from enex files. Not with Nimbus which exports to html or pdf. So feels like more of a lock in? 

Transferring notes to another workspace is buggy, slow in Nimbus. 

Nimbus web clipper on chrome has a lot of bad reviews compared to Evernote. 

You can't share a folder to a specific email. You can only make a folder totally public or make. It public and password protect it. I prefer Evernote's model of sharing. 

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Oh and Nimbus is on Amazon Web Services while Evernote is on Google Cloud for what it's worth! 

Evernote has over 200 million users while Nimbus only has over a million. 

Otherwise I'm still trying to play with Nimbus to see if it works out. 

The major thing Nimbus has going for it is it's first class support; they get back to you quick and even talk to the developers directly so they can work on stuff. It's also in development which seems really fast. I have no doubt Nimbus will be very far in a years time. 

With all this said and from my previous post, still not sure about Nimbus. As Evernote might get it sorted soon. 

I've kinda given up and will just stick to Evernote unless another disaster happens. 

I have had enough of notes!!! 

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11 minutes ago, aashish108 said:

Transferring notes to another workspace is buggy, slow in Nimbus. 

 

Today in Evernote, after moving my notes to different notebooks / notebook piles, I have realized 13 notebooks simply disappeared on my iPad (sync is completed and I tried to reinstall the app). Not sure it gets much worse...

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21 minutes ago, aashish108 said:

It's the closest but still feels rough. 

Importer does not import 100% of enex in some cases. Its kinda minor but there has been some major instances. 

Sometimes slow performance than even new Evernote. 

Non-hierarchical tags means a long list of tags. 

New Evernote dark theme beats Nimbus's. 

A lot of tools support Evernote import from enex files. Not with Nimbus which exports to html or pdf. So feels like more of a lock in? 

Transferring notes to another workspace is buggy, slow in Nimbus. 

Nimbus web clipper on chrome has a lot of bad reviews compared to Evernote. 

You can't share a folder to a specific email. You can only make a folder totally public or make. It public and password protect it. I prefer Evernote's model of sharing. 

Nimbus Note doesn't sound that great from what I am reading.  I would also worry about the "lock in" and future of NimbusWeb.  So, I will stay put and see what happens as I adjust my workflow.

 

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1 hour ago, tony10000 said:

Nimbus Note doesn't sound that great from what I am reading.  I would also worry about the "lock in" and future of NimbusWeb.  So, I will stay put and see what happens as I adjust my workflow.

 

Are they Russian coders? Nimbus was looking promising but alarm bells going off......https://discussion.evernote.com/forums/topic/111887-go-take-a-look-at-nimbus-note/?do=findComment&comment=522360

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54 minutes ago, rob24hrs said:

Are they Russian coders? Nimbus was looking promising but alarm bells going off......https://discussion.evernote.com/forums/topic/111887-go-take-a-look-at-nimbus-note/?do=findComment&comment=522360

Alarm bells?  Their HQ is reportedly a tech hub here in Cleveland.   From a Twitter convo with them:

Replying to @tony10000

@tony10000 Hi there, Nimbus is the US based company and we fully comply with the US law. Some of our team members are from various countries, but that's common practice nowadays to keep prices more affordable. Thank you

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I have to say I don’t trust nimbus notes one iota. There last privacy policy was shocking, it literally said we grant them royalty free access to all our data! They have ‘fixed’ this (why did they miss that in the first place) and their reply to me - get this - linked me to Evernote forums as evidence they had changed it! So their staff are lurking here no doubt trying to farm off users and I just don’t think that’s ethical. Deeply uncomfortable with so much of their practices. 

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Am switching, canceling my sub, but keeping existing notes around on EN till I’ve safely migrated and gotten used to my new workflows.

Someone said earlier that EN broke his heart. It broke mine too. Sounds silly I know. I get that EN decisions aren’t personal, but for me it is. I consider myself a low-maintenance user, the kind that leaves their subscriptions running once they've committed, who rarely bothers support staff for anything and would just quietly figure out problems, tolerate minor bugs and freezes, taking for granted that future updates would eventually fix things.

Until now. I signed up to the forum recently only after the v10 update seriously interrupted my workflow. I have to say... reading all these posts more eloquent than my own on here and on reddit expressing the frustration and disappointment I too am feeling was a source of comfort to me.

This has been an awfully unproductive week where I’ve barely made progress at work, because instead, I’ve been spending what little spare time I had on researching and testing alternatives. No, I haven’t found anything better than EN legacy. For my needs, Legacy still works best compared to what’s out there. But I’m stubborn this way. So I’m still leaving. Have found 3 apps with different strengths that can cover most of my needs with some adjustment.

The way I see it, I like my odds better elsewhere where my needs aren’t relegated to the bottom 2%. Plus I’m a Mac desktop user who relies heavily on features unique to native Mac apps (like tabs!) that are either impossible to implement on Electron or unlikely to be implemented (or they would have said something by now to stem the exodus). No matter how they play their next chess move, for Mac users like myself, Legacy is as good as it’ll ever get for us. But Legacy’s not supported, we know as much.

So it’s all quite clear that I'm in the losing camp either way in EN’s Electron future, even if I could find it in myself to put aside my resentment and hang around for longer. Migration will only get harder as my database gets bigger. The sooner I get off, the sooner I get to return notetaking to what it should be – a productive activity that’s second nature rather than the thorn in my flesh it currently is.

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39 minutes ago, h3artbe_at said:

Am switching, canceling my sub, but keeping existing notes around on EN till I’ve safely migrated and gotten used to my new workflows.

Someone said earlier that EN broke his heart. It broke mine too. Sounds silly I know. I get that EN decisions aren’t personal, but for me it is. I consider myself a low-maintenance user, the kind that leaves their subscriptions running once they've committed, who rarely bothers support staff for anything and would just quietly figure out problems, tolerate minor bugs and freezes, taking for granted that future updates would eventually fix things.

Until now. I signed up to the forum recently only after the v10 update seriously interrupted my workflow. I have to say... reading all these posts more eloquent than my own on here and on reddit expressing the frustration and disappointment I too am feeling was a source of comfort to me.

[snip]

When Evernote didn't take into account with version 10 is that for many people, Evernote isn't a luxury. It's a necessity. We rely on Evernote. 

Going from Evernote 6 to Evernote 10 is like your car suddenly having only two gears, no air conditioning, the radio doesn't work, and the windows are stuck in the closed position. 

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19 minutes ago, Coffee First Thing said:

When Evernote didn't take into account with version 10 is that for many people, Evernote isn't a luxury. It's a necessity. We rely on Evernote. 

Going from Evernote 6 to Evernote 10 is like your car suddenly having only two gears, no air conditioning, the radio doesn't work, and the windows are stuck in the closed position. 

First.....

Love your username. Always coffee first for sure.

Second.....

That is probably the best description I have read so far. I'm one of the ones that relies on it and have had to also run legacy. Which takes up more room when installed than just one instance of course. The sheer amount of points I have accumulated over the years allows me to take my time and try and be patient with the development of the new apps since it's not something I'm paying for at the moment due to those points I have redeemed. With that said, though I am an ECC I have no problem expressing how I feel about the new build. Some things are wonderful and some just suck. As a power user I have build muscle memory with the keyboard shortcuts that are no longer there in v10. Now, some are coming back, but I don't know when other than "they're coming".

I'm also an Aspie and have major OCD. I don't do change well at all. It may sound silly but the changes have been debilitating at times. I know it's not Evernote's job to take that into consideration, but I'll admit that I wish they had at least thought about how different groups would be effected. If they had, they could have done what almost every other app developer has done (at least the ones that I use) and introduced a new app (at least in the iOS store as I'm on Apple) and left the other one there and just stated that there would be no further updates. That's what Goodnotes, MoneyWiz, Banktivity, and more have done recently. 

I still love the app even with its faults and I'm heavily invested, but I would be remiss if I didn't say that they dropped the ball on this one in regard to releasing it so early. It wasn't ready in my opinion.

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30 minutes ago, Coffee First Thing said:

When Evernote didn't take into account with version 10 is that for many people, Evernote isn't a luxury. It's a necessity. We rely on Evernote. 

I don't understand your point   
Evernote provided the Legacy version and it's working well for me

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5 minutes ago, DTLow said:

I don't understand your point   
Evernote provided the Legacy version and it's working well for me

I was a long time premium user and respect your knowledge and comments DtLow, but I have to ask why wouldn't Evernote move v10 to general beta, and let everyone know its not complete. That way the beta would have somewhat satisfied those waiting for the new version and those that were not so fussed could just keep using Evernote like normal.. ie. there would not be a legacy version until v10 was truly finished..

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4 minutes ago, Manya70 said:

I have to ask why wouldn't Evernote move v10 to general beta, and let everyone know its not complete.

I'm not happy with Version 10 being a GA release     
but quoting from the Evernote blog   
If your workflow depends on these features, you can continue to use our legacy apps.

 

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12 minutes ago, Sayre Ambrosio said:

First.....

Love your username. Always coffee first for sure.

Second.....

That is probably the best description I have read so far. I'm one of the ones that relies on it and have had to also run legacy. Which takes up more room when installed than just one instance of course. The sheer amount of points I have accumulated over the years allows me to take my time and try and be patient with the development of the new apps since it's not something I'm paying for at the moment due to those points I have redeemed. With that said, though I am an ECC I have no problem expressing how I feel about the new build. Some things are wonderful and some just suck. As a power user I have build muscle memory with the keyboard shortcuts that are no longer there in v10. Now, some are coming back, but I don't know when other than "they're coming".

I'm also an Aspie and have major OCD. I don't do change well at all. It may sound silly but the changes have been debilitating at times. I know it's not Evernote's job to take that into consideration, but I'll admit that I wish they had at least thought about how different groups would be effected. If they had, they could have done what almost every other app developer has done (at least the ones that I use) and introduced a new app (at least in the iOS store as I'm on Apple) and left the other one there and just stated that there would be no further updates. That's what Goodnotes, MoneyWiz, Banktivity, and more have done recently. 

I still love the app even with its faults and I'm heavily invested, but I would be remiss if I didn't say that they dropped the ball on this one in regard to releasing it so early. It wasn't ready in my opinion.

 

41 minutes ago, Coffee First Thing said:

When Evernote didn't take into account with version 10 is that for many people, Evernote isn't a luxury. It's a necessity. We rely on Evernote. 

Going from Evernote 6 to Evernote 10 is like your car suddenly having only two gears, no air conditioning, the radio doesn't work, and the windows are stuck in the closed position. 

 

10 minutes ago, DTLow said:

I don't understand your point   
Evernote provided the Legacy version and it's working well for me

I can imagine how people feel when they use Evernote to keep track of their business. Although there is a Legacy version, this update can totally interrupt their work, and lack of communication lets people arouse their concern of when the Legacy will stop working if Evernote decides to break the link. A feeling of uncertainty.

When I saw the animation about the shiny new app made by Evernote, I wonder if they think it's an app indispensable in life, or just a "meaningful" Facebook.

At the first glance of the shiny app I like it, but random bugs these two months always keep waking me up. Stop saying Legacy because iOS does not have the Legacy one, and no official statements to reassure users how long they can use. Maybe it will be incompatible to the coming Big Sur. Who knows. Should the user avoid this by not upgrading MacOS?

Finally I want to conclude communication can solve everything.

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1 hour ago, DTLow said:

I don't understand your point   
Evernote provided the Legacy version and it's working well for me

I use Evernote Legacy, and I'm thankful for that. But Legacy's days are numbered. No updates, no fixes, no security bugs will be repaired. 

 

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7 minutes ago, Coffee First Thing said:

But Legacy's days are numbered.

You're right, someday we will be forced to switch   
But that day is not today, not tomorrow, not this week, ....   

When the time comes, I'm hoping Version 10 will be completed and suitable for general use    
That will make it an easy switch

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My issue is different. My account was hacked over two months ago and accessed from Russia, N Korea, Venezuela, Vietnam amongst other countries and only two after two months that I was contacted by email by Evernote to ask if I really logged from Venzuela. When I logged in after a password reset, I was shocked that I was never alerted on over two months of unauthorized access. Evernote requires you pay to have two factor authentication or to see a list of devices that logged onto your account. I have a support ticket open and intend to close my account after I hear their explanation. It is a massive Infosec practice if you ask me to witness this in a company with 250 million active users.

Screen Shot 2020-11-09 at 9.54.17 AM copy.png

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4 hours ago, h3artbe_at said:

The way I see it, I like my odds better elsewhere where my needs aren’t relegated to the bottom 2%. Plus I’m a Mac desktop user who relies heavily on features unique to native Mac apps (like tabs!) that are either impossible to implement on Electron or unlikely to be implemented (or they would have said something by now to stem the exodus). No matter how they play their next chess move, for Mac users like myself, Legacy is as good as it’ll ever get for us. But Legacy’s not supported, we know as much.

So it’s all quite clear that I'm in the losing camp either way in EN’s Electron future, even if I could find it in myself to put aside my resentment and hang around for longer. Migration will only get harder as my database gets bigger. The sooner I get off, the sooner I get to return notetaking to what it should be – a productive activity that’s second nature rather than the thorn in my flesh it currently is.

I completely share your feelings as well as your assessment. what a sad series of events...:-(. for reasons similar to yours and as you are a mac user, too, I have migrated over to Devonthink and must say am very happy with it with my specific use cases, in fact Devonthink is substantially more feature rich than EN as it turns out. the only limitations I found were 1) it only works in the apple ecosystem & 2) sharing notes / data is a lot more cumbersome than in evernote. if you are interested, I have summarized my transition experience over in their forums: https://discourse.devontechnologies.com/t/moving-from-evernote-to-devonthink-in-2020/59211

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4 hours ago, DTLow said:

I don't understand your point   
Evernote provided the Legacy version and it's working well for me

Point is V10 is a shell of V 6.25.  That, the bugs, the slowness, and the general lack of communications does not bode well nor make comfortable some of us who rely on EN.  Legacy available or not.   V10 is useless to me without major feature add back.  I’d as soon know and get on with it as opposed to dangle in the wind.  It ain’t that complicated.  There’s a vision or there isn’t.  🤷‍♂️

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6 hours ago, h3artbe_at said:

Am switching, canceling my sub, but keeping existing notes around on EN till I’ve safely migrated and gotten used to my new workflows.

Someone said earlier that EN broke his heart. It broke mine too. Sounds silly I know. I get that EN decisions aren’t personal, but for me it is. I consider myself a low-maintenance user, the kind that leaves their subscriptions running once they've committed, who rarely bothers support staff for anything and would just quietly figure out problems, tolerate minor bugs and freezes, taking for granted that future updates would eventually fix things.

Until now. I signed up to the forum recently only after the v10 update seriously interrupted my workflow. I have to say... reading all these posts more eloquent than my own on here and on reddit expressing the frustration and disappointment I too am feeling was a source of comfort to me.

This has been an awfully unproductive week where I’ve barely made progress at work, because instead, I’ve been spending what little spare time I had on researching and testing alternatives. No, I haven’t found anything better than EN legacy. For my needs, Legacy still works best compared to what’s out there. But I’m stubborn this way. So I’m still leaving. Have found 3 apps with different strengths that can cover most of my needs with some adjustment.

The way I see it, I like my odds better elsewhere where my needs aren’t relegated to the bottom 2%. Plus I’m a Mac desktop user who relies heavily on features unique to native Mac apps (like tabs!) that are either impossible to implement on Electron or unlikely to be implemented (or they would have said something by now to stem the exodus). No matter how they play their next chess move, for Mac users like myself, Legacy is as good as it’ll ever get for us. But Legacy’s not supported, we know as much.

So it’s all quite clear that I'm in the losing camp either way in EN’s Electron future, even if I could find it in myself to put aside my resentment and hang around for longer. Migration will only get harder as my database gets bigger. The sooner I get off, the sooner I get to return notetaking to what it should be – a productive activity that’s second nature rather than the thorn in my flesh it currently is.

Perfectly put; I'm pretty much the same. I was a lurker on the forums until v10. I'm currently trying to trim the fat from my notebooks before I start the slow migration. But working across two note apps, each with their own way of working (and manually recreating internal links and OCR) is a massive, disruptive pain in the arse.

10.3, announced today, offers some hope, and a roadmap of sorts, but it's all about trust now. And I no longer trust Evernote. Too many ignored requests, ignored fixes and seemingly ignored beta feedback has done it for me. And yet I've not found an alternative that meets legacy (and no, I'm not going anywhere near Nimbus now).

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9 hours ago, CalS said:

V10 is useless to me without major feature add back.

Same for me - At the top of my list is adding Applescript integration to the Mac app
There's also less critical features that I use (example Top List view)

I won't be switching to the Version 10 product until such work is completed

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On 11/1/2020 at 9:33 PM, egypturnash said:

I am currently working on a note in EN with my opinions on other note apps. It may be the last thing I write in Evernote. Perhaps if your needs align with mine (no Electron apps allowed, needs to have Mac/iOS/Windows/Android clients, needs to deal gracefully with PDFs and images placed in notes, needs to be able to collaborate with other people) it will be helpful: https://www.evernote.com/shard/s46/sh/16bf3b4b-7603-4828-aa7c-52db8cb95c8d/87e98644d8050f5ccfaacf089c07e2a7

Just posting to say thanks for sharing your note because once again, I've reached my reactions limit for the day and couldn't 'like' your post.
I had a similar 'eye-roll' experience when testing various apps that mostly turned out to be also run on electron so I could relate. Each time I read 'electron garbage' it made me laugh. I will be keeping Notion has one of my solutions though. It can come in useful in some areas plus I went in knowing it won't be a full EN replacement.

( btw what's the point of this daily reactions limit? I happen to admin several active forums and I don't get it. The risk of someone spamming using reactions is so low. I'd like to be able to show appreciation for posts made by fellow members that have been helpful or acknowledge responses to my posts but can never get past a few reactions before I'm 'muted'. )
 

Quote

Going from Evernote 6 to Evernote 10 is like your car suddenly having only two gears, no air conditioning, the radio doesn't work, and the windows are stuck in the closed position. 


@Coffee First Thing: Agree with Sayre Ambrosio. Coming across these hilarious and fitting descriptions of EN v10 on this forum has become part of my regular therapy now. It makes all the effort and time I've been wasting trying to purge 9 years of EN out of my system somewhat more tolerable.

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2 hours ago, DTLow said:

Same for me - At the top of my list is adding Applescript integration to the Mac app
There's also less critical features that I use (example Top List view)

I won't be switching to the Version 10 product until such work is completed

And HTML export, I guess ?

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On 11/9/2020 at 8:11 AM, toao said:

I completely share your feelings as well as your assessment. what a sad series of events...:-(. for reasons similar to yours and as you are a mac user, too, I have migrated over to Devonthink and must say am very happy with it with my specific use cases, in fact Devonthink is substantially more feature rich than EN as it turns out. the only limitations I found were 1) it only works in the apple ecosystem & 2) sharing notes / data is a lot more cumbersome than in evernote. if you are interested, I have summarized my transition experience over in their forums: https://discourse.devontechnologies.com/t/moving-from-evernote-to-devonthink-in-2020/59211

Thanks for the tip. Have bookmarked the link and am gonna check it out. Devonthink and KeepIt are both options I've yet to test out, mainly because I also use Android. Esp. if I'd like the option of accessing Devonthink on the web, I’d have to cough up $500 (if I didn’t remember wrongly). I’m sure you can imagine why I might have commitment phobia right now just after breaking off my decade-long affair with EN 😅 But yeah, I have not ruled out Devonthink as an option yet. It’s still on the cards. 

Update: I have ruled out Devonthink as an option too :( A member using Devonthink mentioned that there's no more tab functionality since they released the new version a year ago.

On 11/9/2020 at 9:52 AM, avevers said:

Perfectly put; I'm pretty much the same. I was a lurker on the forums until v10. I'm currently trying to trim the fat from my notebooks before I start the slow migration. But working across two note apps, each with their own way of working (and manually recreating internal links and OCR) is a massive, disruptive pain in the arse.

10.3, announced today, offers some hope, and a roadmap of sorts, but it's all about trust now. And I no longer trust Evernote. Too many ignored requests, ignored fixes and seemingly ignored beta feedback has done it for me. And yet I've not found an alternative that meets legacy (and no, I'm not going anywhere near Nimbus now).

Yep, Nimbus came up early as an option (Nice looking UI, easy EN import, responsive support, tempting price), but I ruled that out pretty quickly after security concerns were brought up on reddit, plus it lost some of my notes and failed to warn me about it during import.

There isn't one perfect Legacy replacement for me either, and all this testing and transition is a major pain in my butt too, but this episode has also opened my eyes. Made me realise I want to get to a place where I won't be held hostage by another app again. So am planning to spread my notes between 2-3 specialised apps, getting used to introducing markdown to my workflow etc. It's all giving me one helluva headache at the moment, but I know it'll get better. Just the withdrawal period I gotta grind through.

Tentatively, I've settled on Notion for web clipping and as a general hub and starting point for my links and references. Minus points: it's yet another Electron app so it's sluggish + no local storage. So this is where Obsidian + Typora come in. Using Obsidian to build on my writing/research content. I might not even need Typora after Obsidian's WYSIWYG editor is released, but for now I'm loving that Typora allows me to open as many notes as possible in tabs just like EN Legacy. Both Notion and Obsidian still have room to mature and I'm actually looking forward to that.

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6 minutes ago, h3artbe_at said:

Thanks for the tip. Have bookmarked the link and am gonna check it out. Devonthink and KeepIt are both options I've yet to test out, mainly because I also use Android. Esp. if I'd like the option of accessing Devonthink on the web, I’d have to cough up $500 (if I didn’t remember wrongly). I’m sure you can imagine why I might have commitment phobia after beaking off my decade-long affair with EN right now  But yeah, I have not ruled out Devonthink as an option yet. It’s still on the cards. 

Yep, Nimbus came up early as an option (Nice looking UI, easy EN import, responsive support, tempting price), but I ruled that out pretty quickly after security concerns were brought up on reddit, plus it lost some of my notes and failed to warn me about it during import.

There isn't one perfect Legacy replacement for me either, and all this testing and transition is a major pain in my butt too, but this episode has also opened my eyes. Made me realise I want to get to a place where I won't be held hostage by another app again. So am planning to spread my notes between 2-3 specialised apps, getting used to introducing markdown to my workflow etc. It's all giving me one helluva headache at the moment, but I know it'll get better. Just the withdrawal period I gotta grind through.

Tentatively, I've settled on Notion for web clipping and as a general hub and starting point for my links and references. Minus points: it's yet another Electron app so it's sluggish + no local storage. So this is where Obsidian + Typora come in. Using Obsidian to build on my writing/research content. I might not even need Typora after Obsidian's WYSIWYG editor is released, but for now I'm loving that Typora allows me to open as many notes as possible in tabs just like EN Legacy. Both Notion and Obsidian still have room to mature and I'm actually looking forward to that.

Great comment. I feel the same - happy (and excited) for a product to mature (Notion, Obsidian), but I'm veering towards trying to embrace markdown and choosing a tool simply as a front-end manager for a (massive) set of markdown files. That way I'd feel less locked in; less of a hostage as you put so well. Notion still feels locked in, although I do use it. Obsidian is also on my radar.

Evernote got stale and ignored too many users too many times. Joplin, for all it's immature UI and rough edges, is exciting, growing and has a collaborative development community. Typora, from my first few sessions, is a joy to use. And I'm starting to enjoy the "restrictions" of markdown. Forces you to get on with writing and thinking less about the presentation. I like that, although sometimes I still want a splash of colour in my notes.

Anyway, none of this changes the fact that my migration, which I had never planned nor wanted to do, will need a lot of planning and methodical hacking to get to work. I doubt v10.9999, or whatever they come out with, will ever match 6.25.

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On 11/2/2020 at 4:31 PM, michaelsalk said:

I am switching over to FREE OneNote. Can anyone think of a reason why I shouldn't?

Let me quote myself from another thread

16 minutes ago, Barabasz said:

I have one serious problem with OneNote, unfortunately. The philosophy of the program. All those notebooks, tabs (sections), notes and notes inside notes (floating text-boxes) ;) This information architecture doesn't convince me at all. OneNote is much more polished and powerful, no doubt about it (especially "inside" the single note). But all I want is to make very simple notes (usually plain text, headings, lists, images and attachments). And I need powerful (instant!) search engine. OneNote is a giant combine harvester. And I need a bicycle. So far Evernote was my bicycle, but now it is completely broken (I can't use Windows when Evernote is running, i can't use pencil 2 on my iPad, etc). Owners and developers don't give a *****. Sad but true. 

I was never convinced by OneNote. To complicated interface, especially desktop one, and too complicated note (all those floating text-boxes and other widgets - I always keep thing simple, one under another). What I love about Evernote is that I can collapse sidebar, and see only snippets on the left, and the content of a selected note on the other side. I don't have time for placing notes in certain stacks, stacks in notebooks etc. I keep all my notes in one gigantic notebook and rely entirely on search (and tags) because I don't like wasting time organizing things. But that is my way of using. This kind of user experience is impossible in OneNote (in my opinion). 

On the other side - I have an Office 365 subscription and I will have (I think it is the best office workspace and I am using OneDrive cloud as my primary storage). So OneNote is in a certain sense "for free".

But I'm still looking for something else... I was thinking about DEVONthink, but I work on Windows as well and they don't offer win app :(

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7 hours ago, Barabasz said:

Let me quote myself from another thread

I was never convinced by OneNote. To complicated interface, especially desktop one, and too complicated note (all those floating text-boxes and other widgets - I always keep thing simple, one under another). What I love about Evernote is that I can collapse sidebar, and see only snippets on the left, and the content of a selected note on the other side. I don't have time for placing notes in certain stacks, stacks in notebooks etc. I keep all my notes in one gigantic notebook and rely entirely on search (and tags) because I don't like wasting time organizing things. But that is my way of using. This kind of user experience is impossible in OneNote (in my opinion). 

On the other side - I have an Office 365 subscription and I will have (I think it is the best office workspace and I am using OneDrive cloud as my primary storage). So OneNote is in a certain sense "for free".

But I'm still looking for something else... I was thinking about DEVONthink, but I work on Windows as well and they don't offer win app :(

You're not alone. I found OneNote too complicated. 

I see Evernote 10 is improving on a regular basis. I continue to have hope for Evernote. (Especially if they give us the ability to put shortcuts at the top.)

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I've been a user of Evernote for nearly 8 years and been very happy but I am now considering moving away from it. Not only is the new version on iPad a really poor user experience, it now goes literally days without syncing across devices, and just lost a note. It was a very important note with a bunch of important actions I need to take from a big meeting. I didn't delete it, I clicked the green tick to ensure it was captured, and it's gone. That's just unforgivable. If I can't rely on it so that people can rely on me, then I can't use it.

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