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App Performance Issues: Slowness/Poor Responsiveness/Lag


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1 hour ago, OrbWeaver said:

I elected to go with Joplin so I could sync with my own WebDaV server. No more subscriptions and the data stays on my hardware (Synology NAS) where it can remain private. I never liked the idea of having my data stored on Google servers. I predict that within a year Google will buy EN at a rock-bottom price, slip a new privacy policy past people who don't read those things, and gobble up all those notes as advertising fodder  Or maybe not. Either way, my stuff won't be there 

If you don't mind me asking, how many EN notes are you migrating and what sorts of major challenges, if any, have you had migrating over to Joplin?

I don't currently have any plans to migrate away, but I'm curious just in case that changes.

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4 hours ago, OrbWeaver said:

I have had 2 Premium accounts for years. When I first saw the V10 I was overjoyed. For about a day. Then after a few weeks of hoping it was just a bad dream I realized they were serious and this was no practical joke. Both accounts are now cancelled, one expired last month, the other in a few months. Been migrating away and am almost done. Perhaps in 5 years I may look back at EN but it's useless to me now so I have to move on.

Just curious, but why didn't you just stick with Legacy 6.25.xx?

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I am running 6.25.1 (and 8.3 on Android) while moving away. At some point EN will announce that these versions will stop working. 

Maybe they will give 6-months notice. Maybe they will give 6-days notice. Maybe they will simply stop with a message to switch.

I no longer trust EN's judgement  and am concerned the latter scenario may be the one they choose. I'd rather get out gracefully than in a panic with a set of notes I may or may not have reliable access to. And there is no way v10 can be considered reliable. Missing notes, duplicate notes, notes that sort differently on different platforms. Not at all what I am used to or require.

6.25 (and 8.3) work very well but that's today. Tomorrow or next week may be vastly different.

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I've only got about 3000 notes, a small number compared to many people here. Moving to Joplin required that I export ENEX files and then click import in Joplin.

The resulting markdown is not pretty. I use tables a lot and tables in markdown are not the easiest thing. But when you toggle from markdown to WYSIWYG all is fine. The WYSIWYG editor is not up to EN 6.25 standards but it's acceptable and you can use external editors of your choice if desired.

The big thing for me is that the data is on MY server (NAS) and if I don't want to switch to a future version, I don't have to.  What I have will always work and can't be shut down by anybody but me. Ever.

I'd happily purchase it but it's free. Maybe they will start charging someday but what I currently have will always function so I don't have to switch if I don't want to. Ever.

It's missing the thumbnails but that's better than missing the notes themselves as I have found with EN10.

It's certainly not for everyone. But for my purposes it works well. My stuff would be better in a database but I prefer the lack of formal structure of a "notebook" style application.

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Who wants to run an own NAS should do so. It means being the admin of a small server, not rocket science, but another thing to take care of. These solutions don’t have all the features EN (or other server based apps) can offer, or you need to run several apps to pierce something together.

Who wants to focus on content and not in setting up and running the infrastructure is IMHO better served with a cloud based service, be it EN or else.

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Those who don't want to run their own server or don't have the necessary knowledge to get one running and keep it so should stay well away from the things. I went with a P&P Synology and while I had no experience with that particular device, I did have some experience years ago in setting up and managing large corporate networks. It's not something a non-techie newcomer would do in a weekend.

That said. For me it works. Took a few days to figure out the thing but I now spend zero time on making it work, it's just there. It will tell me if there's a problem with a drive and I'll replace that drive, but drives are more reliable than they used to be so there's very little maintenance. I did knoct it off the shelf a while back and it fell 6-feet to the floor. Lost a drive on that one but the NAS simply took the replacement drive and made it work. No work on my part after snapping in the new drive.

It's not for everyone. I'm not saying it would work for you or anyone else. But in my case it works. That's all I can say with confidence.

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17 hours ago, s2sailor said:

Some will say yes and others will say no.  Best to download it and try it out yourself.

Sound advice - "Your mileage may vary". 

==>Does the new Version (10.13) for Windows just work yet?

My mileage - It just worked well enough for me to upgrade my Mac version - something I had resisted doing since EN 10 was first released.

 

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Got it working and I must admit they have made some major advances towards making it usable. Lag at startup is much reduced and the delay bouncing between notes is minimal provided the note has been previously opened. 

There's still some issues (probably always will be) such as inserting the date (doesn't follow system settings) and the thumbnails being permanent, but at first glance it's looking pretty decent.

Android though is another story. I can't test that because instead of "just" working, it just doesn't work on my S4 tablet.

I'm going to keep playing with the Windows version. It's going in the right direction.

 

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Thanks for the forum feedback.

iOS, desktop and Web are all improving and are IMHO usable for day to day tasks. iOS in some aspects is now even better than the old clients (like nested tags and tables now supported, and the new editor really works fine on mobile).

The Android client seems to be the achilles heel at the moment - maybe the multitude of hardware and Android installations make it hard to fix.

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Just for the record since Android is being discussed. I don't use it heavily (mostly lookup not much entry), and I don't much like the new Home interface, but I haven't seen any bugs or extreme delays. (10.9 on pixel 3a)

I'm still sticking to 6.25.1 on my main Windows workhorse. Thrice burned, ten-times shy.

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I'm using EN10 on my Mac for home use and it is ok.  I still get the occasional white screen issue but not as frequently as some and I know they are working on that.

IOS is mostly OK except I can't download my large notebook for offline use Iike I was able to in prior versions.  I don't expect that to get fixed.  I will have to adjust how I use offline notebooks.

For work, I use Windows and I am running legacy there.  That workflow is too specialized to consider EN10 at this time.

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At my place of work I elected to download v10 on my windows 7 system.  However, in the process of doing that it deleted 6.25.1.  When I realized that I didn't like v10 it allowed me to download "Legacy" to replace it.  The problem, as I have posted before, is that I don't think Legacy (which appears to be 6.25.2) functions nearly as well as 6.25.1.  I'm not a techie type of person but I'm beginning to realize that any time I want to do something on Legacy at work, I usually try to defer doing it until I get home and can use the more stable version.  Without deep diving into all the issues, this tells me that the earlier version is simply better.  Now I am fearful of trying v10 at home because I think it will once again delete the only version of EN that I truly use.

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5 minutes ago, idoc said:

The problem, as I have posted before, is that I don't think Legacy (which appears to be 6.25.2) functions nearly as well as 6.25.1.

You can get 6.25.1 from FileHippo here.  

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Perhaps I spoke too soon. I did some "real" work using V10 on Win10. Didn't do too well so I tried a super-scientific test. I'm a two-finger, hunt-and-peck typist. I clicked on "New note" and started typing the alphabet. When I finished I looked at the screen to see what had registered. My note consisted of "yz" and nothing else. Is that called "lag" or is it considered the new normal?

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3 minutes ago, OrbWeaver said:

Perhaps I spoke too soon. I did some "real" work using V10 on Win10. Didn't do too well so I tried a super-scientific test. I'm a two-finger, hunt-and-peck typist. I clicked on "New note" and started typing the alphabet. When I finished I looked at the screen to see what had registered. My note consisted of "yz" and nothing else. Is that called "lag" or is it considered the new normal?

Thanks, OrbWeaver. I was just getting tempted to try an update. Will wait another month or more.

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14 minutes ago, OrbWeaver said:

Perhaps I spoke too soon. I did some "real" work using V10 on Win10. Didn't do too well so I tried a super-scientific test. I'm a two-finger, hunt-and-peck typist. I clicked on "New note" and started typing the alphabet. When I finished I looked at the screen to see what had registered. My note consisted of "yz" and nothing else. Is that called "lag" or is it considered the new normal?

That was my experience a month or so ago when I gave V10 Windows desktop a second spin on a backup (though faster) device.  It worked okay for a bit and then just kind of went paws up.  Though even when it was working okay it was SO slow compared to 6.25.1 legendary.  All the extra clicks didn't help productivity much either.  Hoping for better things in the summer, but staying where I am for now.

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I'm not on the fastest box in the world. Core I7, 6-cores, 12-thread, 4.2GHz, 16/256GB, 512GB SDD (15% used) but it's no slouch either. Looked really good right after install of the update from 10.11 to 10.13 but got slower and slower as I looked at different notebooks.

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Seems to download stuff, and gets stuck somehow.

Would it help to leave the client open and idle for a while, in the faint hope it does reorganize the database while sitting around ?

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No idea but it's worth a try. I'll give it an hour or two and see what happens. If that helps then we will know to write a note, go away for an hour, write next note  Allowing for 8 hours sleep we could write or read 16 notes every day. Can't beat that!

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On the mobile client it is better to do it like this, after installation. I had to reinstall on iOS several times (…), and the app felt better when I did not start to use it right away.

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On 1/18/2021 at 2:41 AM, Rafal108 said:

Yes it is bit quicker. Still far from being usable when it comes to lag.

and still the white screen - have to terminate via task manager to run again

Interesting. I've not experience this personally. I did in the early days, but not in the last month or so. Maybe two hangs, total in that time period.

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14 hours ago, OrbWeaver said:

I've only got about 3000 notes, a small number compared to many people here. Moving to Joplin required that I export ENEX files and then click import in Joplin.

The resulting markdown is not pretty. I use tables a lot and tables in markdown are not the easiest thing. But when you toggle from markdown to WYSIWYG all is fine. The WYSIWYG editor is not up to EN 6.25 standards but it's acceptable and you can use external editors of your choice if desired.

The big thing for me is that the data is on MY server (NAS) and if I don't want to switch to a future version, I don't have to.  What I have will always work and can't be shut down by anybody but me. Ever.

I'd happily purchase it but it's free. Maybe they will start charging someday but what I currently have will always function so I don't have to switch if I don't want to. Ever.

It's missing the thumbnails but that's better than missing the notes themselves as I have found with EN10.

It's certainly not for everyone. But for my purposes it works well. My stuff would be better in a database but I prefer the lack of formal structure of a "notebook" style application.

Thanks for all that!

I gave Joplin a fresh look last night and imported about 2,000 of my most active notes into it.

Unfortunately, Joplin is too rudimentary for my workflows. I immediately started hitting some walls and it would just mess with my world too much right now.  I probably generate 10 new notes a day on average and it start with the web clipper most of the time and then I have saved searches I use daily and the like.

But it was fine to give it a quick test.

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I think there is no „one app suits all“ for EN users. Depends on what one has stored, use cases etc. But it is for sure good practice to review alternatives from time to time - so thanks for reporting back.

What makes many alternatives hard to Test is that many free plans are very restricted, or don’t exist at all. What works with 20 notes may crumble if I throw several thousands on it.

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1 hour ago, PinkElephant said:

Seems to download stuff, and gets stuck somehow.

Would it help to leave the client open and idle for a while, in the faint hope it does reorganize the database while sitting around ?

Not sure what the client has to do with it at this point if V10 is server centric.  ;)

27 minutes ago, PinkElephant said:

I think there is no „one app suits all“ for EN users. Depends on what one has stored, use cases etc. But it is for sure good practice to review alternatives from time to time - so thanks for reporting back.

What makes many alternatives hard to Test is that many free plans are very restricted, or don’t exist at all. What works with 20 notes may crumble if I throw several thousands on it.

What if a still slow EN is better than the alternatives for a use case when legendary dies.  Not losing a lot of sleep over the concept but it would be sort of sad.😕

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On desktop I Have not checked. On mobile when you install the app, it has not app data, only the code. After the first login some downloading starts. I think that some search data, titles, text snippets and thumbnails are actually stored on device.

After a while it stops, the app then shows „app data“ in addition to the code. This is not yet download for offline use, which will add more data volume. 

As I said, no idea whether it is similar on desktop, but probably worth a try. Using more advanced methods (like LittleSnitch to see the traffic) it should be possible to observe what is going on.

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I use ODS (On Demand Sync) with legendary on a backup Windows machine, Surface to be exact.  If not familiar with ODS only summary data is kept for notes until you access them.  Then the note contents are downloaded and stick around until they get slacked off based upon some algorithm unbeknownst to me.   Helps shrink data base size.  Search happens on the server.  V10 reminded me a bit of ODS on the data side when it appeared.

If I open EN after a whiles away on the Surface there is a startup pause as a sync occurs.  But after that all is well.  I haven't noticed any pauses to reset itself.  Don't know what it means.  You wouldn't think there would be different backends for V10 and Legendary....  Just a useless tidbit I suppose. 🤷‍♂️

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8 hours ago, hanseric said:

I gave Joplin a fresh look last night and imported about 2,000 of my most active notes into it.

Unfortunately, Joplin is too rudimentary for my workflows.

I took a very brief look at 'NimbusNote' approx. 5 months ago, but figured I'd wait-n-see if EN got it's game together.

I took another look yesterday, using the web client, and I was amazed. Format Painter, Table of Contents inside a note linking to Headings 1-2-3, so jump links to anywhere inside the note (esp useful for me as i have many long form notes.  Use of blocks to design the page, unlimited nested folders, 1GB file size upload/note size limit etc etc... plus half the $$ price for similar specs compared to EN.  However search seemed lousy, and I remember having some issues with their data security that I will need to revisit.

But overall I was so impressed and given its 8 months later and EN still don't appear to be on top of their game, yet, means I will most likely put some criteria together of most important stuff I'm after in a note-taking/knowledge management system then compare and make a call whether to stay or go.

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I genuinly want to love and use evernote. But I can't. It's just so unreliable lately... I can't write some small text without the program just freezing on me every single time I right click on anything. I have a very powerful ASUS  laptop that can edit 4K footage and play the most demanding video games. Yet... evernote makes the system freeze or crash. I just can't handle it anymore. The new features are always welcome but not at the cost of performance. I just don't see why would anyone pay a premium for a app that doesn't deliver in it's most important selling point: a fast, secure and reliable place to store all your notes.

Evernote used to be my go to place to save anything I had on my mind. Now I literally use Google keep while I write my notes and them later store them in my evernote. I would greatly benefit in having more than two devices... but untill the whole performance and bugs things is resolve for good I'm sticking to the basic free plan. I already invested a lot of my thought process into evernote. I just don't want to go trough the process of moving to a different app when I already have a functional system.

I honestly wish the best of luck to the developers behind evernote. Worse case escenario. I'll be forced to just move to some other app that just works. :'(

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I too tried Nimbus Note but that was quite some time ago. I didn't renew my subscription as I was nervous about sending money (as well as my data) over to Russia where they are located. They did open a Cleveland office (mail drop?) but I never went back to them. After I had cancelled the subscription and had confirmation it was cancelled they still went ahead and billed.my card. Joke was on them since I had used a prepaid card and there wasn't enough left on it to cover their new  charge. Jokes on me then as they kept trying, a dollar lower each time, until one went through. The card issuer told me this after I filed a complaint. Maybe they have changed but I've still got a bad memory of them and won't be going their way again.

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Nimbus Notes I will say is quite good.    Evernote really needs to take notice if they haven't already.
However, something that really makes me question Nimbus is something so simple -- I have notes in EN that are generated by IFTTT triggers - they dump into Evernote throughout the day based on time, location, etc.

When I setup the same functions to Nimbus, they get their, but their ios app says the note was created with an 'old editor'.  I can use the web or desktop to open the app, or let iOS convert the note.

What a mess!  There should be no need for this - that should be auto handled on the back end seamlessly.  Despite numerous reports to Nimbus, they refuse to deal wtih this 'minor', but 'huge' problem.   For some reason, this problem alone leaves me a very uneasy feeling with Nimbus. 

Tl:DR - There is no perfect app - unless you're a developer and you're building yourself a app that does exactly what you want, and how you want it.   Otherwise, other apps will be fast enough for some, not fast enough for others.  Too many bloated features for you, but yet not enough features for me.   But since we're in an EN forum, let's just hope Evernote gets back on track to being the best!

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I can't even use it anymore. It's unbelievably  slow. I'm looking to drop my subscription and find a new note taking app. I tried to stick it out  but I just can't. 

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So I tried v10 again today just to see if it had improved.  Right away I ran into the deal breaker problem that was there initially: I had 5 pdf files that I wanted to download into EN so I saved each one to my "save to evernote folder".  With EN legacy (or any previous version) you immediately see a notification that a file is being copied to EN and then you see it appear in your inbox.  Alternatively, you can hit the sync button and you will see your files in  seconds.  With v10 I save the 5  files to evernote but I don't see any notification.  So I wait for a full 2 minutes and then I see that 2 of the 5 files have made it to the inbox.  I keep waiting but the other 3 are not there.  I then close the program and re-open and now I see that the fourth pdf is now there.  Where's the fifth?  A keep waiting and suddenly I see it  in the inbox.  What used to be a seamless 5 second process has now turned into a whole procedure.  I copy files over to EN all day and this is just a deal breaker. 

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Completely agree! It appears after the amount of time that has passed that those whose workflow requires fast and nimble distribution of files will no longer be served by EN once Legacy no longer has full functionality for whatever reason(a). 
 

What is the solution? Competition does not seem capable-at least to tick all the boxes of how I have integrated EN with my business workflow. I use two separate Premium accounts, one business and one personal.

 

Maybe it’s a multi app solution? Bo one has offered up a single app solution that would seamlessly replace our old friend.

 

 

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It's certainly not for everyone but I found Joplin suited my needs. I needed only a note taking app with attachments and wanted something that could work offline. It will sync with many providers like Dropbox but I needed something that would sync with my NAS using WebDaV. Joplin was the only thing I found. Plus, it's free.

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On 5/11/2021 at 11:52 AM, WeCanLearnAnything said:

Does the new Version (10.13) for Windows just work yet?

 

On 5/11/2021 at 11:57 AM, s2sailor said:

Some will say yes and others will say no.  Best to download it and try it out yourself.

 

On 5/11/2021 at 12:23 PM, TK0047 said:

...

Everybody uses Evernote in a different way, certain features are important to some users and some users could not care less about those same features. So as S2sailor suggest, best to download and try it out yourself. 

 

On 5/11/2021 at 12:25 PM, PinkElephant said:

Depends on what you mean by just working.

There are enough use cases fully supported - others depending on features not yet supported, or permanently removed will now or for the future not work.

In comparison the v10 client uses more system resources than the prior version, and lives from a stable internet connection. Depending on your setup, you will notice, or you won’t. I am running it on a 9 year old i7 HP desktop (plus on a Mac plus on iOS devices), and regard it as „working“ (more than „just“).

Go and find out … installing another client doesn’t cost more than a little time to set it up. Legacy is still around if v10 does not do the job.

 

These responses just do not sound promising to me. When I say "Do the brakes work?", people pretty much know that means "Do the brakes slow and stop the car as expected?" and thus nobody says "Well, there are lots of different ways brakes can work and you never really know until you try."

I need nothing fancy from Evernote as I mainly use it to store recipes and have otherwise migrated away. Typing, reading, saving data, pasting images, that's pretty much it. I'm worried that if I try V10, Evernote will cause my entire computer to lag and screwy things will happen with legacy and my data.

Sounds like I will have to wait at least a few more months before trying V10. :(

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A number of posts recently have asked the question "Does Evernote v10 just work?" and a recent post drew a comparison question of the automotive sector, "Do the brakes work?", thinking it should be s simple answer.

In order to use the automotive analogy the question would have to be rephrased "Does the car work?" rather than just the brakes. The answer would be, yes. The car works. 

But sometimes when you step on the gas, the brakes come on and sometimes the opposite happens. Hit the brakes and it speeds up.

Sometimes when you steer to the right the car goes to the left. Sometimes it shifts into reverse without you doing anything. Lots of times it will stall halfway through an intersection.

But yes, the car works.

Evernote v10 is similar. One minute you are typing away, laying down some earth-shaking notes and everything you typed about saving the planet in the last hour has turned into a recipe for cupcakes. Some would say this is not all bad, cupcakes might actually save the world, but is Evernote working?

Yes. But not the way it used to. It's not as reliable. You can't depend on it to keep things safe the way it used to. Access to a particular note used to be instant or pretty close. Now, the cupcakes may burn before EN gets the note rendered that tells you how long to keep them in the oven. Or it may tell you that you should change the oil every 5000 miles when you urgently need the information on where that new cancer treatment was located..

So is Evernote v10 just OK. Does the car work? Yes. But I wouldn't pay money for that. There's no warranty, so while it works, it may not work for you. If it works today, there's no guarantee it will work tomorrow and while you can search for a particular note, it may not return the one you want.

Save the planet or make cupcakes. Flip a coin. That's Evernote 10. It works. Just. 

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4 hours ago, OrbWeaver said:

A number of posts recently have asked the question "Does Evernote v10 just work?" and a recent post drew a comparison question of the automotive sector, "Do the brakes work?", thinking it should be s simple answer.

In order to use the automotive analogy the question would have to be rephrased "Does the car work?" rather than just the brakes. The answer would be, yes. The car works. 

But sometimes when you step on the gas, the brakes come on and sometimes the opposite happens. Hit the brakes and it speeds up.

Sometimes when you steer to the right the car goes to the left. Sometimes it shifts into reverse without you doing anything. Lots of times it will stall halfway through an intersection.

But yes, the car works.

Evernote v10 is similar. One minute you are typing away, laying down some earth-shaking notes and everything you typed about saving the planet in the last hour has turned into a recipe for cupcakes. Some would say this is not all bad, cupcakes might actually save the world, but is Evernote working?

Yes. But not the way it used to. It's not as reliable. You can't depend on it to keep things safe the way it used to. Access to a particular note used to be instant or pretty close. Now, the cupcakes may burn before EN gets the note rendered that tells you how long to keep them in the oven. Or it may tell you that you should change the oil every 5000 miles when you urgently need the information on where that new cancer treatment was located..

So is Evernote v10 just OK. Does the car work? Yes. But I wouldn't pay money for that. There's no warranty, so while it works, it may not work for you. If it works today, there's no guarantee it will work tomorrow and while you can search for a particular note, it may not return the one you want.

Save the planet or make cupcakes. Flip a coin. That's Evernote 10. It works. Just. 

The real question here is, did you take a chance and draft this in Evernote before posting? 

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No. I drafted it using Joplin then did a copy/paste. I need a dark mode (eyesight issues) and don:t trust EN10 after losing a bunch of notes yesterday. A bunch were in multiple notebooks at the same time and vanished when I tried to move them around. Not the first time either.

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I don't want to beat a dead horse on this one, but I still think that the inability to force a sync with the new version is simply a deal breaker.  About a half hour ago I sent an email from gmail to evernote 6.25.  I pressed sync a few times on EN6.25 to confirm that it had arrived and I am done.  Now I know that this critical info is in my inbox and waiting for me to act upon it later in the day.  However, I don't have the ability to do this with v10 ie: when I send anything there I need to hope that it shows up but I can't be sure.  This means that EN v10 can not be part of my critical workflow.  It's probably fine for casual use, hobbyists etc.  I think that if they give it the ability to sync at will it may make a huge difference for power users.

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Look at the bottom right corner of your clients screen.

You see the current sync status there. It usually is as synced as it can be, which means up to date. Notes unsynced on the local client are marked as such.

To see how it is going I tested syncing while having both legacy and v10 open side by side. New content from iOS, new content from scanning, new content from the WebClipper or via e-Mail. There may be a small difference when content appears in one and the other, but usually we are talking a few seconds, max. a minute or so in difference.

Keep in mind that syncing in v10 means „showing it is on the server“, whereas in legacy it means „transferred to the local database“. The word „synced“ does not mean exactly the same on both clients.

So as much as I would like the sync button to return, EN has a say when they try to convince us it is no longer needed.

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29 minutes ago, PinkElephant said:

whereas in legacy it means „transferred to the local database

Interesting! So when there are 10 unsynced notes, they are just in the program's memory, not even in the local database? You're sure of that?

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No, it means that legacy shows the content of the local database after it was copied from the server, whereas v10 is set on replicating what is on the server at that moment.

In legacy you basically always work on your local data. When it syncs, it upsyncs more than it downsyncs, because all changes are made locally first. Only what comes fresh from the server is downsynced first.

v10 as I read it (no detailed knowledge, just observation) executes changes on the server, with only a local caching or similar. It behaves like a browser session that manipulates data on the web, not like an app with a local database.

Take a multi-note operation like merging notes or tagging several ones with the same tags: In legacy it is executed in one go, and then the result is synced with the server. In v10 it is executed in little steps, and each step first syncs before the next is done.

There is local data, but it seems to be relevant only when working offline.

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On 5/12/2021 at 10:20 PM, RavBoy said:

I took a very brief look at 'NimbusNote' approx. 5 months ago, but figured I'd wait-n-see if EN got it's game together.

I took another look yesterday, using the web client, and I was amazed. Format Painter, Table of Contents inside a note linking to Headings 1-2-3, so jump links to anywhere inside the note (esp useful for me as i have many long form notes.  Use of blocks to design the page, unlimited nested folders, 1GB file size upload/note size limit etc etc... plus half the $$ price for similar specs compared to EN.  However search seemed lousy, and I remember having some issues with their data security that I will need to revisit.

But overall I was so impressed and given its 8 months later and EN still don't appear to be on top of their game, yet, means I will most likely put some criteria together of most important stuff I'm after in a note-taking/knowledge management system then compare and make a call whether to stay or go.

I'll give that a fresh look at some point too. I tried Nimbus about the same time as you did, it would seem, and it was too rough for me.

Can't hurt to look again though.

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8 hours ago, PinkElephant said:

No, it means that legacy shows the content of the local database after it was copied from the server, whereas v10 is set on replicating what is on the server at that moment.

In legacy you basically always work on your local data. When it syncs, it upsyncs more than it downsyncs, because all changes are made locally first. Only what comes fresh from the server is downsynced first.

v10 as I read it (no detailed knowledge, just observation) executes changes on the server, with only a local caching or similar. It behaves like a browser session that manipulates data on the web, not like an app with a local database.

Take a multi-note operation like merging notes or tagging several ones with the same tags: In legacy it is executed in one go, and then the result is synced with the server. In v10 it is executed in little steps, and each step first syncs before the next is done.

There is local data, but it seems to be relevant only when working offline.

There is a way to merge with v10 or web?   How do you do that?

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Has anyone figured out a way to have pdfs in v10 display as "view as attachment" instead of the first page of the pdf?  I can change each one individually if I want to but I have thousands of others in my notes.  For example, if I have a note with 10 pdf's (ABC Statements 2010-2020) I am unable to see 10 pdf thumbnails all in a neat row so that I can open exactly the one I want.  Instead, the entire note is taken up by the first pages of each pdf sequentially.  There is no way to directly see the 2020 pdf unless you scroll down like crazy.  I can select "view as attachment" for each of the 10 pdfs which solves the problem for that particular note, but I have thousands of notes with pdfs and it doesn't solve the problem.  This has really screwed up my work flow.

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7 minutes ago, PinkElephant said:

Select the notes, right click, select merge from the popup menu. Not possible on mobile.

I am not seeing that.  I am using windows 7 desktop.  The popup says "2 notes selected" and then gives me the option to "Move, edit tags, add to shortcuts, Move to Trash".  There is no merge option.  Also, is there a quick way to delete a note?  The only thing I have found is to highlight the note and go to "More Options" on the upper screen and then select "Move to Trash".  On v6.25  I could use the delete key or R click and delete.  I found a list of keyboard shortcuts and one of them was "Ctrl-backspace" to delete a note; however, that didn't work either.

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2 hours ago, idoc said:

I am using windows 7 desktop.  The popup says "2 notes selected" and then gives me the option to "Move, edit tags, add to shortcuts, Move to Trash".

When you select multiple notes you should see a blue multiselect menu appear, One of the options is to merge. This doesn't work in the web browser version of EN

 

image.png.f6ee560fce6a424d07886a1ed32988b2.png

3 hours ago, idoc said:

Also, is there a quick way to delete a note?  The only thing I have found is to highlight the note and go to "More Options" on the upper screen and then select "Move to Trash".  On v6.25  I could use the delete key or R click and delete.  I found a list of keyboard shortcuts and one of them was "Ctrl-backspace" to delete a note; however, that didn't work either.

ctrl-backspace was the way to delete a note in earlier versions of V10. Now it is simply to make sure the note is highlighted in the note list and press the delete key. You can get the up to date list of shortcuts in the app by either:

  • ctrl+/
  • help -> keyboard shortcuts
  • Hitting the tiny keyboard icon at the bottom right of the sidebar. 
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Adding my voice to the complaints about the performance of the new web apps. I fully realised how slow they are on going back to Evernote legacy which works fine.

Some particular points: you can select a note and it displays immediately. On the New version you have two wait just for the note to display. You can no longer move more than 50 notes. Simple things like merging, moving and tagging are all slow. there are still differences between desktop and the chrome app (you still can't add a reminder).

Each successive version of Evernote up till now has required more processing power. I had to upgrade a tablet previously just to run it. This should not be the case: new versions should be faster not slower and provide improvements and added functionality (or are you happy to follow the Microsoft bloatware model?).

The real thing that clinched it for me was also seeing the offering from your what seems to be your closest competitor - Nimbus. The app is faster (it resembles Evernote legacy) but is also a better editor with easy headings, a useful and accessible content overview.

The experiment that Evernote seems to be running in this new web technology is failing and losing it customers. I keep seeing vociferous complaints from users. My initial realisation was triggered by somebody on Reddit expressing surprise that I was staying with the app when so many are jumping overboard.

Evernote is going to lose out and it's destroying its up till now unassailable position. I think it has gone to sleep, perhaps resting on its laurels of having been the most successful note app for the last 10 years and providing industrial strength synchronisation. Even this seems to be falling apart with notes missing.

I received a questionnaire from Evernote about two years ago asking whether we would like Evernote to become a task manager. The only thing I have seen in this vein are reminders, which do not fit the bill for real task management.

Other than that the basic functionality has not changed ever. The apps have just become more clunky on all platforms (not sure about Mac).

 

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On 5/13/2021 at 11:23 PM, Jennifrann said:

I can't even use it anymore. It's unbelievably  slow. I'm looking to drop my subscription and find a new note taking app. I tried to stick it out  but I just can't. 

Try Nimbus. It still has a couple of things to iron out for me such as shortcuts working on an azerty keyboard, but its fast like Evernote legacy and provides more functionality like a content block. The editor is like Guttenberg on WordPress and just feels right. You can work on android easily using it as a real editor. Evernote android is now horrible.

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I just realized that I've been using the web version to demo the Windows desktop version and they are not quite the same.  The reason why I'm doing that is because when I installed ENv10 at work it uninstalled v6.25.  It gave me the option to reinstall "Legacy" but I'm convinced that the legacy version was not as good as the version of EN that I use at home (the one just prior to Legacy).  I'm terrified to have this happen again on my home computer on which EN runs my entire life.  Nonetheless, I would like to have a way to keep playing with ENv10 and see if it is improving.  Is there any 100% safe way to do this whereby it will not uninstall my desktop version?  I've seen various suggestions on this forum but was wondering if people had tried this themselves.

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So we all know there are slowness issues, especially on the mobile app for Android (I haven't used iOS)...

The question is; What will Evernote do about it? I cannot pay premium for an APP that is useless!

 

Thankfully, I haven't had a problem with the Windows desktop version. But the Android APP is not usable at all!

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They will do what they did the last months: Collect, code, fix, release.

It worked pretty good for iOS, so I think they will do a similar job for Android as well.

The problems with Android compared to iOS are well known: The hardware is much more diverse, manufacturers add their „flavors“ to the basic OS, there are few updates, and the updates already stop for relatively young devices.

So instead of supporting iOS 13 and 14 only (because even i-devices 6 years old will run this OS), you probably have to start with Android 10/11 and work your way down to 6. This means it is probably much harder to release an optimized app for Android that will work on all devices, with all settings and with good performance.

So it is try, try again. 

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Just a minor note about latest (EN 10.13.4) on MacOS 10.15.7. (This is not a critical installation for me, so I keep it updated -- vs my critical Windows installation which I keep on 6.25.1.)

Today, started EN, wrote a new note, seemed fine. Then tried to open another note by clicking on its snippet. Just blank. Likewise for other notes. Waited a few minutes, no change. Quit and restarted EN. Now I was able to open notes.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯   

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6 hours ago, jdmarch said:

Just a minor note about latest EN...

... tried to open another note by clicking on its snippet. Just blank. Likewise for other notes. Waited a few minutes, no change. Quit and restarted EN. Now I was able to open notes.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯   

So sometimes Evernote allows you to read your notes and sometimes it does not.

Like, whatevs, amirite?

¯\_(ツ)_/¯   

It's probably time for Evernote employees to devote a bunch of resources to updating the color scheme on the home screen.

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  • 2 weeks later...

I am facing very high CPU & Power usage issue with Windows app version 10.15.6 (and MS store app too!).

 

Looking at the history of the similar issues reported, would anyone please suggest me a solution if there is one.

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One solution I use is to stay with the Legacy version until they fix v10.xxx. 10 has been horrible about a lot of things, but it does seem to be slowly improving, which is a glimmer of hope. I have them both running at the same time to compare operations.

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This is the first time I've experienced this, but I've had the new Evernote opened in the background on a laptop that has 8 GB of RAM and a "ultrabook" Intel Core i5 5th gen CPU, and it's one of three apps currently running that's just eating up CPU time. This is after intensive use with 3 windows open, one of which was inactive, I was using it for quite a few hours excluding loads of hibernations and sleeps. RAM usage went up to almost 1.5 GB, way more than my Pale Moon and Firefox sessions combined (I have a tab unloader extension installed and way more tabs open in the former).

2081846295_Screenshot(421a).png.885f2ed1c2352921852c70e05a3f722d.png

I managed to fix this by killing the process for the Evernote client component that was using up the most resources, which crashed the main window and allowed me to restart it. I thought this would pull up that Chrome "Aw, snap" thing (or "This page is having a problem" in Edge), but it pulled this up instead, which is probably an Electron thing in an attempt to hide as much of Chrome as possible.

1196195126_Screenshot(422a).thumb.png.817e5b1fecd38bbe1ee148ade0a69eeb.png

Since the main window was the resource hog, I suspect this was a result of me clicking on various notes and opening (and jumping between)various pages in the main window.

In the legacy client (which you can see in the bottom left corner of the screenshot above), I can hide the note pane, but I can't do that on the modern client!

Ugh. I could go back to the legacy client, but here's the problem:

  • While
  • the legacy client is less of a resource hog than the modern client, and
  • the legacy client has lots of features and settings that the modern client lacks,
  • here's the catch:
  • The modern client has several new features that the legacy client lacks, AND
  • some of my notes are dependent on features only available in the modern client, AND
  • no separate legacy client is available for Android, only Windows and Mac OS.

Ugh. 😵💫😠🤯

I think I have to go into a rant.

If Evernote based their new clients on the Firefox platform, using code from Firefox, Thunderbird, and SeaMonkey, they could have a client that not only uses theoretically less resources, but uses native-ish UI elements, and could have support for Firefox themes, tabs, and extensions, the Rust programming language, SeaMonkey profiles modified to allow users to log in to multiple accounts, and a UI that's much more customisable!

Rant over. Ugh. Ughhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Sometimes one of the subprocesses seems to keep running, wasting system resources. Annoying, and I hope they get this fixed. Probably it is not a single issue hidden in a lot of code.

If the app gets stalked, quit the app (on Windows I think ctrl q, or through the menu), restart it, done.

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Quitting the app does NOT help. EN-Process keep alive to speed up re-starts. The only way to surely kill them is to use the Task Manager.

This methodology is OK in most cases (Legacy did the same). But sometimes it is a pain if a restart is blocked by any broken subprocess 😞.

@kbhasi: Yes, with new Tasks feature they invite users to use EN-10 without getting beloved old features running (Import folders, compact and fluidy UI, overall-speed, sparingly resource usage, ...). Their decision - hope they will "support" Legacy for a long time...

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And BTW: Commands like

  • taskkill /f /fi "imagename eq Evernote*"

seem usefull (kills all Evernote-Processes in one action) but also kill Legacy-processes because they carry the same name 😞

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Quitting the app does NOT help. EN-Process keep alive to speed up re-starts. The only way to surely kill them is to use the Task Manager.

I am on Windows and when I quit the app, all EN-Process exit except Evernote Clipper. I have had the same problem as @kbhasi and when EN acts up using GB ram or 100% CPU, I quit and restart the app.

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23 hours ago, PinkElephant said:

Do you close the app (click the cross) or really quit it ?

Closing it leaves processes running in the background.

I did menu item File/Quit Evernote. My reply was to comment that "Quitting the app does NOT help. EN-Process keep alive to speed up re-starts. " which is not true. I have never closed Evernote the way you you mentioned when I want to quit  evernote.

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You are right - as I'm used to quit my Windows apps by clicking the "X" right in the title bar (which normally sends a WM_QUIT message to the application to quit itself), I did not see the difference, sorry.

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Just for your background: Imagine EN as an app running inside of a browser. When you „x“ it, the app stops, but the browser stays alive.

We are talking some sort of bug here, that lets a browser process run in circles somehow, eating system resources.

When you really quit, all browser processes are terminated, and you get a fresh start.

To help solve this problem, it would be good to send EN a support ticket, with the activity log. Maybe it helps them to catch that bugger !

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I'm having performance issues as well.  The main issue is:

  • With Evernote open in the background, when switching back to a note and start typing there's often a delay/pause of 5-6 seconds before the text catches up.  Makes things really awkward for quick note taking.
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I used the "import folder" function and got 200 empty files with no attachments. Okay, I told myself, and decided to delete them. The process of deleting notes took 40 minutes. Conclusion: It took almost an hour of my life to make sure that the Evernote developers were doing something wrong. Hey, why is it so slow? Make Evernote Fast Again!

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New feature ! Let us drop 200 files at it ! Oh didn’t work ? Let’s delete 200 notes ! Oh, took very long ?!

What do we learn ? When I do X, Y follows. When I do 200X, 200Y follows. You just invested an hour to prove this simple concept - thank you for trying.

Others try on a smaller scale, and maybe observe the forum for feedback.

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@PinkElephantU R defending EV's testing capabilities... it is a poor show, after all these months of defective updates... If this poor quality was done by hospital employees or airliners.... 

How can you still be positive and find excuses (or at least try to) for this company.... When you pay this much money for a service it should be on level after months and months of buggy updates.... and no upgrades.

 

Sorry but when is enough enough? 

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If it is enough for you, simply look for an alternative and move on !

Could myself not yet test import folders, since I am traveling light with iPad only. But I assure you, it won’t be by blindly throwing as much files at it as I can find.

But anybody can run his own test, now that it is available.

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3 hours ago, PinkElephant said:

New feature ! Let us drop 200 files at it ! Oh didn’t work ? Let’s delete 200 notes ! Oh, took very long ?!

What do we learn ? When I do X, Y follows. When I do 200X, 200Y follows. You just invested an hour to prove this simple concept - thank you for trying.

Others try on a smaller scale, and maybe observe the forum for feedback.

Why did you decide that I am testing new features? I had several hundred files accumulated that I was going to add to Evernote. That's what I need Evernote for. I shared the result on the forum. What confuses you? Notion deletes notes in seconds. But if you think that for a year of developer experiments that I pay for with my subscription, I need to be silent, you and I have conceptual differences on the main question: why the product I'm paying for doesn't work as it should?

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7 hours ago, Vitaliy Grinchuk said:

I used the "import folder" function and got 200 empty files with no attachments. Okay, I told myself, and decided to delete them. The process of deleting notes took 40 minutes. Conclusion: It took almost an hour of my life to make sure that the Evernote developers were doing something wrong. Hey, why is it so slow? Make Evernote Fast Again!

That's bad. Suggest you open a support ticket to make sure Evernote sees this and hopefully improves it in a future update.

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1 hour ago, PinkElephant said:

If it is enough for you, simply look for an alternative and move on !

Could myself not yet test import folders, since I am traveling light with iPad only. But I assure you, it won’t be by blindly throwing as much files at it as I can find.

But anybody can run his own test, now that it is available.

O don't U worry about me, I've moved on... But just curious why you are so positive about this poor performance from the company EV...I really don't know anyone who has anything positive about this crappy software.

So I was just wondering why..

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3 minutes ago, Paul A. said:

That's bad. Suggest you open a support ticket to make sure Evernote sees this and hopefully improves it in a future update.

Yep, let's build a car... oops square wheels are very bumpy on the road... let make an update in a couple of weeks.... try triangles

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And they wonder why I am hanging on to 6.25.1 until V10 speed is fixed, or I have to move on, though I hope it doesn't come to that.   Though I have already replicated all of my local notes outside of EN, just in case that day comes.  The one thing that cannot be done with V10 period.

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OK, I tried the following:

  • Define an import folder
  • Copy 204 PDF files to that folder
    • ... have been imported to EN-10-16 within seconds
    • ... all PDF-/files/ are available within the 204 /notes/: OK
  • Tried to delete these 204 /notes/
    • ... by selecting as much as possible (50)
      • then click Delete...
      • ... and repeat from selecting ...

This tooks some minutes for every set of 50 notes 😞. CPU is heavily loaded:
image.png.061475e4fad38777fb89adda31870855.png

So - You are right: selecting and deleting a group of notes is a nightmare. Can't imagine what is such difficult to do this. EN-Legacy does it immediately (as fast as I click).

But this is not a new finding. Importing notes works great (but should offer a checkbox to immediately delete the files from import folder after import is done - as Legacy 😉).

@EN-Support: My CPU did not calm down during the last 25 minutes. EN window tells me that all 204 notes have been moved to trash. ==> CPU is loaded because of sync activity in the background... - huh, so many open things to do 😞 - PLEASE get EN-10 runnning as smooth as Legacy - before offering new features (like Notes, Calendars, ...)

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Addendum: EN shows "Änderungen werden synchronisiert" ("syncing changes"), WLAN is free but never touched ==> What does my CPU do in the meanwhile (except heating my office)?

image.png.7646d94dfdbe2471fe3b0312a8ac90b8.png

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One of the features that keeps me firmly embedded in EN is the OCR and resulting ability to search notes, handwriting, PDFs, etc.  I've not found any alternative solutions that will do that as seamlessly as EN has.

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3 minutes ago, hanseric said:

One of the features that keeps me firmly embedded in EN is the OCR and resulting ability to search notes, handwriting, PDFs, etc.  I've not found any alternative solutions that will do that as seamlessly as EN has.

100% true, this is the only argument for EN... but really the only one.... when the competitors catches up with this I'm afraid Evernote won't make it another year

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I'm trying to use v10, I'm really trying... but man it is so painfully SLOW!

Ctrl+N to create a new note, you have to wait a bit until the new note load

Move Notes, you have to wait while the notes move

Create a note from a template I made, you have to wait while the template loads

Nothing is snappy. I get that it is a web app, but look at Spotify and other software which were built on the same electron, they are way more snappier.

Evernote, we don't want HOME or tasks, we want the software to work faster and without bugs. Work on that first

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@Faisal Malallah No, it is not state of the art when you need to wait for the software.

  • What sort of computer are you using ?
  • Running the system from an SSD ?
  • How fast is your internet connection?

These are probably the 3 main questions about your setup. 

I run v10 on a MacBook Pro / i7 / Gigabit cable Internet, and the speed of the v10 client is OK. The only short waiting times arise when I do operations on multiple notes.

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1 hour ago, PinkElephant said:

@Faisal Malallah No, it is not state of the art when you need to wait for the software.

  • How fast is your internet connection?

 

A major problem is this - speed of internet connection - and for the DESKTOP app - this should NOT be an issue.  It's downloaded all of our notes and attachments - there is no need for constant connections back to the cloud data.

I work 'mobile' a lot - and sometimes have spotty wifi - or don't even have wifi - and it is a BRUTAL experience.  I waited over 2 minutes to delete a few (maybe 5 or 6)  notes the other day.  

Whatever EN is doing in the background on the desktop apps needs a major overhaul and some streamlining.   We all can't be sitting with direct fiber connections constantly. 

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Desktop has a setting to preserve data locally when closing the app. Have not really tried what happens when I have it active and go offline. 

Whenever online EN tries to connect to the server, and use the database there.

On mobile there are the offline notebooks. You can select which ones you want to carry along - all or a selected few.

When this is done, you can go offline (flight mode) and continue working. From my experience this is better than trying to work with an instable internet connection. Offline notebooks work really well on my iPhone and iPad.

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We should not have to search for workarounds. Syncing has be a background task that has to work silently and without any influence on interactive work. Interactive work has to be as fluidy as we know it from Legacy (the one and only workaround 😉)

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In general I agree, and that is from my experience what v10 usually does.

There are maybe exceptions from that rule:

  • On mobile I know I will leave a WiFi area, syncing after that would cut into my mobile data volume. Forcing a last sync is IMHO a good thing.
  • I am in the office, laptop docked, and I have just finished work. I am running late - it is calming my nerves (even if completely unnecessary) when I can hit a button to force a sync before undocking.

In fact I had a syncing issue some days ago. I had worked on an iOS client and on the Mac. Upsync was fine from both devices - but the Mac did not downsync what was created and synced from the iOS client. I checked on the web client - the note was there, but it took long until it finally made it to the Mac. No sync option, no way to force it.

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On 6/27/2021 at 5:44 PM, PinkElephant said:

@Faisal Malallah No, it is not state of the art when you need to wait for the software.

  • What sort of computer are you using ?
  • Running the system from an SSD ?
  • How fast is your internet connection?

These are probably the 3 main questions about your setup. 

I run v10 on a MacBook Pro / i7 / Gigabit cable Internet, and the speed of the v10 client is OK. The only short waiting times arise when I do operations on multiple notes.

i7 Desktop with 16 GB of Ram

SSD

100mb fast internet

I'm pretty sure it's not my setup. 

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38 minutes ago, Faisal Malallah said:

i7 Desktop with 16 GB of Ram

SSD

100mb fast internet

I'm pretty sure it's not my setup. 

V10 desktop is without a doubt slower than V6.25.1 no matter your setup.  It has improved in my toe dipping for simple note navigation, though still slower.  I have not tried but more complicated multi note activities are reported to be more impacted.  Probably not the worst for a casual user but if you use EN to manage a paperless life style it could get annoying.  Hence I an still on 6.25.1.  Hoping this speed issue is fixed before that version sunsets.

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5 hours ago, Faisal Malallah said:

i7 Desktop with 16 GB of Ram

SSD

100mb fast internet

I'm pretty sure it's not my setup. 

Sounds good. When it is a desktop, do you use LAN or WiFi to connect to your router ?

If it is WiFi (especially if it is 2.4 GHz), can you try by ethernet cable ?

Note size: When I look at other threads note size plays a role. There is not THE note that is too large, this depends on the local setup, but it seems to influence performance.

Since I am on a Mac, things are not 1:1 comparable. EN v10 is slower than EN legacy, but in my case not by much. Since legacy runs from a local database this is no surprise. V10 is for me snappy enough for everything I throw at it.

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So it seems a good number of long-time paying EN users are currently unsatisfied with V10. Me included. During the update, two months worth of data appeared to have disappeared ... spent like three hours on this, finally got the data back. Tried a few simple operations, and well, performance is such that I'm now in the market for alternatives.

While I'll be investigating where to move my ~8 years worth of personal data to (paperless home, stupid me trusted in EN to keep my data safe), let me ask:

Is it safe to log out of and delete EN10, then re-install the most recent 6. something Windows version? With my personal data still there?

Do I need to be concerned about e.g. the Android client while reverting back on Windows?

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7 minutes ago, w8rn8r said:

... Is it safe to log out of and delete EN10, then re-install the most recent 6. something Windows version? With my personal data still there? ...

Yes - your data is stored on server site. As long as you did not use any new EN10-Features like Tasks (but there are not other new features IMHO), you can (and should) go back to EN-Legacy version.

For Android there is no Legacy version available. But your data are on server site. You may work with you data on windows and view them on Android. You even can modify your Notes on Android but you will find it awsome slow - so I recommend only to try to view them there 😉

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7 minutes ago, w8rn8r said:

Is it safe to log out of and delete EN10, then re-install the most recent 6. something Windows version? With my personal data still there?

Do I need to be concerned about e.g. the Android client while reverting back on Windows?

Yes, you can even run the legacy version of Evernote alongside v10. They operate with separate data files and directories so you can do some operations in legacy and others in v10. The only thing to be cautious of is working on the same note in both versions simultaneously since this can create duplicate notes which end up out of sync.

Since all versions of Evernote use the cloud as the authoritative repository you can switch to the Android client, or for that matter, any other including the web interface. Web is the usual place to check that data hasn't really been lost rather then not displaying in v10.

Since legacy is with us for the time being you have time to make decisions.

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20 minutes ago, w8rn8r said:

Is it safe to log out of and delete EN10, then re-install the most recent 6. something Windows version? With my personal data still there?

Do I need to be concerned about e.g. the Android client while reverting back on Windows?

Your data is safe.  Use something like Revo Uninstaller to completely remove V10 from your machine.  I would recommend going to FileHippo and getting 6.25.1, the last actual version before V10.  There are some slight adjustments in 6.25.2.  Per the above I am still using 6.25.1, enjoying its speed and clarity.

EDIT:  Of course if you have any local notes you need to export those, preferably by notebook, so as to be able to import them after the 6.25 install.,

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  • Level 5

Personally I would install the legacy client, not a regular older client version.

All older clients will try to update, so you must always remember not to click on that button. Legacy is the same software as 6.25 Win / 7.14 Mac, but does not ask for an update.

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