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Cannot edit documents attached to notes

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#1 dan7000

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Posted 10 April 2012 - 12:19 AM

I don't see anything about this in the forum so far. Am I missing something, or is it impossible to edit documents attached to notes in Android? And if so, is that feature planned for the future?

Here's what happens for me:
1. On Windows, create a new note.
2. drop a word document into the new note
3. sync.
4. on android, open the note.
5. optional: tap the editing icon to go into edit mode.
6. open the document, and edit it (I'm using QuickOffice Pro) and save it.
7. if in edit mode, click "done" - you will get the message "note not changed"
8. reopen the document.
RESULT: changes were not saved.

Anything I can do to get this to work?

#2 gazumped

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Posted 10 April 2012 - 09:43 AM

Editing attachments needs the underlying software to be installed on your client - if you edit a Word attachment on your desktop, you're using Word on the computer to make changes. There's no Word for Android, hence the problem. You could cut and paste the content of your Word document into a note and then edit the note. This isn't an Evernote issue as such, and EN don't advertise upcoming features so you'll have to look for a work-around.

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#3 dan7000

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Posted 10 April 2012 - 05:21 PM

Perhaps I wasn't clear.

I can edit the attachments. I can edit them and save them on my SD card. I have at least 4 apps on my Android tablet that allow me to edit and save Word documents. When I double-tap a Word attachment in EN/Android, it opens the document for editing, just as it should. But even though I edit and save the document, the saved version of the document is not reflected in the EN attachment.

This is an EN Android issue. For EN for Windows, EN updates the attachment after it is edited and saved. That doesn't happen in EN for Android.

#4 dan7000

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Posted 10 April 2012 - 10:02 PM

Re workarounds: Clearly, copying Word content into an EN note does not work. You lose all the formatting, and I am talking about 50 page documents.

My current workaround is to use SugarSync to sync a folder of documents to my tablet, where I can edit them (preserving formatting, etc), and then sync them back to my desktop. But I would rather use Evernote because EN does a better job of sync and, of course, gives me powerful searching and tagging.

It sounds like for now -- unless someone else has better info -- my only solution is to not use EN for attachments, and stick with SugarSync. But I would like to hear from EN about why we would even have attachments in notes if edits to the attachments are not saved. It seems like more of a bug than a missing feature.

#5 borets

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Posted 11 April 2012 - 02:50 AM

Try saving an attachment to SD card, changing it, then attaching it back to the note (you may keep the old file just in case, if you want).
Samsung Captivate, Cyanogenmod 9, Android 4.0.3

#6 dan7000

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Posted 11 April 2012 - 08:49 PM

Try saving an attachment to SD card, changing it, then attaching it back to the note (you may keep the old file just in case, if you want).


That works, but it's less convenient than using email to email myself the attachment, edit it, and then email it back to myself (or email it to evernote). EN's value proposition is about giving me all my data on all my devices, always in sync - so I don't have to do things like have multiple copies of different attachments flying around.

#7 gmc

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Posted 18 April 2012 - 04:04 AM

I agree with dan7000 -- regarding the utility of editing in EN (or with one support app) and avoiding all the other file gyrations.

One should be able to edit an attachment on your device as long as you have an appropriate app installed. I have Docs To Go (which I bought specifically for this function), when I edit a note it opens attachment.doc. I perform my edit, save, answer yes to "doc exists, overwrite?" Then re-open the note and find that the change has not taken. This works fine from the desk. Why not from the phone??

I became a premium member a few months ago assuming that I'd be able to figure this out, or it would be resolved in short order. Any other ideas?

Moto X


#8 witchseason

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Posted 20 April 2012 - 09:02 AM

Can't help but agree with the last poster. I too became a premium member on the promise of being able to embed (e.g. Word) files in notes and edit them on multiple devices - nowhere was it made clear that this did not work on Android (does it work on iPhone?). I understand the problem and limitations, not saying it's necessarily Evernote's problem, but it is something I feel I was promised and have not been given.

I have Documents To Go and QuickOffice on my Android, either of which can open, edit and save Word documents stored in the filing system, so the problem is not the lack of an appropriate editor.

Part of the reason I want to do this is because I have personal and sensitive info that I want to password protect, but I also want to be able to edit this on my phone. It's just notes, doesn't need to have complex formatting, but since the Evernote text encryption feature only works on Windows (can't edit & re-encrypt on Android) I had hoped that I could embed a password-protected Word file instead and edit this both ends. Nope.

Please advise if either of these issues are likely to be addressed and/or fixed in the near future as without some way of being able to edit sensitive (i.e. encrypted) info on my phone the usefulness - for my purposes, at least - is limited.

Thanks

#9 indrex

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Posted 29 July 2012 - 05:25 PM

When I made switch from dropbox (free account) to a premium evernote account, I had no idea I will still have to use dropbox to sync office files across devices. Why evernote can't put this to work speaks tons of why it is not a serious cloud player.

#10 gazumped

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Posted 29 July 2012 - 05:41 PM

"not a serious cloud player" - with 30M users and a significant number of Premium accounts, I think they're struggling along pretty well.

"still have to use dropbox to sync office files across devices" You can't edit a Word document in DropBox any more than you can in Evernote. You can embed a file in Evernote to be opened on another machine in exactly the same way that you can in DropBox.

-I think we all have to make our own judgement whether or not to stay with Evernote.. I actually use both, as well as Office, to work in multiple locations; it works pretty well for me..

I use Evernote constantly but don't speak for them.  Opinions here are my own based (more or less) on age,  experience,  and common business sense.  

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#11 GrumpyMonkey

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Posted 29 July 2012 - 06:48 PM

When I made switch from dropbox (free account) to a premium evernote account, I had no idea I will still have to use dropbox to sync office files across devices. Why evernote can't put this to work speaks tons of why it is not a serious cloud player.


Hi. Welcome to the forums!

I think Gaz has already responded, but I'll just add that you can always contact Evernote (see my signature below) and ask for a refund if you are not satisfied with the service. They are very vocal about wanting users to stay, and not pushing users to pay.

As for Dropbox and Evernote, they are very different services. Dropbox is more like a virtual thumbdrive in the sky that aims (I guess) to make you more productive. Evernote is your external brain, and it aims to make you smarter. This has taken the two companies in very different directions. In general, in the case of files produced with Word and other applications, I have found that Dropbox works best for works in progress, and Evernote works best for completed projects. This goes along with the idea of "remembering" everything.

#12 GaryLKing

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Posted 29 July 2012 - 08:46 PM

I asked about this on the forums a long time ago. I believe it was Android 2.3.4.

An Evernote employee responded that there was a problem storing the file back to the note. You could share a file into a new note, but not return it to a note in it's new state.

I seem to remember the onus being placed on android.

Regards,

Gary

#13 indrex

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Posted 30 July 2012 - 06:03 AM

"not a serious cloud player" - with 30M users and a significant number of Premium accounts, I think they're struggling along pretty well.


Ask this question to anyone: "Name major personal cloud services" Answer: "Dropbox, Google Drive, Amazon Cloud, Windows Sky Drive, iCloud". Tell me if anyone names evernote.

"still have to use dropbox to sync office files across devices" You can't edit a Word document in DropBox any more than you can in Evernote. You can embed a file in Evernote to be opened on another machine in exactly the same way that you can in DropBox.


I can edit, I can't save it back to the original notes. Not at all "exactly" like Dropbox. Not at all. Really, have you used evernote and dropbox on android? Any file hosted on dropbox can be edited and saved as it is. Evernote files don't save back. The office app simply asks where to save the edited file. It is like not having "Save" command, it just has a "Save As..." command.

#14 indrex

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Posted 30 July 2012 - 06:13 AM


When I made switch from dropbox (free account) to a premium evernote account, I had no idea I will still have to use dropbox to sync office files across devices. Why evernote can't put this to work speaks tons of why it is not a serious cloud player.


Hi. Welcome to the forums!

I think Gaz has already responded, but I'll just add that you can always contact Evernote (see my signature below) and ask for a refund if you are not satisfied with the service. They are very vocal about wanting users to stay, and not pushing users to pay.

As for Dropbox and Evernote, they are very different services. Dropbox is more like a virtual thumbdrive in the sky that aims (I guess) to make you more productive. Evernote is your external brain, and it aims to make you smarter. This has taken the two companies in very different directions. In general, in the case of files produced with Word and other applications, I have found that Dropbox works best for works in progress, and Evernote works best for completed projects. This goes along with the idea of "remembering" everything.



1. I am not seeking refund. I just need it to work. Is ability to edit an .xls file too much to ask? ;)
2. Using evernote as a place to hold completed projects is a sham. What makes completed projects redundant for editing? If I filed a "completed project" into a notes with .xls spreadsheet that uses foreign currencies, it has to be edited after a while when the exchange rates change. The project is never complete.
3. I don't really want to use dropbox. It is primitive when it comes to search and tagging. There is no OCR, and saving webpages or clips is not possible. I use Evernote for all these. That means 90% of the docs are on evernote. All I ask is, why is Evernote making me to use DropBox for the remaining 10%? Figure it out guys.

#15 GrumpyMonkey

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Posted 30 July 2012 - 10:25 AM



When I made switch from dropbox (free account) to a premium evernote account, I had no idea I will still have to use dropbox to sync office files across devices. Why evernote can't put this to work speaks tons of why it is not a serious cloud player.


Hi. Welcome to the forums!

I think Gaz has already responded, but I'll just add that you can always contact Evernote (see my signature below) and ask for a refund if you are not satisfied with the service. They are very vocal about wanting users to stay, and not pushing users to pay.

As for Dropbox and Evernote, they are very different services. Dropbox is more like a virtual thumbdrive in the sky that aims (I guess) to make you more productive. Evernote is your external brain, and it aims to make you smarter. This has taken the two companies in very different directions. In general, in the case of files produced with Word and other applications, I have found that Dropbox works best for works in progress, and Evernote works best for completed projects. This goes along with the idea of "remembering" everything.



1. I am not seeking refund. I just need it to work. Is ability to edit an .xls file too much to ask? ;)
2. Using evernote as a place to hold completed projects is a sham. What makes completed projects redundant for editing? If I filed a "completed project" into a notes with .xls spreadsheet that uses foreign currencies, it has to be edited after a while when the exchange rates change. The project is never complete.
3. I don't really want to use dropbox. It is primitive when it comes to search and tagging. There is no OCR, and saving webpages or clips is not possible. I use Evernote for all these. That means 90% of the docs are on evernote. All I ask is, why is Evernote making me to use DropBox for the remaining 10%? Figure it out guys.


Hi.

1. Evernote works quite well, but it just doesn't do what you want yet on Android. You do have the ability to edit an .xls file, but I think it is no surprise that Evernote doesn't code that into their app, and relies on third party applications (in the case of Excel, Microsoft would usually be the one) to handle opening and editing a note. Eventually (maybe even already with some file types) you will be able to open a file, edit it, and save it back into Evernote on Android. Currently, though, this is primarily a feature found on the desktop clients (a few exceptions in iOS).

2. I don't know what you mean by it being a "sham." I've been using it this way for years (as have others) and it works pretty well. I have a lot of "completed" projects that occasionally require future editing. What I do in those cases is save a copy of the original file type (so I can open it again for editing) and a PDF copy of the file (this makes the content searchable -- Evernote will not index the content of .xls files). When I want to edit it, I usually create a new note and follow the same procedure. Why a new note? I get charged the upload amount either way (editing the file or creating a new note), so I might as well keep a copy of the old version. Evernote's CEO has even publicly stated that he uses Dropbox and that he likes the app, so I don't think it should come as any surprise that the services complement, rather than compete with one another in this regard.

3. I actually think Dropbox is a very well-designed app. But, it isn't meant to make you smarter (tagging and searching). It makes you more productive. Dropbox gives you a pre-determined virtual space to move files in and out of as much as you'd like. Evernote gives you an upload limit each month. They are different models, and the first one is conducive to ongoing projects, while the second one is more conducive to completed ones. I recommend you draw upon the strength of each app and use the most appropriate one for your use case.

I get what you are saying. It would be really cool if Evernote was an uber-app that did everything for us, but that is not what it is, and I don't think that is what they are trying to be. Evernote aims to help you "remember everything," and that usually translates into storing your memories (attachments containing things you have already done), rather than editing your memories. Text notes are the obvious exception to this. You might be able to convince Evernote to change their service model and do native editing of all sorts of file types, but I think they will leave that to other developers. You might convince Evernote to take over the features of Dropbox, but I think they will probably not do it. Over time we may eventually get the ability to edit .xls files on the Android and save them back into the same note. But, today we have what we have, and it is exactly what Evernote advertises. So, I'd recommend a mix of Evernote and Dropbox.

Alternatively (I have not tried these), there are apps in the Evernote Trunk that promise integrations between Dropbox and Evernote. I am unfamiliar with the details, but these may be worth exploring. My impression is that this probably works best on desktops, but there may be something there for Android users as well. See http://evernote.com/...ce=desktop_page and http://evernote.com/...ce=desktop_page

#16 indrex

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Posted 30 July 2012 - 10:53 AM

Have to agree. This is a tight reply. No loose ends. This is quite a mature forum. Though I didn't find a resolution, my understanding of cloud services did improve.

So, closing remarks on this thread: Evernote to remember, Dropbox to work.


(yes, if they still figure out a way to edit, I am all in for hosting 100% of my life on single cloud)

#17 indrex

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Posted 30 July 2012 - 11:00 AM

PS: by "sham" I meant to target the general statement which says evernote is for completed projects- as explained in my example where currencies exchange rates change.
But you did explain it well. Thanks.

PS 2: it does in iOS?? If evernote doesn't want to be such a service, why do it in iOS?
Does that mean Android is just a pending item in their to-do list?
Evernote Food and Evernote Hello arrived on android much after they did on iOS, may be this editing feature will too? (just being hopeful)

#18 amer

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Posted 30 July 2012 - 12:02 PM

It would be brilliant if Evernote on Android could handle attachments as on Windows. I have hundreds on PDF articles in my Evernote database and I regularly edit them. It really works like a charm in the Windows client - you just open a pdf, edit it, save it and changes get synced. Lack of this feature in the Adroid client makes Evernote almost useless for a serious use for me. And this is the main reason preventing me to get an Android tablet (or iPad).

As far as I know, this is due to the limitations in Android OS (and iOS too) so I am not holding my breath on seeing this feature implemented.

#19 GrumpyMonkey

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Posted 30 July 2012 - 12:04 PM

PS: by "sham" I meant to target the general statement which says evernote is for completed projects- as explained in my example where currencies exchange rates change.
But you did explain it well. Thanks.

PS 2: it does in iOS?? If evernote doesn't want to be such a service, why do it in iOS?
Does that mean Android is just a pending item in their to-do list?
Evernote Food and Evernote Hello arrived on android much after they did on iOS, may be this editing feature will too? (just being hopeful)


Thanks for the kind words about my post :)

Regarding iOS, though, I think my post could have been better written. Basically, Evernote does not contain the code necessary to open and edit Word, Excel, PowerPoint, etc on any of its clients (as far as I know). Instead, it relies on third-party programs to open those files. In the case of Word, Excel, and PowerPoint, if you have Microsoft Office installed on your desktop, then Evernote will see that and use the appropriate program to open the file. They call this the "live update" feature.

So, why doesn't this "live update" feature work on Android and iOS? Well, for one thing, you don't have Microsoft Office on either platform. On iOS, QuickOffice Pro has somehow managed to code around this and provide iOS users with the ability not only to edit Microsoft files, but also to use the live update feature (http://evernote.com/...rce=mobile_page). It is far from perfect (no footnotes makes it unusable for me, I am afraid, and in my last communication with the developers, they do not plan to include them). I don't know if Evernote had much to do with this, but my guess would be that they would welcome anyone on any platform who wants to integrate with Evernote :)

By the way, one thing to note is that when you make a change to an attachment, you have to re-upload the entire thing to Evernote's servers, so in terms of the upload amount, it is the same whether you use the "live update" feature or create a brand new note. Even though I occasionally use the live update feature as well, more often than not, I just make a new version of the note. You get to keep "backups" of the orignal file this way, so it works pretty well in practice, even without the live update on Android or iOS.

#20 indrex

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Posted 30 July 2012 - 12:23 PM


...
...
By the way, one thing to note is that when you make a change to an attachment, you have to re-upload the entire thing to Evernote's servers, so in terms of the upload amount, it is the same whether you use the "live update" feature or create a brand new note. Even though I occasionally use the live update feature as well, more often than not, I just make a new version of the note. You get to keep "backups" of the orignal file this way, so it works pretty well in practice, even without the live update on Android or iOS.


1GB/month is more than I need in most of the billing cycles- I don't have to bother about data upload limits.
Backups are fine except when the excel file is a part of a long notes containing text, images, clips etc apart from the embedded .xls file. In that case, creating a new note just for updated .xls file is not the same as having a live update.

Kingsoft Office (https://play.google....ffice_eng&hl=en) is the most well-built office client with more advanced feature set including send to evernote. May be, they can add a workaround to enable "Live Update" to evernote files. I will mail the devs with a link to this thread. They already are providing evernote features, so they are the one most familiar with evernote among the office app devs on android.

I am spending good deal of my productive time here on this forum- just in hope one day Evernote becomes the only cloud. Long shot but worth the time.





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